How far gone must a pony be for you to decide that it's a bait?

[st4rdr34mz]

Not sure if this question has been asked before, I'm just curious because I'm going to make my first custom, how bad must a pony be for you to decide it's a bait? How far are you willing to go to save a pony?

[SunPony]

Well, the rarity/generation of the pony plays into it a lot.  Most people will bait a G3 in a certain condition but not a G1 in the same condition, just because G3s are easier to find/more are available.  Likewise, folks would try to restore/repair a Mimic rather than bait her even if she is in really rough shape - but a regular concave-foot Peachy would be more likely to be considered bait in the same condition.  For G4, I think any major release of the mane 6 would be fair game regardless of condition, and many other characters that were produced in large numbers (such as Lyra Heartstrings) due to how common they are. 

Of course people's opinions vary - one person's bait is another person's collectible!  This was my own opinion.

[Griffin]

This is a question that gets discussed pretty regularly because it's a difficult one and there are no right or wrong answers. Ultimately, only you can decide what to do with your ponies.

SunPony already covered the gist of the issue. I personally make the decision case by case... How common is the pony, how severe the damage? Do I know how to repair the damage, can I be bothered to do it? Some people do amazing restoration jobs, I consider my own skills in this area to be only average. I can and will do simple restoration jobs like cleaning and rehairing, but as a collector I also value originality, and I try to refrain from paint touch-ups and other restorative techniques which are hard or impossible to reverse. I will rather accept the pony with its faults and look for an upgrade. For the most part, any more "intrusive" restoration techniques are equal to customising in my opinion (extensive paint repair, remoulded limbs, etc.). At this stage I would rather use the pony to make something unique instead of a "sub-par" version of its former self. And yet, if it was a rare or HTF pony, I perhaps would recommend restoration nevertheless, to retain a piece of cultural history. And I totally understand if other collectors would prefer this option even if it was a common pony. But I also understand those who will see the item for what it is: a children's toy in a sorry state. As much as we collectors love our ponies, they are not Ming vases or ancient manuscripts. Yes, you can apply similar ethics to both (and to some extent I do) but ponies are still mass-produced items meant for a temporary enjoyment. Undoubtedly interesting for future researchers (if such will exist) but it's not like we need to preserve every single one. Still, I think it would be incredibly silly to customise a rare collectible which could undoubtedly be sold even in a poor condition.

Okay, that's the ethical part. From a practical point of view, see my questions above... I use those to guide my decision, especially if it's a G1 pony. For me a "baity" pony has a combination of issues. Bad hair but good body = not baity because it can be rehaired, although that is sort of customisation too (alternate rehairs especially). A few cancer spots, pen marks, or bite marks but otherwise good = not baity, some collectors may still value it and I have such ponies in my own collection. Severe cancer or marks = usually custom bait in my books, especially if combined with other issues (bad hair etc.). Same if the symbols are almost or completely gone, esp. combined with other issues. If it's a G4 pony, bad hair may be enough to make it baity for me but again, depends on which pony it is, like SunPony said. These days I will sometimes also buy ponies off the shelf to customise.

[banditpony]

I might be different then most...but bait to me means poor condition.. and the pony would have 2+ severe issues.. like large deterioration spots, hair completely damaged, chews/cuts in the plastic etc.

Anything that can be used for a custom, could also be restored. I think that's where people take the rarity of the pony into account. Like someone is going to be less likely to restore a cotton candy then they are a rapunzel.

However, if I were to customize a pony, I'd first look at the HQG1 ponies or basic fun ponies before destroying a vintage pony. Those options didn't exist 10 years ago, but they do now.

ETA:
Oh, and I tend to have the belief "it's your item, do what you want with it", but when we have alternative options these days with the newer remakes, it's a bit hard not to be feel a tiny bit sad there's one less vintage pony out there... but then again.. eh.  I'm not overall too fussed about the issue.

[lovesbabysquirmy]

Check this out:
http://mylittlewiki.org/wiki/Bait

also if you search "bait" over the last few months, we have this question come up pretty frequently

remember there are HQG1C ponies in the G1 mold that you can buy as bases

[Featherwurm]

Ultimately - you buy the pony, you get to decide its fate.  You get to draw the line between collection and creativity.  If you want to customize a mint Rapunzel?  If you bought her, that is totally on you (now I know a lot of collectors would have a heart attack... but that's their issue, not yours.)

In every collector vs. customizer group I've been in (MLP, MH, BJD) people will argue 'till they're blue in the face over whether creativity comes first on these mass-produced commercial items, or if collectiblity comes first, not wanting to change a single thing about the manufacturer's original intent.  There's value to each side - collectors have a quantifiable value on their side, and a clear-cut way of doing business.  In this curative way it is possible to amass a pristine collection with comparable collection goals to others.  Customizers have creativity on their side, and the value of artwork and creation.  The creator approach allows a collection to completely fit the wishes and desires of the person collecting, and everything can be then done to their tastes and whim.

Anywho... that was a tangent.  Personally I tend to take a middle ground.  I certainly wouldn't bait a good condition pony just for the particular mold it had, I would trade or wait for something more suitably degraded to pop up if I needed a certain pony for a custom.  But generally, I'm not creating customs based on a preconceived plan.  I tend to be sympathetic to the damage the pony has for what I plan to do to customize it.  I bear in mind that any permanent damage to a pony (symbol rubs, hair cuts, nibbles, etc) decreases their value and interest to the collector, and allow that to temper my decisions about how I will either customize or restore a pony.  To me, personally, fairly clear reasons to bait a pony are any of these that are clearly visible while the pony is on display (and that are difficult to completely and non-destructively restore):

- Severe hair cuts or missing hair
- Nibbles/chews/body damage
- Symbols/eyes/paint severely damaged or missing
- Severe discoloration (such as extensive regrind, stains, bleaching, and pen marks that cannot be sunfaded)
- Any major damage to mechanisms or loss of components (such as the princess pony or precious pocket pony 'symbols', or secret surprise pony saddles)

Granted even these depend on the pickiness of the collector - I'm not a picky collector, so I don't mind some of these things showing up in my own collection (my Locket, for example, has clear teeth marks).  But when it comes to making something that may return to the market, I tend to be either transparent in my restorations or go a custom route to ensure there is no confusion (such as alternate re-hairs.)

When it comes to letting the damage guide the customization I tend to follow this route -
Damaged or lost hair = alternate rehair
Damaged or lost paint (eyes, symbols, etc) = New versions of these or a variation on the original
Body damage (physical damage or related to discoloration) = Full custom

I mean there's more nuance to my decisions, but that's the gist anyway.

But again, at the end of the day - your dollar, your decision, and I think it's very important to not bully people out of their own creative endeavors.

[tailrustedtealeaf]

I won't even bait normal Mane 6 releases unless there are large, intrusive irremovable marks. The only FBR custom I've done thus far had a sharpie stain on their neck, and another with yellowed adhesive stains. I've got a Rainbow Dash now with pen all over her face...I'm very against baiting G1 because they seem to scarce to me, but I know not a lot of people share the same opinion. If you were to post a picture of the pony, perhaps we can weigh in our thoughts.

[Zapper]

It must be destroyed beyond repair for me if it's a G1. I have a single baity G1 in my cuszom bjn right now and she is a rock solid, yellow turned brown Confetti with the confetti bits merged and fused into her plastic. You simply can't save a girl like that anymore, imo. She looks like she's got dirt embedded into her, nevermind she has hardened so much you can't even reroot her the normal way anymore.

Baity G2s for me are those with ratty mane and tail, those are good reroot victims and sometimes repaint victims when their plastic is too discolored.

G3 and G4 if they are super common or have ratty hair. Especially for G4: if they are Mane Six. G3 if they are a Pinkie Pie, lol.

[Blackness]

I'm probably going to drive a few collector's crazy with my opinion here lol! I only collect and customise G1 ponies.

I'm not a serious collector, I have around 20 - 30 G1 ponies (mostly from my childhood) that I will keep forever but the rest are fair game for customising. Took a photo recently of my 'bait pile' - I suppose many of them could be restored quite easily but I don't have the time or motivation, it takes me long enough to finish a custom as it is

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My customs are not fully painted or dyed, I work with the original pony colour so the less cancer spots and stains the better. To be honest I never really considered that I might be annoying people in the pony community by customising lightly damaged G1's! Each to their own I guess

[BlackCurtains]

Yeah, I'm with Blackness on this one (I'm jealous of your Sand Digger!).

I collect all gens but most of my baits are G1 and G3. Personally, I like working with G3 the most but have made plenty of G1 customs. I've done restorations too but the pony has to be a real challenge for me to do a restore vs custom. I've mainly restored Argies which people frown on even restoring Nirvanas so... *shrug*

That said, I have also saved plenty of "bait" ponies who really weren't. My best example is a SS Truly with luscious flocking and original curl. Not sure why she was considered bait to begin with. She's part of my collection now.

In short, it really depends more on my motivation and mood that drives what I will bait and what I will save/restore. No one here is baiting Mimics and Ice Crystals and if they are, laugh at them, because there is no way they are selling a custom for more than the pony even in bad condition.

[SunPony]

remember there are HQG1C ponies in the G1 mold that you can buy as bases

I've been looking into this, but those are brand new, beautifully-designed ponies in excellent condition that aren't even produced in that large of numbers - shouldn't we be preserving them?  Or is it okay to bait then simply because they aren't produced by hasbro? Also, they seem a bit pricey to use as a bait.

[BlackCurtains]

remember there are HQG1C ponies in the G1 mold that you can buy as bases

I've been looking into this, but those are brand new, beautifully-designed ponies in excellent condition that aren't even produced in that large of numbers - shouldn't we be preserving them?  Or is it okay to bait then simply because they aren't produced by hasbro? Also, they seem a bit pricey to use as a bait.

They sell blanks too at one of the shops. Each shop carries different stock as far as I can tell, which is both confusing and annoying. I agree they are expensive, even the blanks are more than I'd like to pay unless I want a pure white, black or sparkle base (the sparkle ones are really cool).

[gemini_pony]

remember there are HQG1C ponies in the G1 mold that you can buy as bases

I've been looking into this, but those are brand new, beautifully-designed ponies in excellent condition that aren't even produced in that large of numbers - shouldn't we be preserving them?  Or is it okay to bait then simply because they aren't produced by hasbro? Also, they seem a bit pricey to use as a bait.

They sell blanks too at one of the shops. Each shop carries different stock as far as I can tell, which is both confusing and annoying. I agree they are expensive, even the blanks are more than I'd like to pay unless I want a pure white, black or sparkle base (the sparkle ones are really cool).

I can't afford them though. I can get bait G1s cheaper.  I can usually only buy stuff  like every couple months.

[SunPony]

remember there are HQG1C ponies in the G1 mold that you can buy as bases

I've been looking into this, but those are brand new, beautifully-designed ponies in excellent condition that aren't even produced in that large of numbers - shouldn't we be preserving them?  Or is it okay to bait then simply because they aren't produced by hasbro? Also, they seem a bit pricey to use as a bait.

They sell blanks too at one of the shops. Each shop carries different stock as far as I can tell, which is both confusing and annoying. I agree they are expensive, even the blanks are more than I'd like to pay unless I want a pure white, black or sparkle base (the sparkle ones are really cool).

Oh, maybe I haven't looked at the right shop then?  Can you tell me which one?

[Blackness]

Yeah, I'm with Blackness on this one (I'm jealous of your Sand Digger!).

That said, I have also saved plenty of "bait" ponies who really weren't. My best example is a SS Truly with luscious flocking and original curl. Not sure why she was considered bait to begin with. She's part of my collection now.

Thanks BlackCurtains! Glad I'm not the only one customising whatever I feel like with no guilt hahaha. Not sure what will become of Sand Digger lol, she has heavy graffiti on her rump. I was hoping to make a Sun and Moon themed pair of customs but if I can't remove the stains she might become a merpony or something instead.

As I said earlier, I'm not heavily into collecting, I generally keep the ponies that I loved as a child and don't worry too much about how rare or valuable a certain pony might be - but I will always check these things online before I start ripping a G1 apart for a custom. Some of my baits are double-ups, like Baby Pineapple, Beach Ball and Steamer (even I hesitate before customising a Big Brother!!). Just realised though someone on here might want to take Chocolate Delight off my hands to collect, she's in good condition?

I haven't had to buy ponies for a while (thankfully - is it just me in Australia or are ponies getting more expensive by the day?!) but I generally look for bulk bait ponies and sometimes you get lucky and find a 'bait' that isn't really baity at all.. I've had a look at the HQG1C ponies before but can't justify spending that much on a bait pony, especially with international shipping costs