"G1.5" ...?

[lovesbabysquirmy]

I find it so rude and hurtful that people of the last couple of years would come and redefine what has been established within the collectioncommunity for almost 20 years. Have the word 'research" gone out the window?

This is why my head hurts so much.  Seriously... there was no reason to "Create Their Own Community".  They were more than welcome to join the more than 20,000 people who already call them selves "My Little Pony Collectors".  We have a vast wealth of information to offer... why it has been mostly disregarded in favor of a fanon-centric view loosely based on a currently-airing television show is beyond me.

I sure appreciate all the newer collectors who have joined the Arena and shared their opinions and love of MLP with us, while learning a TON about their favorite collectible.  We are STILL learning new things all the time about MLP!  I think you're all in great company and I hope you make friendships here because...  wait for it.... Friendship IS Magic!  But only if you reach out and let those people BE your friends. 

[Malicieuse]

That's why she liked MLP, because it stood out from the other shows, and didn't do things like this (I don't know what her view on Jem is). That's the impression I get from it, and the way FIM is just too full of shout-outs to the classics to be made by a hater.

In true brony-fashion they took what someone said at face value, and then ran with it.

She did not like the MLP cartoon.  I've never seen her say anywhere that she liked the cartoon, and have seen her say several times that she disliked it, that she found it boring, and that she preferred the stories she made up herself as a kid.

Which kind of makes my point about My Little Pony being a toyline with an animated commercial--that someone who thought the cartoon was dumb could still love My Little Pony as a WHOLE enough to devote a lot of time to making a show about it.

The MLP cartoons were such a tiny, tiny part of G1.  It was all about the toys.

Yet she still used Posey and Surprise. I always found that kind of funny.

[LadyMoondancer]

Posey is really not much like Fluttershy.  Fluttershy loves animals.  Posey gave a caterpillar a death glare because she thought it was going to eat her flowers.  Fluttershy is shy.  Despite her squeaky voice, Posey is generally willing to say exactly what she thinks.  (For example, "You tried to hurt the Flories and trashed my garden, so it serves you right that we're locking you up.")

Posey never does "the Stare", unless you mean the thing with the caterpillar.  But I mean . . . it was just a mean look.  Most G1 characters have glared at something at one point or another.

Yet she still used Posey and Surprise. I always found that kind of funny.

I imagine she had the toys of them.

Good point about her toy collection, Al.  Yeah, I remember she had Ember, Sprinkles, and a lot of other Year 2 / Year 3 ponies.  Which means she probably had most of them before the show ever started.

[Al-1701]

I actually think Posey and Fluttershy would hate each other if they met.  Bats practically cements this as I could see Posey chanting "Death to the bats."

[LadyMoondancer]

When you think about it, Posey is actually kind of like Poison Ivy from Batman!  This only makes me love her more.

[Al-1701]

When you think about it, Posey is actually kind of like Poison Ivy from Batman!  This only makes me love her more.

Now we just need the fan art.

And this thread is so far off the rails I don't even see them anymore.

Uh...calling Tales G1.5 bad.

[lonewolf]

Slightly OT - you guys who also hang out on Brony forums - is there anyone who neglects the fact that Tirek was originally a G1 villain? *sudden curiosity*

From what I have seen, many FiM fans that are discussing those episodes in forums do remark that Tirek was from the old cartoons.

They even acknowlege Scorpan was a G1 character (I've seen new art of him and Tirek).

I do find it annoying they go by shows instead of toys when it comes to generations.

[MJNSEIFER]

She did not like the MLP cartoon.  I've never seen her say anywhere that she liked the cartoon, and have seen her say several times that she disliked it, that she found it boring, and that she preferred the stories she made up herself as a kid.

Which kind of makes my point about My Little Pony being a toyline with an animated commercial--that someone who thought the cartoon was dumb could still love My Little Pony as a WHOLE enough to devote a lot of time to making a show about it.

I am sure that I have seen her say, or imply that she likes the show, to some extent.  But there is a chance that she may have liked it later on, no offense, but I can remember her saying that she got some inspiration from the show as well as the toys (this includes for her "stories").  She defenitely like the show more than most bronies would want to admit anyway.

All I know is that, someone is throwing tons of shout-outs to classic MLP in FIM, and Lauren is the prime suspect, as they were more frequent in season 1 and 2 when she was running things more.  Though if it turned out that she didn't like the shows, it's pretty credit to her (if it is her doing it) to include all the shout-outs she did if it was for the fans alone, and not her.  That said, I am very sure I saw it somewhere that she likes the show, and it seems a bit too much of a coincidence that some of her original mane six are closer to the show, than they are the toys (and some are closer to the toys, and some the comics - ironically it seems to be only Applejack that changed completely in terms of personality.) She did what I plan to do more of, she took her inspiration from all sides.

That said, I understand what you're saying about MLP being a toyline first, and agree with that.  I began with the shows, so I will always think of them first, but I agree that it's more a toyline, and will always take notice/inspiration from all of them.


And I agree with Sapphire-Light on the Posey thing (Firefly and Surprise were also close to their G1 selves, with changes that I have already explained).

Posey is really not much like Fluttershy.  Fluttershy loves animals.  Posey gave a caterpillar a death glare because she thought it was going to eat her flowers.  Fluttershy is shy.  Despite her squeaky voice, Posey is generally willing to say exactly what she thinks.  (For example, "You tried to hurt the Flories and trashed my garden, so it serves you right that we're locking you up.")

Lauren chose to make Posey shy because she is shy.  She wanted a character to show children that it's okay to be shy, and that you can learn to still be shy, but not a push-over, because she's had to deal with it herself. 

Fluttershy and Posey are pretty close as they are the kind-hearted and caring ones of their groups.  I am sure that when Lauren planned the show Posey would have been a gardener just like she was in G1, but for some reason it was changed to animals when she became Fluttershy.  I'm actually pleased she did this, as the kind pony being a gardener has already been repeated in G3 (despite the fact that I adore that pony) so it was a nice change to have a pony that cares about animals (though, I may be biased as I find "caring about animals" to be an adorable character trait).

I think that "stare" was inspiration for The Stare myself, it could be a coincidence, but it could also not be.

Also Fluttershy is capable of "saying what she thinks" when push comes to shove (which is also the point of her character) so she comes closer to Posey in those places.  You can find moments when they come close to their G1 selves in all of the mane six (and this time, including Applejack) at times.  I am unsure of Twilight and Sparkler, but the latter is closer to the toyline, and I will check about the former.

Either way, someone has put a lot of pre-G4 shout outs in the Lauren-Era of FIM, and this includes the shows as well.

I am not intending to start a fight, so I will probably end it here, unless I really need to respond (I tend to get overly passionate about things, I'm afraid, but I am trying to be more careful).  I am planning on compyling a list to all of the pre-G4 shout-outs I have seen in FIM, and the majority of them are in the Lauren-Era (and are closer to what they are in the previous gens, barring the G3-ish mane six with G1-ish personalities).

I will do it as it's own post though, there's no need for me to derail this post more than I already have.
 

I actually think Posey and Fluttershy would hate each other if they met.  Bats practically cements this as I could see Posey chanting "Death to the bats."

They'd probably dissagree about it, but I think they'd ultimately see past it. 

[LadyMoondancer]

Everyone in G1 is "the kind-hearted, caring one of the group", except a few select ponies like Gusty.

Look. This is a picture Lauren Faust posted on Twitter of her childhood ponies.  (Sidenote:  dang girl, nice collection!)

visitors can't see pics , please register or login


visitors can't see pics , please register or login


And what Al-1701 theorized is absolutely correct.  She had Year 1 through Year 3 ponies.  She had non-So-Soft Posey and non-So-Soft Surprise, ponies who were sold before "MLP 'n Friends" ever aired.  ("MLP 'n Friends" was advertising ponies who were sold later, So-Soft Posey and So-Soft Surprise.)  She had personalities for them before "My Little Pony 'n Friends" (which started in Year 4) ever aired . . . unless she just let them sit around for a year without personalities, but most little girls wouldn't do that.

This also explains why she disliked the show--she'd had her own idea of Ponyland in her head for three years and the show didn't match up.

I mean, the show is fine and all that.  But most of these "connections" and "shout outs" are really tenuous, and half of them can be explained away simply by looking at tropes.  "Girl who loves flowers is gentle and quiet" is not exactly uncommon.  So if the show says "Posey is shy" and Faust says "Posey is shy", it doesn't mean Faust got that FROM the show.  It just means that both she and the show writers looked at Posey and thought, "Oh, she has tulips on her butt."

I know we're drifting off-topic and really, I am not trying to pick on you, but I think this kind of illustrates the whole "for bronies it's only about the show" thing.  G1 was about the TOYS.  It is entirely believable to me that Lauren Faust didn't like the cartoon and yet loved My Little Pony, because to a lot of little girls the toys and the show were two ENTIRELY separate things.

[Al-1701]

The only real impact I've seen from the show on the perception of the toys seems to be elevating some of the more standout characters to popular status.  Many Wind Whistler fans I've come across are fans of her because of the show.

[KaibaGirl007]

G1.5 is a new one too me, though I'd much rather have the newer/cartoon fans refer to Tales as that instead of G2 if they aren't going to acknowledge it as G1. However I'm not going to think them (as an individual) disrespectful, rude or take offence from using the term G1.5 unless they have the attitude to match.

Also kind of curious as to why the cartoons aren't referred to as Series, Seasons and Arcs as other shows' fandoms I've been in usually do this.

[Dragonflitter]

G1.5 is a new one too me, though I'd much rather have the newer/cartoon fans refer to Tales as that instead of G2 if they aren't going to acknowledge it as G1. However I'm not going to think them (as an individual) disrespectful, rude or take offence from using the term G1.5 unless they have the attitude to match.

Exactly this! Yes I've come across some rude fans and some of them diss G1, but I'm not going to jump up and shout how rude people are just for assigning an incorrect label to the show. Like I said before on the previous page, these people are probably just trying to avoid confusion by designating the different shows in a way that makes sense to them. I remember being confused myself about Tales when I first started collecting.

Also kind of curious as to why the cartoons aren't referred to as Series, Seasons and Arcs as other shows' fandoms I've been in usually do this.

Aha, this is exactly what I was saying! We don't have a way to refer to the different shows except by name (which for the first series is a long name, and for the G3 cartoons doesn't even really have a name...) and therefore some fans just grab a label we use for the toy line and started using those designations.

I think if we came up with some labels to designate the different shows, and started using them consistently on here and other boards, other fans of FiM and MLP in general would probably pick them up and start using them. I like KaibaGirl's idea of MLP&Friends = Series 1, Tales = Series 2, etc.

Abbreviated, we could just use 'S' which can be used for talking about both 'series' and 'season'. So for example when talking about "The Golden Horseshoes", you could say "S1 S2 'The Golden Horseshoes'".

I think this will clear up a lot of what people are annoyed about. It will help both the fans of the current show only as well as the fans of the toyline/shows in various incarnations, if we make it consistently popular, and this way everyone will have their own designations that don't overlap and cause confusion.

[MJNSEIFER]

Everyone in G1 is "the kind-hearted, caring one of the group", except a few select ponies like Gusty.

Understandable.  While the G1s did have character traits, maybe that in itself wasn't that much of a character trait.

Look. This is a picture Lauren Faust posted on Twitter of her childhood ponies.  (Sidenote:  dang girl, nice collection!)

Sidenote: I am totally jealous of this collection (mind you, I am jealous of many collections).

And what Al-1701 theorized is absolutely correct.  She had Year 1 through Year 3 ponies.  She had non-So-Soft Posey and non-So-Soft Surprise, ponies who were sold before "MLP 'n Friends" ever aired.  ("MLP 'n Friends" was advertising ponies who were sold later, So-Soft Posey and So-Soft Surprise.)  She had personalities for them before "My Little Pony 'n Friends" (which started in Year 4) ever aired . . . unless she just let them sit around for a year without personalities, but most little girls wouldn't do that.

This also explains why she disliked the show--she'd had her own idea of Ponyland in her head for three years and the show didn't match up.

That does make sense, so thanks for showing it to me.  Maybe that is the case, and is certainly better than "she hated MLP so much, she created FIM so that the new fans could attack the old shows" (which is the impression many bronies have sadly taken).  If this is the case, it does make sense, based on your evidence so I will admit that I have probably gotten it wrong, but I do notice similarities between the TV show's versions of Posey, Surprise, and Firefly, and her version of those ponies (with a few things that she added herself) but I accept that it may just be a coincidence.

Now that you've pointed out that she would have most likely had her own storyline at least three years before the show, I am afraid I still hold my belief to some extent, because I've had it for so long now, but this has made me look at the other side to it, and begin to accept that I may have gotten it wrong, but I am not completely like Twilight in "Feeling Pinkie Keen" if you get my drift. 

My main acceptance so far is that if she didn't like the show as a kid, she may have gotten to like it to some extent later, but if even that turns out not to be wrong then that is okay, as I am sure that the over the top hatred of Pre-FIM was not what she intended.

I mean, the show is fine and all that.  But most of these "connections" and "shout outs" are really tenuous, and half of them can be explained away simply by looking at tropes.  "Girl who loves flowers is gentle and quiet" is not exactly uncommon.

First of all, bonus points for mentioning tropes, because hardly anyone seems to know what "tropes" are when I talk about them online (usually in one of those "this thing ripped off that thing" threads) despite the fact that there is a ginormous website dedicated to tropes.  Back on track, I guess you are right that those two character traits would come together a lot (as would the "gentle" character being the one who cares for animals as well).  Like I say, I will do a thread which lists all the possible shout-outs to the previous generations, as that will make it easier for us all to see if they were intentional or not (e.g. ponies who look similar to another are most likely a coincidence unless it looks too perfect, and if something is a trope then it is probably just that, a trope).  Either way, I am not going to insist I am 100% right, but for the time being I do believe that somebody (not necessarily Lauren) looked at previous generations and placed them in (the toys as well as the show).

So if the show says "Posey is shy" and Faust says "Posey is shy", it doesn't mean Faust got that FROM the show.  It just means that both she and the show writers looked at Posey and thought, "Oh, she has tulips on her butt."

I knew I should have explained that part better, this is entirely my fault.  I didn't mean that Lauren made Posey/Fluttershy shy because Real Posey was shy, I mean that Lauren made Posey/Fluttershy shy because Lauren is shy.  I was saying that Posey and Fluttershy have some similarities, but the latter being shy is something that makes them different, but Lauren had to have a shy character because she herself knew what it's like to be the shy one, and wanted to connect to that side of the target audience, and basically say "There's nothing wrong with you."  I will detail this, and the other characters more in that post I was talking about, though I have posted some of it here elsewhere.

I know we're drifting off-topic and really, I am not trying to pick on you, but I think this kind of illustrates the whole "for bronies it's only about the show" thing.

I don't think you're trying to pick on me, if anything I should be the one fearing that he's picking on you, which of course I'm not, but I know I can be overly passionate about things, and there is a thin line between that and being stubborn, I am sure, so I apologise if I come across that way.

I agree that, that probably is the case with the majority of bronies, and I will admit that it is the shows I remember first, because it was the shows I started with, but am now interested in the whole thing, and love the whole thing.  I agree that I basically did it "backwards"  as like you say the majority of people who grew up with MLP (if not all of them) got into it via the toys.

G1 was about the TOYS.  It is entirely believable to me that Lauren Faust didn't like the cartoon and yet loved My Little Pony, because to a lot of little girls the toys and the show were two ENTIRELY separate things.

Understandable, and I will admit that I do view the toys and show as separate entities at times as well as the comics (which, as you say, they are) and that is why a certain thing I'm doing will sometimes obey the show, sometimes the toys, sometimes the comics, and sometimes it will attempt to put them together in places.

I hope that after all this, you are still okay with me as a person, and I do apologise if I am come across as ignorant, but I have hopefully portrayed that I agree with your evidence, and it makes sense. I hope you don't take it badly that I haven't completely let go of my theories yet, but I am closer because of you, if that makes sense.

[Malicieuse]

Yet she still used Posey and Surprise. I always found that kind of funny.

I imagine she had the toys of them.

Eh, i still find it a bit too much of a coincidence that out of all the toys she had, she picked characters that appeared on the show (or the first special). That both of those characters are similar to their G1 show counterparts. Just swap plants with animals and exaggerate their personalities. (Kinda like how Rainbow Dash is pretty much an exaggerated Firefly.)

But yeah, not like anyone can know for sure.

[Al-1701]

I think another problem Faust might have had (I don't know if it was true when she was twelve), but recent things said about her gives me the impression she's a bit of a zealot.  Unfortunately the interview with Craig McCracken is on EqD, but how he describes Faust's attitude towards Hasbro suggests she didn't like working for a company that sells toys first and supports media second.

So, she could still hate the original cartoon on principle for all we know because the people worked on it "sold out" and played by Hasbro's rules.