Any other otherkin?

[brighteyes]

I'm still really confused about the idea that phantom limbs come from native american culture.  As I have understood it, from a medical perspective, a phantom limb is when someone feels a part of their body which is no longer there.  My mom had her leg amputated and felt pain from her foot which was no longer there.  This, we were told by her doctors, was a phantom limb.  Also, my family (on my mom's side) is Sioux and I've never heard of this term before in a non-medical context. 

I'm sure it's alright if you use it, because you're Native. I think it's also nice to keep in mind that many medical terms can be outdated and are sometimes
used to either insult or appropriate marginalized groups in some contexts.

Is this different the the otherkin meaning of a phantom limb?  I'm trying to understand, not trying to derail or be rude.  I am just very interested in social justice and appropriation and am interested to hear the story behind this.

I know! :3
If you meet say, a being who identifies as an angel and they say that they feel wings sometimes on their back, then lots
of kin will call that phantom limbs. But I believe the problem is that otherkin are many times white, so if they say that they
have phantom limbs, they're implying that they have connections to your traditional spiritual elements. Again, any Natives can correct me if
I'm wrong.

We're starting to develop terms like "invisible limb" that are specifically for otherkin and not used also by a certain race, so I think
switching would be for the best.

Thanks for explaining!  This thread has been informative for me.  I wanted to clarify though- I don't think I could consider myself native.  I have relatives that grew up on the rez and have heard their stories but I don't have that same experience or could be considered culturally native.  It's neat learning about other cultures and ways of seeing the world.  Thanks for sharing!

[NoDivision]

As I'm sure you don't want people making generalizations about otherkin, perhaps it's wise to give furries the same courtesy and not try to categorize them as all the same. I, like some other posters, have known furries who do feel and identify as non-human animals. I know some who have felt that way who do use the term otherkin, and some that don't. But either way, for those individuals it's not just fun and games and dressing up and pretending to them. I know being a furry does not always mean that you identify as an animal, but that doesn't mean that there aren't furries that do. It seems odd to me that anyone would be so dismissive of other people who feel that way just because they may use a different label.

[Strawberry Swirl]

Thanks for explaining!  This thread has been informative for me.  I wanted to clarify though- I don't think I could consider myself native.  I have relatives that grew up on the rez and have heard their stories but I don't have that same experience or could be considered culturally native.  It's neat learning about other cultures and ways of seeing the world.  Thanks for sharing!

I'll keep that in mind for the future. Thanks for letting me know. /u\

As I'm sure you don't want people making generalizations about otherkin, perhaps it's wise to give furries the same courtesy and not try to categorize them as all the same. I, like some other posters, have known furries who do feel and identify as non-human animals. I know some who have felt that way who do use the term otherkin, and some that don't. But either way, for those individuals it's not just fun and games and dressing up and pretending to them. I know being a furry does not always mean that you identify as an animal, but that doesn't mean that there aren't furries that do. It seems odd to me that anyone would be so dismissive of other people who feel that way just because they may use a different label.

The other posters' messages came off to me like they thought all furries were like that though. So that's what I was going off of.
Sorry. >_<

[Vertefae]

I was raised in the Pagan community and involved in the Otherkin community for over fifteen years. Your term of a fiction kin is derogatory and degrading.

Within the community, many Otherkin believe that their souls are reincarnations of extinct species. Wether that may be elves or Fae, unicorns or Dragons. They do not consider these creatures imaginary or fictional. Much as the folklores of Ireland, Germany and England, these creatures are seen as the 'little people', people of the hills etc. To use the term fictional kin is rude and ignorant of how the Otherkin community honestly works.

There are also those kin who believe that at one time their family may have interbred with these races. Such as a changeling that would then marry and have half human children. The traits of these races would occasionally become more apparent in a child. They are still human, just with a soul of another race/species. I have met a few people that claim to have souls that are kin to an animal. However, its more of a totem type link than that person IS the animal.

Honestly what you are describing here sounds more than roleplaying that a true Otherkin. For most Otherkin this is a spiritual path. Not 'oh I have invisible wings.. or a tail.. or ears…'

------------on the subject of phantom limbs--------------------
Phantom limbs is a medical term that has been used for generations to describe the feeling of still having a limb after loosing it. This may be through an accident, war etc. It is not meant any disrespect to native americans. And all humans and even animals can experience it. It's a matter of how your nerves and brain works. 

From: http://www.waramps.ca/nac/health/phantom.html

Phantom limb pain has been around as long as there have been amputees. Much research has been done on why phantom limb pain continues to be felt by some amputees for years. Pain "memories" and pain "gate" theories are among the most recent possible explanations, indicating that whole "body mapping" exists in the brain. Even when a piece of the body no longer exists, the "body map" remains intact and phantom sensation or pain can result when the brain sends ever more persistent messages to limbs not there.

For anyone interested in actual information on Otherkin
http://shadowlore.net/Resources
http://www.otherkin.net/articles/what.html

[Strawberry Swirl]

How is identifying as a fictional species appropriative to Pagan people?
(a genuine question, not taunting I promise ;u;)

[Emfen]

I don't identify as being of another species but I can relate to your feeling of being born in the wrong body as I've had that feeling for so long and just recently started to realize it about my gender.

[Vertefae]

How is identifying as a fictional species appropriative to Pagan people?
(a genuine question, not taunting I promise ;u;)

Excuse me? I'm not quite sure what you're asking me.

[MikeysGrrrl]

Vertefae, I just wanted to say thank you for including links to information that explained this far better to me. Now I understand what an "otherkin" is and believe that I have read folklore stories about changelings and otherkin (as in Brian Froud's Faerie book), something I was hugely fascinated with as a child

[Strawberry Swirl]

How is identifying as a fictional species appropriative to Pagan people?
(a genuine question, not taunting I promise ;u;)

Excuse me? I'm not quite sure what you're asking me.

"I was raised in the Pagan community and involved in the Otherkin community for over fifteen years. Your term of a fiction kin is derogatory and degrading."

How is identifying as a fictional species that has for sure never existed offensive to Pagans? :?
Moreoever, how is it offensive if not all kin are Pagans?

[Vertefae]

Vertefae, I just wanted to say thank you for including links to information that explained this far better to me. Now I understand what an "otherkin" is and believe that I have read folklore stories about changelings and otherkin (as in Brian Froud's Faerie book), something I was hugely fascinated with as a child

You are very welcome. I had originally planned to stay out of this thread. But I really felt like there was a lot of misinformation being spread about and people's questions were not really being answered.

How is identifying as a fictional species appropriative to Pagan people?
(a genuine question, not taunting I promise ;u;)

Excuse me? I'm not quite sure what you're asking me.

"I was raised in the Pagan community and involved in the Otherkin community for over fifteen years. Your term of a fiction kin is derogatory and degrading."

How is identifying as a fictional species that has for sure never existed offensive to Pagans? :?
Moreoever, how is it offensive if not all kin are Pagans?

How exactly can you claim these species didn't exist? That is the offensive part. I also never said that all Otherkin are Pagans or vice versa. I was giving my background in the subject of Otherkin and my foundations of training/experience.

[Strawberry Swirl]

How exactly can you claim these species didn't exist?

Because Pokemon and other entertainment-based species just don't exist.
I'm really upset about it, too(I'd give up my kidneys for Pokemon to be real), but
it's just a fact that they don't. I'm not going to try and argue that you could at one
point find a real, live breathing copy of my kintype. Because you can't.

They're video game characters. Or cartoon, or anime, etc.

[Vertefae]

Wait. Let me get this completely straight. You believe that people identify as Pokemon are otherkin?

[Strawberry Swirl]

Wait. Let me get this completely straight. You believe that people identify as Pokemon are otherkin?

Sure. I've met lots of people who identify as Pokemon, or other fictional species like them! :3
Actually, for a long time, I thought I was a Lucario until a couple years ago. But then those feels sort of
waned in favor of my current kintypes, which is a video game based species and another that is more of a job position I suppose.

If that makes sense. Does it? :<

I still do know of people that identify as dragons and other such mythical beings that aren't necessarily fictional, though.

[Vertefae]

I'm not trying to be rude or dismissive. I have never heard of someone within the Kin community honestly believing that they are a video game character. Role playing as one perhaps, but believing genetically/spiritually etc that they are this character, no.

And really IMO I wouldn't classify someone like this as otherkin. Someone with a great imagination, sure, but not really an Otherkin. Like I said, my opinion.

ETA- May I ask how you believe you became one of these creatures?

[Strawberry Swirl]

I'm not trying to be rude or dismissive. I have never heard of someone within the Kin community honestly believing that they are a video game character. Role playing as one perhaps, but believing genetically/spiritually etc that they are this character, no.

And really IMO I wouldn't classify someone like this as otherkin. Someone with a great imagination, sure, but not really an Otherkin. Like I said, my opinion.

Well, I understand, but I don't know if it would really be best to tell someone that they're not kin just cuz their kintype
is one you've never heard of. *shrug*
I wouldn't want anybody's feelings getting hurt, after all.


If it helps, I don't think you're being rude at all. :>



"ETA- May I ask how you believe you became one of these creatures?"

I can't really say that for sure, it just sort of happened for me. I'm not a good explainer though, or one
that has a reason for every single thing they do.

I can say that it was quite recent. As I said before, for a long time I felt like I was a Pokemon
but over time that feeling just faded into being something else.