Want advice / critique on your art?

[tinrobo]

You said asking for advice is alright here, yes? :3


I'd like some tips on how to place a character in context. I'm not the best artist but I'm fairly confident with drawing people, animals, etc - but all my work looks unfinished because I leave them floating in space. Backgrounds on their own, I can do too. But when it comes to populating them? Hopeless.


Any ideas?

[IIya]

You said asking for advice is alright here, yes? :3


I'd like some tips on how to place a character in context. I'm not the best artist but I'm fairly confident with drawing people, animals, etc - but all my work looks unfinished because I leave them floating in space. Backgrounds on their own, I can do too. But when it comes to populating them? Hopeless.


Any ideas?

Look at photos with people/animals in them and practice from them. It's better to have ref at first. Have any Nat Geo's laying around? You can also borrow photo books from a library.

[Lyra]

You said asking for advice is alright here, yes? :3

I'd like some tips on how to place a character in context. I'm not the best artist but I'm fairly confident with drawing people, animals, etc - but all my work looks unfinished because I leave them floating in space. Backgrounds on their own, I can do too. But when it comes to populating them? Hopeless.

Any ideas?

Hi, there are some really good books that I found helped me with this!! I have to get the exact name of it, it was something like 'Layout for animation'...(I left it at my parents house) There are lots of books now on layout and composition in general

(I know you are a good illustator so you probably know a lot of this lol , but these are tips I find useful to remember)

- I'd look up 'The Golden Ratio/divine proportion' it is a great, classic diagram that advises on how to make compositions that draw the eye in, I googled a thingy on it here:
http://www.drawinghowtodraw.com/drawing-lessons/art-design-principles/golden-ration-divine-proportions.html
- If using a background and character together, the background can 'compliment' the character but not dominate the piece - if they are both too detailed the impact is lost. (Or the other way around, decide what is the focus of the picture)
- The lines of landscape, and items in the image could be 'pointing to' the character or the focus of the picture, to 'frame' it. Trees could be arranged to frame the moon, for example.
- It may help focus the character if he/she is higher than the object they are standing in front of. For example, I drew a character standing in front of a doorway - my teacher said the doorway dominated the piece. I made it again so that the character was taller than the top frame of the door - it brought focus back on the character - Also the thing to 'avoid' would be having everything line up too much, like the top of characters head exactly lines up with the doorframe or the skyline - it looks very awkward.
- It may help to place characters a bit to the side rather than dead centre. (Depends on what is the purpose of the picture)
- If you look at screenshots from animated films and series (Disney, My little Pony, anything! ) You can examine how they have placed the characters in the setting. Usually if you remove the characters, the background feels like it is 'missing something' because the focus is gone.
- It's good to  balance out the space with both detailed and empty areas or it could feel too 'fussy' then again if you want the picture to have a desolate or crowded feel to it you could tip is eitherway.

Those are just tips I try to remember!
 

how awesome!! How about my latest finished piece?
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Looking at it now I can see the legs are uneven. And I shaded it weird. One thing I know I'm bad about is not using proper shading 
Can't wait to hear your crit! 

Ooh cool, I am already following you on devart - I thought Bumbleweet looked like a perfume pony (remember me? )
I really like the mixed media approach. I feel that  (deliberate) inaccuracies can make for memorable and charming style, and that perfecting the ponies proportions too much might make it feel a bit 'clinical'? I think what I'm trying to say is it I very much like this picture the way it is   It's sort of raw, spontaeneous, childish - and yet presented in a sophisticated way.
 If anything I'd say the picture quality is a little blurry and a higher res scan or photo might better show the grain and texture in the materials and the paper.
 

[Arkillian]

Quote from: IIya on February 01, 2012, 07:48:52 PM how awesome!! How about my latest finished piece?
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This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 709x945.
Looking at it now I can see the legs are uneven. And I shaded it weird. One thing I know I'm bad about is not using proper shading   
Can't wait to hear your crit!   


Ooh cool, I am already following you on devart - I thought Bumbleweet looked like a perfume pony (remember me?  ) I really like the mixed media approach. I feel that  (deliberate) inaccuracies can make for memorable and charming style, and that perfecting the ponies proportions too much might make it feel a bit 'clinical'? I think what I'm trying to say is it I very much like this picture the way it is   It's sort of raw, spontaeneous, childish - and yet presented in a sophisticated way. If anything I'd say the picture quality is a little blurry and a higher res scan or photo might better show the grain and texture in the materials and the paper.

This was pretty much my reason for hesitating too. I  means, there's ways of improving art, but I don't think this piece needs any more pointers. IT is what it is now. As you said, the photograph is blurry.  You can fix that by having the camera on a tripod, or putting it on a timer, taking a deap breath in and holding the camera to your chest till it takes the photo (no flash). More light will allow the  camera to take in more light faster. Less light makes automatic cameras take longer to take the photo. The longer it takes to take the photo, the more likely it'll blur. One of those two options will fix that. Or both


And the rule of thirds is glorious TuT I haven't heard of the golden spiral though.I like it. It wont help often for ponies, but for other forms of art, I'll keep it in mind for. I sometimes use a spiral format in my art. Maybe it's just a photography thing which is why I haven't seen it... In anycase, any of the arts that is not fineart can teach you something about another art. Never be restricted by one form Photography has some of the best reference guides for composition that I've ever seen. Fine art books usually brush over composition for more important things. Composition isn't something that is natural to pick up on without being aware of the techniques first. I did a year of illustration at school. IT was brutal to get into my head, but it taught me alot about simplification and symbolism in art. All arts cross over some how

My favourite of all time is how Martial arts crosses over. My friend showed me a comic done by a martial artist. He applied martial arts training to comic art, and went from being utter crap to Mangaka in 1 year JUST with discipline.  IT was SO inspiring ^^

[NumiTuziNeru]

yes please kindly

spoiler everything i draw looks like deranged noodles

Spoiler

[img2]http://27.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lxht9o0fN91qid19ao1_500.jpg[/img2]
[img2]http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lypyixBsR41qid19ao1_500.png[/img2]
[img2]http://27.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lsc4xgD8aT1qid19ao1_500.jpg[/img2]
[img2]http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lyivzzX8bp1qid19ao1_500.png[/img2]
[img2]http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ly7ktiwXs71qid19ao1_500.png[/img2]
[img2]http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lxqhtqF0pz1qid19ao1_500.png[/img2]
[img2]http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lxnflwSDX31qid19ao1_500.jpg[/img2]

http://numituzineru.tumblr.com/post/16631065253
also basically everything in that post aughahahaha

[Arkillian]

What are you wanting critique on? I mean, they're all sketches which are fun and light. There's nothing to say about that IF it were a developed peice of art I could say something but as you said, they're just doodles. Doodles don't need proportion. They're just expression and fun.
If you'd like critique, please be specific, or give more fleshed out art. Thank you

[NumiTuziNeru]

problem is i don't actually have that much fully developed art that's really recent...
and some of those look like sketches anyway hurrr durr
and technically you can still critique sketches since they're prolly easier to improve

but ok then here's a linkspam

http://numituzineru.deviantart.com/art/the-earth-too-passes-by-213180409
http://numituzineru.deviantart.com/art/eurythmics-got-nothing-on-this-252448334
http://numituzineru.deviantart.com/art/upon-musing-264687367
http://numituzineru.deviantart.com/art/magic-of-children-s-dreams-266751377
http://numituzineru.deviantart.com/art/nem-en-kialtok-263502598
http://numituzineru.deviantart.com/art/crooked-creaking-universe-265561730
http://numituzineru.deviantart.com/art/beings-of-despair-270338333

[Arkillian]

problem is i don't actually have that much fully developed art that's really recent...
and some of those look like sketches anyway hurrr durr
and technically you can still critique sketches since they're prolly easier to improve

They can be, but you didn't tell me what you wanted pointers on or anything Because your art is so stylistic, there's no way I can give pointers on it cause it comes down to personal taste. I mean, I have read through fashion design books and alot of professional artists style female bodies like you have in your pictures. They flow. They're human. They do things humans can physically do. The colours feel nice for a sketch. There is no layout in them so I can't comment on them. They're sketches so they're unlikely to have light source. As far as I'm concerned, you've come as far as you can with these pictures and made them lovely sketches. Unless you had a specific question about them, I couldn't give any advice.


Finals however are meant to be more fleshed out and have complex aspects involved. They're much easier to give advice on as there have been developed to a far higher level. Also, they're the best you can do. Knowing the full extent that your art goes to, I can get a better impression of where you can improve


Ok, having a quick browse through your gallery, I think I have a better idea about your mindset with art. You seem like you have alot of trouble keeping your toony form consistent in all your art. Don't get me wrong- I like the style you draw in, but it's not consistent throughout your art and all it's pose variations. Some pictures your characters look like they have long heads (which can look very nice.), where other picture they look like they have normal shaped heads (more.... cranium and rounder than the long version). Your bodies, although they do human poses, they simplified. Like you're not familiar with how they should look. This is all things I couldn't see in your first post cause they weren't fleshed out art.


I'm sorry if this comes across is a bit harsh. There's no easy way of saying it, but I strongly think that doing face studies and form studies would help you alot. Not in your normal style, but trying to make them as realistic as you can. Animators in all walks, mangaka, comic artists, they all learn how to draw the form un stylized. When you can do that, that your stylized form will solidify. I absolutely promise. When you are familiar with drawing the form accurately, you'll know where and when you can break it to how you like it to be. I have to frequently draw from photos to keep my proportions up because my glasses make me see square shapes as oblongs (I'm half blind T.T). If I don't do it, my art starts stretching and not looking right in a way I don't like, and I can't help it.


I'm going to leave it at that for now. There's a few things that I can suggest to you to improve on, but this is already a big deal on it's own. I think that once you solidify your art style that the other things I see will likely fix themselves up anyways cause you'll start seeing it yourself as you progress. So that's my advice Focus heavily on your form. It's easy to see that you can make your art beautiful with colour. You have expression, and life in your art.


And for a last point- I don't think your finals are too sketchy. I know plenty of artists that have lovely art that have a style like that. I hope my advice can help you I know a couple of sites with pose references if you're interested. I'm not sure if how to books will be entirely helpful for you, but I know some good books too. And feel free to ask questions if you'd like IT's a bit of a big step. About as big as me learning how to colour a few years ago. Man, that was grueling >.<

[Fezzy]

This chappie posted a couple of weeks ago could use some work. In particular his hind leg looks pretty odd, think the problems in the shading as the lines looked okay any other pointers are welcome ^_^

http://mlparena.com/mlp/index.php/topic,284612.msg14657.html#msg14657

edited to add link because apparently I are a stupid

[Thoth]

Wait a minute, did someone mention Nat Geo magazines? I have lots of them!

I dug these up from my numerous sketch books...

I got this whole thing started with nothing in my head and when I was done, it actually looked half-way decent. Though I can't tell when something is a little off on foreshortening or proportions. That random blue-ish squiggle in the background got started by accident, when I dropped a pencil there and liked the color.

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Random robotic creature. Do you have any advice when it comes to uses colored pencils to color and make metal look like, well, shiny metal?

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This is one of those drawings I did because I thought it was a cool idea. It is a clone captain riding a Vraactyl, which is an awesome lizard-like creature from Star Wars Episode 3: Revenge of the Sith.   

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This is a Mahi-Mahi, a type of sport fish also called dolphinfish. I used reference and colored it with watercolor pencils and gel pens for the scales.

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[Arkillian]

This chappie posted a couple of weeks ago could use some work. In particular his hind leg looks pretty odd, think the problems in the shading as the lines looked okay any other pointers are welcome ^_^

http://mlparena.com/mlp/index.php/topic,284612.msg14657.html#msg14657

edited to add link because apparently I are a stupid

I'm not good with animals, but animal hair works the same way human hair does, it's just wider spread. If you're going to show animal fur and it's individual strokes, the go in a certain direction. I'm going to suggest you look at photos of bears for that direction, but you need to colour it with those strokes, and each stroke should represent the length of the hair. Short strokes for short hair etc... Like with human hair how you do a full stroke for the length of the hair. You don't start the hair half way down it's head. This tutorial shows what I mean sorta. See how he looks furry? That kind of effect. I think once you put more definition into the fur it'll look cleaner. Don't use the grass tool to do it though. It's a tacky brush when used wrong >.< Just do quick strokes.

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Wait a minute, did someone mention Nat Geo magazines? I have lots of them!

I dug these up from my numerous sketch books...

I got this whole thing started with nothing in my head and when I was done, it actually looked half-way decent. Though I can't tell when something is a little off on foreshortening or proportions. That random blue-ish squiggle in the background got started by accident, when I dropped a pencil there and liked the color.

Foreshortening is actually an advanced thing to draw hon. I don't know how to reply to you about it cause simply, I'm not sure if you're ready to learn foreshortening yet I don't want to be mean, but it a 3D aspect as you have to visualize the limb coming towards you. This is easier for men than it is for women admittedly, but I think you need to become more familiar with the human form first before you start doing advanced angles. I think it's really cool that you're giving it a go at least though! Doing art of difficult things is the only way you'll progress, but I'll be lying if I said that you'll learn fast by just mass drawing. You'll get better, sure, but SLOWLY. What you need is some of the ground basics of human form, and to practice drawing them heaps. When you draw correctly, you progress MUCH faster in art than if you just draw for the sake of it.

I think you'll find images form in your mind when you learn these too hon. The fun of art is the journey to the end, but why not make every moment memorable? Visualizing the picture first is half the fun for me

I learnt to draw from a book that is now VERY well priced. It's over 50 years old now, but it has some fantastic tutorials on drawing the human figure.

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The art style is old school, but you might like that. Jack Hamm does classic looking men which seems to suit your style somewhat I think


As for doing metal, I don't know. I'm not experienced with that. I don't draw metal often. Metal is a highly reflective surface though, so the shadows tend to be intense, and the highlights are sharp. They fuzz on the edges a little, but high gloss is blocky with it's levels. The shape of the object is SO important with metallics though. Be careful how intence you make the light on your object. The higher the intensity, the more noticable it is if you make a mistake. Also remember metals are highly reflective. Objects and colours near a metalic colour alawys reflect on a metalic object.


Wow- you do alot of complex stuff in your art


Side note- please keep pictures for critiqing to 1 or 2.

[IIya]

Thank you guys for the words!

[NumiTuziNeru]

ok that works
some of those in the gallery are pretty old though prolly should have said

also i'm not sure what you mean by the different faces thing?
since yeah some of them are old and i focus a lot on making different characters not look like the same face with different hair
because some people do have long faces and others have round faces and stuff so...

and i'm not entirely sure what you mean by solidifying my style either
although i guess that's because (imo) style isn't as important as drawing well (which i admittedly...don't)

but otherwise THANKS<3

[Thoth]

Thanks! My mom tells me to use reference for my humans. but I keep forgetting. I say that my memory often can't remember anything useful unfortunately. Sorry about having a few too many pics. I can't find a human anatomy book I really like, this because the ones I see are almost always manga. Manga has become so popular I can't really find a good drawing book. It drives me crazy!

[Arkillian]

ok that works
some of those in the gallery are pretty old though prolly should have said

also i'm not sure what you mean by the different faces thing?
since yeah some of them are old and i focus a lot on making different characters not look like the same face with different hair
because some people do have long faces and others have round faces and stuff so...

and i'm not entirely sure what you mean by solidifying my style either
although i guess that's because (imo) style isn't as important as drawing well (which i admittedly...don't)

but otherwise THANKS<3

How do I explain this... When you draw a head on different angles, they should look like they have the same over all shape, but they don't. Some have huge craniums, and some have tiny ones. Cartoon characters sometimes push proportions to extremes, but their bodies are also pushed to the extremes. They also tend to be consistent with how they are made extreme. Not only this, if you turn a character around to a different angle, it should be the same shape, but it's not.


This is only the only thing with solidifying art styles though. With your art of people's bodies it has this fold over effect. I'm not sure if you're drawing creatures that are meant to do that, but I'm assuming not cause not all of the poses are like this. For example, this picture of Ratfink has the arm shoulder sitting only at thr top of the torso and it kind of folds down. It doesn't give the impression of there being a physical joint shape connecting to the body. The thigh at the bottom also has this problem cause the shirt cuts the joint in half.


I'm not sure if you can draw realistic humans, but what I'm asking is for you to draw some realistic humans from a reference, and see how their bodies are assembled, and see how you can adopt your style to compliment the realistic version of the human. Right now, I feel like you're guessing alot along the way, and guessing is so hard. You shouldn't have to do it. Art is like water. It should flow when inspiration comes to mind. You shouldn't have to think about poses. Like in martial arts- you learn the basic moves till you do them instinctively. An artist is at their best when their mind isn't doing the talking and their hand is. I don't know if anyone has ever been in right side of the brain mode, but it's awesome. When you can tell the left side of your brain to take a holiday, all you have left is creativity. It's bliss :3 Sorry- I'm diverting from the point >.<


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Thanks! My mom tells me to use reference for my humans. but I keep forgetting. I say that my memory often can't remember anything useful unfortunately. Sorry about having a few too many pics. I can't find a human anatomy book I really like, this because the ones I see are almost always manga. Manga has become so popular I can't really find a good drawing book. It drives me crazy!

Well, not just using referances, but learn the general make up of the human form. The book I linked isn't manga. IT's the book I learnt on and it's VERY concise. I think you'll have alot of luck studying out of that I know I did ^^ My characters went from ok for a kid to 'Hang on, that's actually really good for her age' very fast. There's alot of things that it doesn't cover very well like age and teenagers and stuff. Learn what it has, and I'll happily help out with the rest