How does the cost-availability of a BJD affects her?

[Wardah]

I think it's a bit unreasonable to compare doll companies and expect them all to offer the same thing. "This company sells dolls for under $200, why can't they all? This company offers 8 colors of resin, why can't they all?" Companies have the right to produce what they want and price it how they want. And like brightberry said, just because  a company doesn't offer exactly what someone wants or someone can't afford their price doesn't make it okay to illegally reproduce their work..

Yes companies have a right to produce what they want and charge what they want just like they have the right to lose sales because of it. They weren't going to buy the legit doll anyways if they can't get the color they want or feel the price is unfair. The only difference is with recasts they have the doll they want anyways. The thing I don't understand is why the hell would someone be against the companies making them less rare, lowering their prices, or offering more options? If you love a doll you love it because you love it not because it cost x amount of dollars or is rare. That would be like someone likeing a nirvana pony with a ghastly color combo just because it is a nirvana.

[MiRaja]

Yeah but recasts of out of production limiteds are no different than a custom repro of Greek Ladybird. The real Ladybird hasn't gone down in value because these custom repros exist. The real limited dolls will still be worth a lot because they are REAL. Nobody who wants the real deal will settle for a fake. And honestly as far as colors the company doesn't offer, if the doll is rare I'd rather see someone get a recast in that color than see a doll destroyed because something went wrong while dying or painting.

It's still not legal.  At all.  A recast of a vintage item is a wee bit different than something modern and still far more readily available.  It doesn't make it right.  Just because you can't have something or can't have something in a certain color doesn't make it legitimate.  If you want a doll and you want her in a certain color. . .why not go make your own doll?!  From scratch, versus rip off someone else's hard work via a merchant or making a recast? 

Actually owning one is not illegal. The recasters are breaking laws by using the dolls to mold from, but actually the act of owning any knock off doll is not against any US law.

Owning stolen property is in fact illegal in the US.  A recast doll made illegally from a mold not a company's own is in fact illegal and stolen property.  Intellectual  property, but still property. 

[brightberry]

I think it's a bit unreasonable to compare doll companies and expect them all to offer the same thing. "This company sells dolls for under $200, why can't they all? This company offers 8 colors of resin, why can't they all?" Companies have the right to produce what they want and price it how they want. And like brightberry said, just because  a company doesn't offer exactly what someone wants or someone can't afford their price doesn't make it okay to illegally reproduce their work..

Yes companies have a right to produce what they want and charge what they want just like they have the right to lose sales because of it. They weren't going to buy the legit doll anyways if they can't get the color they want or feel the price is unfair. The only difference is with recasts they have the doll they want anyways. The thing I don't understand is why the hell would someone be against the companies making them less rare, lowering their prices, or offering more options? If you love a doll you love it because you love it not because it cost x amount of dollars or is rare. That would be like someone likeing a nirvana pony with a ghastly color combo just because it is a nirvana.

I don't think anyone is against someone getting the doll they want.  The problem seems to be they do it by buying something stolen.  If you buy a new car, people will be happy for you.  If you buy a stolen one knowing it was stolen, they won't.  Taking and copying someone's artwork is stealing.  When someone steals from a small company, that person is risking people's livelihood.  I don't think any doll is that important.  At least, I don't think any doll I want is that important.  If it was about fulfilling basic needs, sure.

edit...

Out if interest, I looked to see if there was an "official" ruling on whether it was illegal to buy one or not.  It seems to be so.

http://www.jpopdolls.net/images/letterfrommatthew.jpg
^one lawyers opinion.

I don't know if the law has actually gone after anyone simply because the expense it could incur.  But apparently if the infraction is serious enough, they have the legal standing to try.  The law is as the justice department chooses to interpret it.  If they take that route, then it will be up to a jury to decide if a law was broken or not.

[NoDivision]

I don't think anyone (at least anyone here) would be against companies making dolls more affordable. Speaking for myself, when it comes to BJDs I am not looking for the rarest dolls, I just look for what I like. Sometimes what I like is cheap, sometimes it's not. Sometimes, many times, I fall in love with dolls that are no longer being made. Now, would it be totally awesome if all the dolls I wanted were within my budget and released in unlimited quantities? Sure! But I recognize that the companies are under no obligation to change the way they do things just to make me happy. I know that I can't always get what I want. And since dolls are a luxury item, not a necessity, I am okay with that.

The issue of recasts is a complicated one, and the discussion could go for ages. I'm just saying that personally I accept the fact that there are some dolls I can't have and I personally don't feel that buying myself an illegal copy of that doll is the right choice for me.

[Wardah]

Yeah but recasts of out of production limiteds are no different than a custom repro of Greek Ladybird. The real Ladybird hasn't gone down in value because these custom repros exist. The real limited dolls will still be worth a lot because they are REAL. Nobody who wants the real deal will settle for a fake. And honestly as far as colors the company doesn't offer, if the doll is rare I'd rather see someone get a recast in that color than see a doll destroyed because something went wrong while dying or painting.

It's still not legal.  At all.  A recast of a vintage item is a wee bit different than something modern and still far more readily available.  It doesn't make it right.  Just because you can't have something or can't have something in a certain color doesn't make it legitimate.  If you want a doll and you want her in a certain color. . .why not go make your own doll?!  From scratch, versus rip off someone else's hard work via a merchant or making a recast? 

Actually owning one is not illegal. The recasters are breaking laws by using the dolls to mold from, but actually the act of owning any knock off doll is not against any US law.

Owning stolen property is in fact illegal in the US.  A recast doll made illegally from a mold not a company's own is in fact illegal and stolen property.  Intellectual  property, but still property. 

Actually I had to take a law class and the laws concerning intellectual property and physical property are different. Stealing is depriving someone of the use of their physical property. Copyright infringement is when someone benefits from intellectual property without any benefit to the original copyright holder. Buying a recast for your own personal use and not to resell is not illegal. That said just because something is legal doesn't always mean it is right. Tho I am not sure where buying a legit doll and then recasting it (or some parts of it) in a different color to keep for yourself would fall.

[MiRaja]

Yeah but recasts of out of production limiteds are no different than a custom repro of Greek Ladybird. The real Ladybird hasn't gone down in value because these custom repros exist. The real limited dolls will still be worth a lot because they are REAL. Nobody who wants the real deal will settle for a fake. And honestly as far as colors the company doesn't offer, if the doll is rare I'd rather see someone get a recast in that color than see a doll destroyed because something went wrong while dying or painting.

It's still not legal.  At all.  A recast of a vintage item is a wee bit different than something modern and still far more readily available.  It doesn't make it right.  Just because you can't have something or can't have something in a certain color doesn't make it legitimate.  If you want a doll and you want her in a certain color. . .why not go make your own doll?!  From scratch, versus rip off someone else's hard work via a merchant or making a recast? 

Actually owning one is not illegal. The recasters are breaking laws by using the dolls to mold from, but actually the act of owning any knock off doll is not against any US law.

Owning stolen property is in fact illegal in the US.  A recast doll made illegally from a mold not a company's own is in fact illegal and stolen property.  Intellectual  property, but still property. 

Actually I had to take a law class and the laws concerning intellectual property and physical property are different. Stealing is depriving someone of the use of their physical property. Copyright infringement is when someone benefits from intellectual property without any benefit to the original copyright holder. Buying a recast for your own personal use and not to resell is not illegal. That said just because something is legal doesn't always mean it is right. Tho I am not sure where buying a legit doll and then recasting it (or some parts of it) in a different color to keep for yourself would fall.

Really?  Because last I heard, it was illegal to possess stolen materials, even intellectual, such as movies and media upon one's computer, and that a person can be held responsible, monetarily, and in cases, be charged an insane amount by the courts of law for such infringements. 

To add, the law is seen differently, when illegal materials are contributing to an illegal enterprise.  This is exactly why law enforcement is cracking down on the producers and buyers of illegal knock offs for Prada, Coach, Louis Vuitton, etc.  Which, in my opinion, is absolutely NO different than owning a knock off, and I think, in that respect, owning a recast IS illegal.  If it's illegal to own a fake pair of Loubutin's, then it's illegal to own a recast.  The recast, in a way, is worse, because it's produced from the original, when knock of companies are just taking pictures and guessing and slapping fake logos on crap.  :/ 

[Wardah]

Yeah but recasts of out of production limiteds are no different than a custom repro of Greek Ladybird. The real Ladybird hasn't gone down in value because these custom repros exist. The real limited dolls will still be worth a lot because they are REAL. Nobody who wants the real deal will settle for a fake. And honestly as far as colors the company doesn't offer, if the doll is rare I'd rather see someone get a recast in that color than see a doll destroyed because something went wrong while dying or painting.

It's still not legal.  At all.  A recast of a vintage item is a wee bit different than something modern and still far more readily available.  It doesn't make it right.  Just because you can't have something or can't have something in a certain color doesn't make it legitimate.  If you want a doll and you want her in a certain color. . .why not go make your own doll?!  From scratch, versus rip off someone else's hard work via a merchant or making a recast? 

Actually owning one is not illegal. The recasters are breaking laws by using the dolls to mold from, but actually the act of owning any knock off doll is not against any US law.

Owning stolen property is in fact illegal in the US.  A recast doll made illegally from a mold not a company's own is in fact illegal and stolen property.  Intellectual  property, but still property. 

Actually I had to take a law class and the laws concerning intellectual property and physical property are different. Stealing is depriving someone of the use of their physical property. Copyright infringement is when someone benefits from intellectual property without any benefit to the original copyright holder. Buying a recast for your own personal use and not to resell is not illegal. That said just because something is legal doesn't always mean it is right. Tho I am not sure where buying a legit doll and then recasting it (or some parts of it) in a different color to keep for yourself would fall.

Really?  Because last I heard, it was illegal to possess stolen materials, even intellectual, such as movies and media upon one's computer, and that a person can be held responsible, monetarily, and in cases, be charged an insane amount by the courts of law for such infringements. 

To add, the law is seen differently, when illegal materials are contributing to an illegal enterprise.  This is exactly why law enforcement is cracking down on the producers and buyers of illegal knock offs for Prada, Coach, Louis Vuitton, etc.  Which, in my opinion, is absolutely NO different than owning a knock off, and I think, in that respect, owning a recast IS illegal.  If it's illegal to own a fake pair of Loubutin's, then it's illegal to own a recast.  The recast, in a way, is worse, because it's produced from the original, when knock of companies are just taking pictures and guessing and slapping fake logos on crap.  :/ 

The people who have gotten in trouble for copyright infringement were also distributing those files since that is how most methods of file sharing work. It's the distribution that gets people in trouble. The police are not going to put you in jail if they pull you over for speeding if you have a fake bag. However the law is not the only thing that decides if something is right or wrong. Something can be legal and yet morally wrong just like something that is not morally wrong can be illegal. After all if they decided to make it no longer illegal to go into a store and take something without paying would that make it morally right?

Of course I'm more concerned how people feel about recasting for personal use. Like if I bought a doll and learned how to cast resin and made a copy for myself in glow in the dark resin or something. I don't think it is illegal since I wouldn't be distributing it anyways. But I'm afraid people will be upset or think it came from a recaster.

[MiRaja]

Yeah but recasts of out of production limiteds are no different than a custom repro of Greek Ladybird. The real Ladybird hasn't gone down in value because these custom repros exist. The real limited dolls will still be worth a lot because they are REAL. Nobody who wants the real deal will settle for a fake. And honestly as far as colors the company doesn't offer, if the doll is rare I'd rather see someone get a recast in that color than see a doll destroyed because something went wrong while dying or painting.

It's still not legal.  At all.  A recast of a vintage item is a wee bit different than something modern and still far more readily available.  It doesn't make it right.  Just because you can't have something or can't have something in a certain color doesn't make it legitimate.  If you want a doll and you want her in a certain color. . .why not go make your own doll?!  From scratch, versus rip off someone else's hard work via a merchant or making a recast? 

Actually owning one is not illegal. The recasters are breaking laws by using the dolls to mold from, but actually the act of owning any knock off doll is not against any US law.

Owning stolen property is in fact illegal in the US.  A recast doll made illegally from a mold not a company's own is in fact illegal and stolen property.  Intellectual  property, but still property. 

Actually I had to take a law class and the laws concerning intellectual property and physical property are different. Stealing is depriving someone of the use of their physical property. Copyright infringement is when someone benefits from intellectual property without any benefit to the original copyright holder. Buying a recast for your own personal use and not to resell is not illegal. That said just because something is legal doesn't always mean it is right. Tho I am not sure where buying a legit doll and then recasting it (or some parts of it) in a different color to keep for yourself would fall.

Really?  Because last I heard, it was illegal to possess stolen materials, even intellectual, such as movies and media upon one's computer, and that a person can be held responsible, monetarily, and in cases, be charged an insane amount by the courts of law for such infringements. 

To add, the law is seen differently, when illegal materials are contributing to an illegal enterprise.  This is exactly why law enforcement is cracking down on the producers and buyers of illegal knock offs for Prada, Coach, Louis Vuitton, etc.  Which, in my opinion, is absolutely NO different than owning a knock off, and I think, in that respect, owning a recast IS illegal.  If it's illegal to own a fake pair of Loubutin's, then it's illegal to own a recast.  The recast, in a way, is worse, because it's produced from the original, when knock of companies are just taking pictures and guessing and slapping fake logos on crap.  :/ 

The people who have gotten in trouble for copyright infringement were also distributing those files since that is how most methods of file sharing work. It's the distribution that gets people in trouble. The police are not going to put you in jail if they pull you over for speeding if you have a fake bag. However the law is not the only thing that decides if something is right or wrong. Something can be legal and yet morally wrong just like something that is not morally wrong can be illegal. After all if they decided to make it no longer illegal to go into a store and take something without paying would that make it morally right?

Of course I'm more concerned how people feel about recasting for personal use. Like if I bought a doll and learned how to cast resin and made a copy for myself in glow in the dark resin or something. I don't think it is illegal since I wouldn't be distributing it anyways. But I'm afraid people will be upset or think it came from a recaster.

But the police are cracking down and arresting both the buyers and sellers for these knock off items at place of purchase.  There were recent busts at one of my local flea market, where a lot of  these knock offs are sold.  New York City and Chicago have been especially hard, and yes, they've not only been charging those distributing, but those buying.  And the file sharing has CERTAINLY NOT been just about those who have been distributing.  I recall very clearly a case where a person was charged nearly something like $300k for all of ten files that were illegally obtained on their computer.  Not distributed, downloaded.  I've known a person and saw the letter and everything for a cease and desist for downloading.  Not distributing, downloading, back when Avatar was in theaters. 

I don't care if you have a doll and you make a recast yourself to screw around and fiddle with and learn with.  That is certainly not the issue.  The issue is profiteering from copying and stealing someone else's work and making money off of it and those people who support the practice.  Personally, if you want to learn to cast resin dolls, you may want to look up Batchix.  Who does her work right.  She does her own dolls from scratch and casts.  Beautifully. 

[Radiance]

I love Batchix's dolls! Those little mini dolls she released not too long ago are so cute! Yet another great artist who would suffer by losing sales to recasters

There's a doll I want in tan, badly. She is not produced in tan. So I will either not get her, or get her one day & dye her. I've dyed scrap resin before, just testing it out. It's labor intensive; you have to sand carefully and all to get an even coat, but it's not difficult. And if it turns out badly, a Winsor & Newton brush cleaner bath will pull out most of the dye & you can sand the rest of it off. So the whole argument of some dolls not being available in certain colors just does not work for me.

[Alicat]

Of you were caught in the act of buying a recast at a booth set up at a flea market, then PERHAPS you would be charged, or your doll confiscated. But again, as i have stated elsewhere, the authorities have no clue what they are looking at. Knock off coach, Chanel etc have had logos applied. It these dolls haven't, then it gets even cloudier. These busts are about big distributers, not a one or two doll owner.

My husband is a police officer and gives not one fig that I own a recast doll. He hasn't gone in and smashed her to bits( besides the fact I would hurt him!), he doesn't care, neither do his superiors. He says it just a DOLL for crying out loud. It would be very difficult for them to be tracked or found. They have much larger fish to fry.

[brightberry]

Of you were caught in the act of buying a recast at a booth set up at a flea market, then PERHAPS you would be charged, or your doll confiscated. But again, as i have stated elsewhere, the authorities have no clue what they are looking at. Knock off coach, Chanel etc have had logos applied. It these dolls haven't, then it gets even cloudier. These busts are about big distributers, not a one or two doll owner.

My husband is a police officer and gives not one fig that I own a recast doll. He hasn't gone in and smashed her to bits( besides the fact I would hurt him!), he doesn't care, neither do his superiors. He says it just a DOLL for crying out loud. It would be very difficult for them to be tracked or found. They have much larger fish to fry.

Agreed.  I think the only way the authorities would pay attention is if the legitimate companies really started putting pressure on elected officials to enforce the law, like they did in New York and Chicago.  And like what the music and movie industries have done.  The thing is, if any of those companies decided to sue and put pressure on authorities, they have the legal standing to do so.  Plus, there is more than one law being broken when someone commissions a doll overseas and then arranges the transport of illegal goods into the country.  Then you're dealing with Federal Law and not local law enforcement.

But odds are, these things are going to be overlooked until the recasters cross some sort of monetary line and bjd doll makers decide they've had enough and seek legal recourse.   I think everyone knows people who illegally download music.  Most of them are never going to be messed with.  It's not because its legal to do it.  It's because the law isn't being enforced except for a few people who've been made examples of.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/06/18/minnesota.music.download.fine/