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Have you heard the news yet? The douche who killed Cecil The Lion is dead! Apparently he was shooting birds in Italy, slipped on some ice, and fell off a precipice.
:satisfied: Karma much?
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I don't think that was Walter Palmer. The only article I could find was about another controversial hunter, an Italian named Luciano Ponzetto, who died in the way you described. It says comparisons have been drawn between him and Mr. Palmer but he's just another despicable trophy hunter.
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Whoever it was got Karma'd good and proper. I do feel sorry for his family though.
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Whoever it was got Karma'd good and proper. I do feel sorry for his family though.
My thoughts exactly. I usually don't mind hunting (hey, I grew up going to Cabella's for fun, seeing their taxidermy display...) but it makes me mad when people go for the animals that aren't in extreme abundance (which applies to lions).
(grumbly bear noises)
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Sorry, but I can't get behind the joy being taken here. Regardless of how scummy it is that someone killed a lion, the fact remains that dying effects the (soon to be) dead, while death effects those who are left behind. While it is possible that others in this person's life influenced them in a way that lead to them doing something despicable, I just can't make myself feel okay with glorifying what would otherwise be viewed as a tragedy simply for not liking something that someone did. Imagine the anguish that family or friends might feel if they somehow came across what has been written? It might not be as terrible as killing a lion, but it's still not 'good'. And 'good' is a pretty low bar to strive for as a person, at least for me. I want my empathy to reach farther than that.
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I agree with LadyBastilla. I didn't say in my previous post, but as much as I may despise a person for their actions I personally cannot bring myself to celebrate their death.
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Do you have a link? I'm not finding any articles that Walter Palmer died. It would be big news, I imagine.
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I agree with LadyBastilla. I didn't say in my previous post, but as much as I may despise a person for their actions I personally cannot bring myself to celebrate their death.
My feeling as well.
Whoever he was, and whatever he did do, its still a death and it effects those that are close to him.
That said, I don't agree with what this person did (even if they aren't the one that killed Cecil). Hunting is ok--especially if its for survival but you need to be respectful of it.
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Bah. With 7.4 billion humans in the world it's easy to stop caring.
There are only 18,000 lions left in the wild.
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I wouldn't go as far as being glad but I am relieved there is one less sport killer out there.
Also while I have sympathy for his family I don't have any for his friends. We don't choose our family but we do choose our friends and the only people who would be friends with someone who does awful things is someone who doesn't feel those things are awful.
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Bah. With 7.4 billion humans in the world it's easy to stop caring.
There are only 18,000 lions left in the wild.
^ This!
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Bah. With 7.4 billion humans in the world it's easy to stop caring.
There are only 18,000 lions left in the wild.
In the wild, yes.
Too bad there are game parks where lions are bred to be hunted for sport. :(
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Bah. With 7.4 billion humans in the world it's easy to stop caring.
There are only 18,000 lions left in the wild.
In the wild, yes.
Too bad there are game parks where lions are bred to be hunted for sport. :(
Yes. I was telling my bf about this thread and he had me watch something called Adam Ruins Everything where some guy was going on about reasons trophy hunting is "good". I understand that in our sick, backwards world that's actually how some countries pay for wildlife preservation. Doesn't mean I have to agree with or like it, though.
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Bah. With 7.4 billion humans in the world it's easy to stop caring.
There are only 18,000 lions left in the wild.
THIS.
I just don't agree with hunting at all, whether a species is abundant or not.
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Now that's karma whoever it was. The only way I can get behind shooting an animal is if you live in a poor country and are hunting to feed your family or if an animal is attacking you or a loved one.
I can't wrap my mind around hunting an endangered, or threatened species to preserve it. That's the stupidest logic I ever heard and the only thing it serves is a pitiful excuse for uncaring jerks to kill animals for absolutely NO Reason whatsoever.
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Well in some cases some game farms are the only reason some species are still with us presently. I do hate the idea of trophy hunting though.
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Well in some cases some game farms are the only reason some species are still with us presently. I do hate the idea of trophy hunting though.
Is this along the same lines of "If we didn't eat [blank], [blank] would go extinct!" or "We kill [blank] to conserve it!"
It's like hunters who cry that if they didn't kill deer the deer would take over the world. But if the hunters hadn't killed off the wolves first then it wouldn't be an issue.
All of this is caused by and the fault of HUMANS. Hunters are not doing any "favors" by keeping a species alive that they've pushed into a state of existence that causes suffering.
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I think it is just awful that anyone one rejoice in the death of a human being regardless of what they have done. I do not rejoice in the death of animals, but what a horrible death and what a tragic thing for all this man's family and friends to face. I can't ever have enough rage in my heart to justify this logic.
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It's sad what happened to Cecil. But in reality, big game hunting (in a controlled environment) does help the African conservation and tribes. The money goes to conservation efforts and the meat goes to the tribes surrounding the areas. Unless you've visited or lived in one of these areas, I really don't think we have room to talk. Our first world problems are nothing in comparison to third world conditions.
We can sit on our high horses and say "who ever hunts is evil, how dare they!" but even I remember growing up in the rural south a deer a winter kept our family fed. Without that deer, no we might not have starved, but we sure wouldn't of had any meat.
Whether humanity caused the over population by killing the wolves or big cats or whichever predator kept numbers down is not revelent now. It's been done. It's a hundred years in the past. We owe the population of deer (and other animals) the right to exist without over population, starvation and disease.
To rejoice over another human dying is sick. That man left behind a family, possibly children who will grow up without a father. I'm greatly disturbed to see people happy he died. I don't care what the circumstances were. It was a horrible accident. I hope to the Gods the people who are happy about this, never loose a family member in an accident like this.
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I don't believe I (or anyone else here, although I guess I could be wrong) are exactly celebrating or are rejoicing over the death of this person in any way. Loss of a human life is a very serious thing that I personally take very seriously. I think what we're trying to convey is a lack of sympathy for the victim (although not their family), not happiness of a loss.
But like I said I can't speak for everyone heh.
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I don't believe I (or anyone else here, although I guess I could be wrong) are exactly celebrating or are rejoicing over the death of this person in any way. Loss of a human life is a very serious thing that I personally take very seriously. I think what we're trying to convey is a lack of sympathy for the victim (although not their family), not happiness of a loss.
But like I said I can't speak for everyone heh.
Pretty much this at least for me. I'm not the biggest fan of my own species, i just like individuals. As a rough whole, humanity can be really awful towards itself and other creatures.
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Now that's karma whoever it was. The only way I can get behind shooting an animal is if you live in a poor country and are hunting to feed your family or if an animal is attacking you or a loved one.
I'm not sure what you define as a poor country. Plenty of people in the US rely on controlled, legal hunting to eat.
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Now that's karma whoever it was. The only way I can get behind shooting an animal is if you live in a poor country and are hunting to feed your family or if an animal is attacking you or a loved one.
I'm not sure what you define as a poor country. Plenty of people in the US rely on controlled, legal hunting to eat.
Yes this is so true. There are people living off the grid all over the place. Funny thing is that our ancestors all hunted to eat. Back in 1800 there wasn't a plug in fridge and a Walmart Super Center down the street. LOL I have never liked hunting much. My father was a huge hunter and it upset me a great deal, but bio dad grew up in the country on a farm and they didn't eat if the boys didn't go fishing or hunting. Grandmother had a huge garden and they never went to the grocery store. When I was a child I remember being out in that garden with her picking things for our lunch.
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Now that's karma whoever it was. The only way I can get behind shooting an animal is if you live in a poor country and are hunting to feed your family or if an animal is attacking you or a loved one.
I'm not sure what you define as a poor country. Plenty of people in the US rely on controlled, legal hunting to eat.
As in 3rd world, plus there are people who still retain the same lifestyle as their ancestors.
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Doesn't have to be third world. Arkansas is one of the lower income, I guess poverty states. I know plenty of people that use hunting as their source of food. I have one co worker that if they don't hunt during season and have their own meat through that they don't eat meat. Living is expensive
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Now that's karma whoever it was. The only way I can get behind shooting an animal is if you live in a poor country and are hunting to feed your family or if an animal is attacking you or a loved one.
I'm not sure what you define as a poor country. Plenty of people in the US rely on controlled, legal hunting to eat.
Yep, Growing up we were.. still am considered lower/middle class? My dad hunted and fished seasonally to put meat on the table. Still hunting for pure "sport" has never been a very comfortable idea to me. And the primary theme of this topic is very disturbing. >.< No matter how terrible he might have been, or anyone.. rejoicing in a death, bottom line, just seems a bit gross and immature.
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Then we will simply have to agree to disagree and leave it at that.
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Now that's karma whoever it was. The only way I can get behind shooting an animal is if you live in a poor country and are hunting to feed your family or if an animal is attacking you or a loved one.
I'm not sure what you define as a poor country. Plenty of people in the US rely on controlled, legal hunting to eat.
As in 3rd world, plus there are people who still retain the same lifestyle as their ancestors.
Walmarts and grocery stores don't exist on every single street corner, and even when they do their goods are sometimes unaffordable. There are even some areas where hunters can donate meat they don't need/want to places like soup kitchens and shelters. Poor people exist in every country and everyone needs to eat. Some areas of the US have really extreme poverty. When my boyfriend first told me about some of the areas he drove through in Mississippi I was shocked.
And I mean, all of our ancestors hunted... even in first world countries. If our ancestors didn't hunt we wouldn't exist. You don't have to live in a third world country to prefer to do things "old school" the way your ancestors did.
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Have you heard the news yet? The douche who killed Cecil The Lion is dead! Apparently he was shooting birds in Italy, slipped on some ice, and fell off a precipice.
:satisfied: Karma much?
Why are you gloating that someone is dead? Also, it's not karma; we're all going to die.
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I have no issues if people hunt as long as the meat is not wasted - eg people hunt to eat, not for sport as like what happens a lot here in the UK.
This bloke died killing for sport, not for meat. There is nothing on this planet that can convince me that killing for fun is OK. I have already said, but I will say it again - I feel sorry for his family and friends. But I have no sympathy for him as an individual.
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Now that's karma whoever it was. The only way I can get behind shooting an animal is if you live in a poor country and are hunting to feed your family or if an animal is attacking you or a loved one.
I'm not sure what you define as a poor country. Plenty of people in the US rely on controlled, legal hunting to eat.
As in 3rd world, plus there are people who still retain the same lifestyle as their ancestors.
Walmarts and grocery stores don't exist on every single street corner, and even when they do their goods are sometimes unaffordable. There are even some areas where hunters can donate meat they don't need/want to places like soup kitchens and shelters. Poor people exist in every country and everyone needs to eat. Some areas of the US have really extreme poverty. When my boyfriend first told me about some of the areas he drove through in Mississippi I was shocked.
And I mean, all of our ancestors hunted... even in first world countries. If our ancestors didn't hunt we wouldn't exist. You don't have to live in a third world country to prefer to do things "old school" the way your ancestors did.
Also hunted animals have a much better life and death than the meat you find in the grocery store. Factory farming is pretty awful towards animals from birth to death.
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To rejoice over another human dying is sick.
Then I guess I'm just sick, eh? ;)
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Regarding "hunting for food" - I agree that some people need to hunt for food. People like those in Appalachia, a lot of whom don't have running water or electricity and the soil they live on is poisoned. They hunt raccoon, rabbits and squirrels. With dogs and traps. Because they NEED TO hunt for food.
They don't sit in a tree stand with a six-pack watching the corn they set out for a squirrel to wander by.
They do not have exclusive membership to a lodge where they gather 'round the fire and talk about that legendary raccoon that got away.
They don't kill the healthiest, biggest buck (rabbit) "That's a prize 8-pointer!", take pictures with it, brag about it, post everything on Facebook and then make sausage out of it.
So, yeah. I agree some people need to hunt for food. But it's not the same people any of you are talking about.
PS. You don't need meat to OMGLIVE through the winter.
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Careful guys--no need to pull on some sensitive strings.
I believe the point was some people live in areas where they rely on hunting to live--like a homestead in Alaska for example. They rely on the stuff they gather and hunt in the fall to get them through to the winter months <3
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No one ever said anything like what you're implying, BlackCurtains.
Please do not put words in my mouth or make baseless assumptions about what I do or do not support. People all over the US and the world need to hunt for food for all kinds of reasons. That's all people have been saying.
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I think that this topic is only going to get uglier... everyone has there own opinion on the matter that they feel very strongly about (I have my own) but I can't foresee this ending on a positive note.
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I think that this topic is only going to get uglier... everyone has there own opinion on the matter that they feel very strongly about (I have my own) but I can't foresee this ending on a positive note.
[removed - df].
Post Merge: December 21, 2016, 04:04:18 AM
To rejoice over another human dying is sick.
Then I guess I'm just sick, eh? ;)
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Regarding "hunting for food" - I agree that some people need to hunt for food. People like those in Appalachia, a lot of whom don't have running water or electricity and the soil they live on is poisoned. They hunt raccoon, rabbits and squirrels. With dogs and traps. Because they NEED TO hunt for food.
They don't sit in a tree stand with a six-pack watching the corn they set out for a squirrel to wander by.
They do not have exclusive membership to a lodge where they gather 'round the fire and talk about that legendary raccoon that got away.
They don't kill the healthiest, biggest buck (rabbit) "That's a prize 8-pointer!", take pictures with it, brag about it, post everything on Facebook and then make sausage out of it.
So, yeah. I agree some people need to hunt for food. But it's not the same people any of you are talking about.
PS. You don't need meat to OMGLIVE through the winter.
I'm so glad you had any idea what it was like growing up poor in northern Alabama. When yes, that deer kept us from growing hungry. So did the goats milk from the two goats we raised and the vegetables my mom was able to can from the summer. You have no freaking clue. There were no jobs, people were lucky to have one person working a minimum wage job or if you were really lucky maybe the one factory in town was hiring. Way to be rude.
[edited - please watch your language and do not call other members names. DF]
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So... you DIDN'T sit in a tree stand with a six-pack? Or go to a lodge? Or take pics and post on social media? And you ate other things, like canned vegetables?
Cool. So maybe I'm not talking about you?
And I might not have grown up poor, but after I moved out I was super poor. Like, couldn't afford both rent and electricity poor. I ate rice and beans *shrug*
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So... you DIDN'T sit in a tree stand with a six-pack? Or go to a lodge? Or take pics and post on social media? And you ate other things, like canned vegetables?
Cool. So maybe I'm not talking about you?
Who are you talking about?
Who is saying that is acceptable behavior... NO ONE HERE is, that's for sure.
What everyone is saying is-- Some people need to hunt to provide food on their table for their families. While I have mixed feelings on that, and I don't because it's not necessary, but it's very hard to argue that SOME families NEED to do it.
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Last warning to be nice before this gets locked, guys.
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Sigh, I was afraid this thread would risk being locked. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I think I'll just repeat that I don't believe anybody is celebrating this person's death and leave it at that.
....Tee hee not quite. I do remember learning that many communities in Alaska live off the grid like that! No electricity or anything, they grow and hunt their food for themselves. They actually have veterinarians fly out and use community shelters to care for the pets, since regular animal clinics are inaccessible. As much as I am addicted to technology I think that's really neat.
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I too am afraid this thread will be locked.
I will not celebrate his death. Why? Because his family is hurting. Death is horrible. There is only one person in the world whose death I will be celebrating, if he gets that penalty, but that's another story.
I have been desensitized to hunting. My dad hunts. But he also eats the meat. And if he knows bringing home the meat is a waste of time (the rest of the family hates it), he will pay to have it processed and donate it to a homeless shelter.
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I apologize DF. Obviously I'm to close to this topic. I'm going to gracefully bow out.
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Who are you talking about?
"Hunters"
Who is saying that is acceptable behavior... NO ONE HERE is, that's for sure.
Go back and read. It's totally okay to kill endangered species because it feeds local tribes. It's basically the same thing, and it's the same "hunters" that do it.
What everyone is saying is-- Some people need to hunt to provide food on their table for their families. While I have mixed feelings on that, and I don't because it's not necessary, but it's very hard to argue that SOME families NEED to do it.
Same! I already covered that.
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Maybe, I dunno. I follow more of this kind of thing than most of you? Did you know that you can even watch TV shows on American TV where people "hunt" zebra and stuff? That's sick. Unnecessary and disgusting. People brag about the animals they kill on social media all the damn time. And it's isn't because it's a VITAL NEED. They just want to kill something. Like that guy who killed his neighbors dogs when they got loose in the woods. He was sitting in a deer stand! He knew they were his neighbors dogs! He shot them anyway! He bragged about it on Facebook! It took place in Ohio, I believe, recently.
When I hear someone say "I hunt" - I automatically assume they are THOSE kinds of "hunters" because the fact is the majority of the time, they are!
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As far as the other topic of being pleased when a gross, destructive person is killed? Hell yes, I am.
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No one here has supported people randomly killing pets. That is not hunting. It is obviously not what anyone is talking about in any way.
You are seriously twisting things and making way too many assumptions.
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Who are you talking about?
"Hunters"
Who is saying that is acceptable behavior... NO ONE HERE is, that's for sure.
Go back and read. It's totally okay to kill endangered species because it feeds local tribes. It's basically the same thing, and it's the same "hunters" that do it.
I did read it! It seemed people were misunderstanding one another, and talking about two different things. It was confusing.
You were talking about someone sitting with a 6 pack, killing a bunny, and bragging on social media..... Not a tribe killing endangered species when I asked my question.
Which no one here would disagree with. That's disgusting.
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I agree with LadyBastilla. I didn't say in my previous post, but as much as I may despise a person for their actions I personally cannot bring myself to celebrate their death.
Seconded. I hate hunting, largely because of the UK's issues with fox hunting in the past (that has zero justification in the modern age) but I also can't celebrate a person's death. That's like celebrating the hunter's kill. Its just not fair.
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Unless you don't eat meat at all you can't really say anything against meat hunting. Animals raised for food lead very bleak lives and never know freedom.
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Annnd that's quite enough. DF and my warnings were ignored so this will be locked.