The MLP Arena
Pony Talk => Pony Corral => Topic started by: SeashellnBubbles on February 16, 2013, 08:18:42 PM
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I'm fairly new to FiM and don't quite understand what Taobao is or what makes them special? The photos I've seen look a lot like what we have available here, so is there a difference in packaging? What is it about them that makes them desirable? Oh, and an example photo or 50 would be great, too! :)
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Taobao is pretty much Chinese Ebay... Most of the ponies from there are prototypes and franken ponies
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Taobao is pretty much Chinese Ebay... Most of the ponies from there are prototypes and franken ponies
The thing that gets to me, they are sold with no provenance. They come with no COA (certificate of authenticity) which means they will down the road not hold there value. I have seen some fun ponies in Brags but that worries me a great deal.
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So, are they real ponies, or are they a sort of knockoff? If they can produce them legally, but messing around with them, who makes the money off them?
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There are a lot if theories about where prototype TaoBao ponies come from. As they are being purchased from their place of manufacture and sometimes are never seen in packaging, many of these products have likely "fallen off the truck."
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Ditto to lots of theories.
It's possible that factory workers get them for free, it's possible that people steal them from trash bins to sell... It's a very grey area.
I personally don't even think it's the average worker that is selling the goods, I think it's some sort of supervisor position that can snatch/get them to resell.
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There in lies the issues I have with them. You are supporting black market then by buying em. Add in from a collectible stand point, the lack of value due to no documentation and you have a pretty pony I would not pay more then retail for.
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Taobao is fun because you can get ponies that got tossed because they were color tests or prototypes that will never ever be sold (such as the glitter clear brushables- the first shot of Bubbles/Derp, or white fashion style celestia. I collect the oddities too (frankenponies- ie alicorn rarity-
Or- like the blue pony with butterfly symbol that the UK pony fair used for its exclusive- or the green one us pacific NWies used for ours...
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Thanks for this post, I too was wondering author taobao.
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People here have had great descriptions, but I want to throw in my 2 cents, too.
Origins:
All of the ponies individual parts were made in the factory (ie head, body, wings). All parts are identical to official ponies' parts. The hooves have the hoof stamp, and sometimes the manufacturing date, just like the official ponies, too. The heads have the same stamps on them as well, under their hair. That doesn't mean that the whole pony was assembled at the factory though. It is kind of a moral grey area because don't know if people are stealing them, getting them for free or if they take advantage of Hasbro, etc.
Types of ponies available:
Regular ponies - Most of the time, you will find completely normal ponies here, the same as what is sold in packages, except in bulk
Error ponies - Sometimes reject ponies with dirt on them, terrible hair, stains, or paint problems are sold
"Franken-ponies" - These are simply jumbled up ponies, where people either switched heads/tails or did not assemble the ponies properly. Most are just jumbled parts of existing releases.
Test ponies - A subset of the franken-ponies, occasionally, you will see ponies that have different hair, eyes, symbols, or parts that any existing ponies. The factory likely made these for testing purposes, and they were never used for any existing releases.
Prototypes - Very rarely, actual prototypes will pop up on Taobao. These are ponies that are clearly the earliest design of a new product, not just random combinations of parts.
Worth:
Errors (quality problems) - less than $5
Regular ponies - same as regular releases (most around $5)
Franken-ponies - Most of these will be worth around $5
Test ponies (subset of Franken-ponies) - anywhere from $5 to $50
Prototypes - generally fetch beyond $50, with the most popular, Minty probably being worth several hundred dollars.
TL;DR, you can sometimes find ponies on Taobao that are not available anywhere else.
Taobao is pretty much Chinese Ebay... Most of the ponies from there are prototypes and franken ponies
The thing that gets to me, they are sold with no provenance. They come with no COA (certificate of authenticity) which means they will down the road not hold there value. I have seen some fun ponies in Brags but that worries me a great deal.
Yeah most of those are only worth $5 and are just fun to collect because they are oddities. People are using the word "prototype" for everything, too, but a lot of the ponies are just scrambled up ponies.
I am guessing the actual prototypes will probably hold their value though, since they are unique from existing ponies, have hoof stamps, date stamps, etc, and would be too hard to be faked outside the factory.
I am curious though, do any ponies ever come with certificates of authenticity? Who would issue that sort of thing?
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wow if we had this with G1s....
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In some ways we have had products such as this across all generations - check out "prototypes" in the Nirvana Gallery for pictures of the tiny amount that have made it into collectors hands. There have in the past popped up prototypes of G2 and G3 ponies as well.
It is simply that with G4 and the opening of the Chinese market we have access to a site which a lot of collectors can and do use - therefore with this generation we see and hear about many more "prototypes". If we had the internet and Taobao and collectors and a more open Chinese market 30 years ago I am sure we would have had something similar with G1.
BrightIdeas description of what you can find is spot on - covering all the possibly categories and as she says the problem is the "prototype" description. The vast majority of ponies which are listed on Taobao are identical releases to what we finally get in store, damaged/discarded product or "made up" product from discarded parts. There is only a tiny amount of what could perhaps be called "prototype" - white Celestia and Minty and Sweetie Blue and the transparent/glittery main 6 - probably being largely the only ones which fall into this category. As Diamond says these dont come with any kind of traceability so reselling them with a pedigree is not possible.
Taobao only exists in reaction to ebay trying to enter the Chinese market - it works in the same manner but doesnt actually charge sellers for what its service. Often the products listed come legitimately [i.e. not stolen or not from user] from factories to resellers. Factories simply produce more than the client orders and resell them on to sellers to sell on Taobao. In the case of Hasbro and most other companies like them, you cant actually buy any of their Chinese made products in China so they are not loosing any market share. It is a problem which exists for many many manufacturers but it is also a balance of the risk you take in outsourcing your production to a third party.
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In some ways we have had products such as this across all generations - check out "prototypes" in the Nirvana Gallery for pictures of the tiny amount that have made it into collectors hands. There have in the past popped up prototypes of G2 and G3 ponies as well.
It is simply that with G4 and the opening of the Chinese market we have access to a site which a lot of collectors can and do use - therefore with this generation we see and hear about many more "prototypes". If we had the internet and Taobao and collectors and a more open Chinese market 30 years ago I am sure we would have had something similar with G1.
BrightIdeas description of what you can find is spot on - covering all the possibly categories and as she says the problem is the "prototype" description. The vast majority of ponies which are listed on Taobao are identical releases to what we finally get in store, damaged/discarded product or "made up" product from discarded parts. There is only a tiny amount of what could perhaps be called "prototype" - white Celestia and Minty and Sweetie Blue and the transparent/glittery main 6 - probably being largely the only ones which fall into this category. As Diamond says these dont come with any kind of traceability so reselling them with a pedigree is not possible.
Taobao only exists in reaction to ebay trying to enter the Chinese market - it works in the same manner but doesnt actually charge sellers for what its service. Often the products listed come legitimately [i.e. not stolen or not from user] from factories to resellers. Factories simply produce more than the client orders and resell them on to sellers to sell on Taobao. In the case of Hasbro and most other companies like them, you cant actually buy any of their Chinese made products in China so they are not loosing any market share. It is a problem which exists for many many manufacturers but it is also a balance of the risk you take in outsourcing your production to a third party.
Wow! Now I get it! Thank you so much for clearing it up for me.
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Brightidea- I agree those are the categories- great way to sum it up! Although I have noticed that the mix-up/franken ponies/test ponies have been more pricey lately- more like $14 - $22 (based on ebay prices)
There is no real point getting a "regular" pony from Taobao- because since even if the pony is a dollar or two, the shipping from Taobao to your agent+agent fee+shipping from agent to you works out to $10 or more per pony- which is way more than the store.
The only exception is probably Shining Armor- which customizers want to make customs of- and even paying $12 or so per Shining Armor is better than buying the entire castle just to bait the Shining Armor from that set... wish they'd just go and make him a regular release.
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i do think taobao is a big grey area that im not sure weather the ponys are worth it or not
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I think that without any kind of evidence at all that someone is "stealing" the ponies, we shouldn't make assumptions that they are stolen :P
I only wish there was a Taobao back in the 80s and 90s when all the prototypes, color tests and franken ponies from the G1 lines were coming out - as it is, just a few of them have trickled down to collectors. It makes me shudder to think how many ended up in landfills...
I looooove my prototype ponies from Taobao :D