The MLP Arena

Pony Talk => Pony Corral => Topic started by: Al-1701 on April 24, 2017, 04:35:41 PM

Title: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Al-1701 on April 24, 2017, 04:35:41 PM
I'm sitting down to tell a story of Megan becoming the Weather Witch's apprentice.  I've known this for a while, but it was really in my face as I started planning things out.  There's nothing to her character.  Characterizations were not all that deep or involved in MLP media at the time, but you got the sense of the ponies' foibles, flaws, and mannerisms.  You were given enough to fill in the gaps and have a pretty good idea of what they would do in their free time and what they want.

Megan was so vanilla that you couldn't even get that out of her.  She had no foibles, flaws, and was just on default nice.  I had to write a backstory to justify her interest in the weather and wanting to be the Weather Witch's apprentice.  I thought about how I was impressing so much original head canon on her character.  However, I wasn't breaking her character because you can give her just about any interest and there's nothing to contradict it because there is nothing there period.

Even Danny gave you more of a sense of his character.  "The Great Rainbow Caper" and "The Return of Tambelon" showed his interest and ability with technology.  Megan?  Nothing.  She's just Little Miss Perfect who is always kind and nurturing.

I stand by the assertion having humans in G1 MLP was not the problem.  The problem was how Megan was presented.  She needed flaws and vulnerabilities so we had a reason to cheer for her alongside the ponies and even her own siblings who had flaws and vulnerabilities to spare.

Anyway, Megan, the vanilla of MLP, GO!
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: LadyMoondancer on April 24, 2017, 04:54:49 PM
I completely agree.  Her siblings had more personality, while Megan was just, like . . . generically nice?

She was better in Rescue At Midnight Castle because she had an actual character arc, where in the beginning she was filled with self-doubt, telling Firefly "I can't do this, your friends are going to be disappointed when they see it's only me", and then being determined to try anyway, and finally realizing that, yes, she DID have the bravery to fight Tirak.

I kind of wish we hadn't seen her ever again after RaMC because it was such a good, complete character arc, and I feel her return kind of . . . ruined her.  For the reasons you said.  (Also it really screwed with the continuity, lol.)

I think making her the Weather Witch's apprentice is a pretty interesting idea, though!
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: dragonfly on April 24, 2017, 05:25:05 PM
That'll be an interesting read! I was never a fan of Megan & co. And where were their parents? And I felt kinda bad poor TJ never got in on any of the fun stuff.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Taffeta on April 24, 2017, 05:37:49 PM
You definitely have to wonder where the parents were xDD

I agree totally about Megan. It's like she was forcibly thrust in there to be the 'little girl every girl wanted to be like', roaming around ponyland and helping the ponies solve problems they could obviously solve without her there, as they had clearly been doing so from long before. It always irked me she had the Rainbow of Light when she wasn't in ponyland half of the time, too.

I think she is that kind of vanilla character who always has the right lines to say - and so they sometimes come out cliche. I also think that she's the kind of character kids might have resented more than liked because she was there in with the ponies and there wasn't anything particularly special about her to say she should be priveleged like this (if that makes sense?)

As a kid, I had four episodes of MLP on VHS and I actually am not sure if Megan is in any of them. Someone can probably tell me. I know she's not in Ice Cream Wars or, I think, Revolt of PE which were the ones I had and watched the most. The others were Sweet Stuff and the Treasure Hunt and the Would Be DragonSlayer. I think Megan is a judge in the Treasure hunt but it's a bit part? And I can't remember with the other at all. So she didn't figure hugely in my childhood. She's rarely in the comic (I remember her being in a story with smooze and occasional other appearances but never in a huge sense). Yet I also remember as a child actively disliking her. I never wanted Megan and Sundance as a kid because Megan was involved, so as a kid I had zero interest in Sundance, either.

Considering the animation had such a minor impact on my perception of her, I think that genuinely for me it was the idea of a human in the ponyverse that I disliked. But I didn't dislike characters like the Weather Witch and so on - they BELONGED in that world, whereas Megan didn't. Thinking about it now I realise my rationale was actually quite complex and specific (although I also hated blond dolls at the time, so that might have been a part of it as well).

In terms of Danny, I actually quite like him, most of all because of the crossover into Jem. Basically there's a character called Danny in an episode of Jem who is a teenage runaway. He has very similar features to the MLP Danny, and so my headcanon is that (bearing in mind we see no parents for these guys) that Megan, Molly and Danny ended up in care and Danny thus ran away and turned into a troubled teen for Jem and friends to help.  In this episode of Jem, Danny runs away from an abusive father and ends up getting some of Jem's orphans into trouble with him, also running away. But at the end he helps save the day by interfering with Techrat's technology to allow JATH to play. You mentioned his technology interest, and that is hinted at here too. I absolutely am sure, considering that Jem and MLP writers and voice artists crossed over, that there was an inside joke here that this was the same character. Danny never had a doll, so there would have been a lot of carte blanche to do something like this.

Screencapture of Danny from Jem (The Music Awards) with MLP capture for comparison:
Spoiler
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That headcanoning through Hasbro's own products gives Danny depth for me that would otherwise be lacking.

I don't really have an opinion on Molly, although she is as blond as Megan, but then she wasn't a doll here, and was even less in my awareness than Megan was, as she didn't appear in the comics at all I don't think.

So I would say yes, Megan is vanilla, but no, it's not just about that which makes her irritating. There is also (at least in my case) some anti Real World humans entering Ponyland bias involved as well.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: lostpony on April 24, 2017, 05:43:02 PM
Maybe you can just have Majesty come dispose of her and paradise estate and set up shop in the castle again...

But what would you put in the second paragraph?

Har har.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Gator on April 24, 2017, 06:10:31 PM
In my opinion, Megan and family live on their farm with TJ, have parents, and every now and then the Pegasus ponies bring them to Dream Valley for visits.  Almost like a Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe kinda deal.  Adults don't know about this magical world they have access to.  I too like Midnight Castle Megan the most.  The series Megan was too much cotton candy blue and pink.  I do like how she and Sundance come together in Katrina. 
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Baby Sugarberry on April 24, 2017, 07:10:58 PM
I'd wager Megan was left deliberately blank, much as what's-her-name from Twilight, for the same reason.  Both are meant as viewer/reader inserts, for whomever is watching to drop themselves into the story along with a very stereotypical little brother and little sister.   I mean the bushwoolies have more character development than Megan...  :huh:

She's just very... decent at everything, has no outstanding flaws and thus no real room or motivation for improvement.  It's also what makes her rather bland, since it tends to be a characters struggles that make them feel human.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Ponyfan on April 24, 2017, 07:21:07 PM
I'm pretty sure all of the trips to Ponyland took place when the parents were away or somehow time in Ponyland isn't the same as our time. After all Megan, Molly and Danny spend several days at a time in Ponyland how come no one ever notices they're missing?

In Rescue at Midnight Castle when Firefly is brining Megan home it doesn't look like any time has passed from when she left. It is still dark and TJ is still in the stable.


Ponyfan
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Kazzellin on April 24, 2017, 08:17:06 PM
What kinda irks me with the "humans in ponyland" scenario actually is from RaMC. Scorpan -
 aka, the prince. End of episode, then never heard from or of again. I guess he rules ponyland? :huh:  Who knows. Maybe the ponies were grooming and testing Megan to be his bride or something? :lol: That could be why she's so nice and vanilla - she fits with many of the first Disney princesses. :lol:
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Koudoawaia on April 24, 2017, 09:29:30 PM
Yeah the reason I don't like Megan is she's too perfect especially for someone that young. Prime example of a Mary Sue.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: orangepeachmango on April 24, 2017, 10:56:32 PM
i was just wondering the other day why they decided not to include humans in regular ponyville g4, and if anybody missed megan. i sort of mulled it over and decided that Why would Anybody miss megan, she was so darn boring; and they decided not to put humans in g4 so they could get more money by doing equestria girls.
though its not really the same thing, since theyre like, purple and stuff. i think they could still squeeze in megan if they wanted to. but i doubt they want to.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: northstar3184 on April 24, 2017, 11:42:11 PM
I like the theory that was pitched by one of the arena members awhile back: What we're seeing when we watch the G1 episodes is Megan's imagination when she plays with her toys. That's why we don't see any of her flaws. She isn't old enough/mature enough to see her own flaws so she comes across as the perfect little girl in her imagination. This theory would also explain the simplistic, one-dimensional characterizations of the ponies and other characters; a lack of continuity between stories; and why there's a rotating cast of characters.

We all know the real reasons for these attributes, but from a story perspective this theory ties it altogether.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Al-1701 on April 25, 2017, 02:34:06 AM
I've never liked the St. Elsewhere scenario.  It feels like a cop out.

Even the writer's guide was bland with Megan's characterization.  All the ponies were given these different mannerisms and going modes of behavior.  Megan was literally described as the perfect teenager role model for the little kids.

I've explained it as Megan and her siblings only visit during summer vacation, and the entire n' Friends series took place over one summer.  Mostly they only do day trips, but sometimes they stay overnight and explain to their parents they're out camping.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Mewtwofan1 on April 25, 2017, 09:14:45 AM
Megan was bland. I think the writers did this because toys. Make a pretty blonde chick save the world with ponies and rainbows, and little girls will buy it. Doesn't have to have any character at all. "Heck, make her as flat as my desk. Just make sure little girls will buy the toys! Or else you're fired!"
-hasbro
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: LadyMoondancer on April 25, 2017, 09:23:38 AM
Is anyone familiar with Spike (not the dragon lol) from G1 Transformers, and if so do you think he was more interesting than Megan, less interesting, or about the same?

I didn't think he was super interesting, and he also had the "I don't have any real flaws" thing going on, but he seemed a little more "real" to me than Megan.  I think he worked better because he spent a lot of time being interested in and learning about the Transformers, whereas with post-RaMC Megan, there didn't seem to be anything for her to learn about the ponies;  she knew enough about them / their world that they turned to her when there was trouble.   Whereas TF Spike was constantly being amazed by the Transformers, and was often kidnapped to kick off the plot.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Koudoawaia on April 25, 2017, 10:27:48 AM
I think Transformers Spike was a lot more engaging than Megan myself.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: brightberry on April 25, 2017, 11:45:24 AM
I liked Megan in the first two specials.   She wasn't essential, but I liked how the ponies loved her company.  I always thought Firefly brought her to give the others encouragement/hope.  Maybe many of the ponies felt so defeated by Tirek, they didn't believe in their own abilities and just needed some fresh energy.

However, the ongoing show made her too much of a crutch.  As a kid, I missed the original ponies and didn't care from how they went from "talking ponies" to humans in pony costumes.   :P   

I also kind of feel that Megan was an ok character, just over used.  The ponies should have kept her visits limited and kept the rainbow of light hidden with her.  I guess as a kid, I assumed she held onto the rainbow to help keep it from pony enemies.  Apparently, they have a lot and ponyland was frequently invaded.







Edit:
I thought Spike was more interesting than Megan.  But I also frequently thought Spike was an embarrassment to human kind.  :blush:
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: LadyMoondancer on April 25, 2017, 12:36:24 PM
Edit:
I thought Spike was more interesting than Megan.  But I also frequently thought Spike was an embarrassment to human kind.  :blush:

:lmao:

I did like how he was buddies with Bumblebee, they had a good dynamic.  Even though Megan was sold with Sundance, they didn't really interact after Escape from Catrina.  (Actually I think Sundance only got a speaking line once in MLP & Friends, which is strange.)
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: orangepeachmango on April 25, 2017, 12:57:12 PM
Is anyone familiar with Spike (not the dragon lol) from G1 Transformers, and if so do you think he was more interesting than Megan, less interesting, or about the same?

I didn't think he was super interesting, and he also had the "I don't have any real flaws" thing going on, but he seemed a little more "real" to me than Megan.  I think he worked better because he spent a lot of time being interested in and learning about the Transformers, whereas with post-RaMC Megan, there didn't seem to be anything for her to learn about the ponies;  she knew enough about them / their world that they turned to her when there was trouble.   Whereas TF Spike was constantly being amazed by the Transformers, and was often kidnapped to kick off the plot.

I think he was just as boring as she was. What do you call a male version of a Mary Sue? The main character!
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Al-1701 on April 25, 2017, 03:05:44 PM
Spike was little more interesting than Megan, however it was because he was a mechanic so he, Sparkplug, and Chip were often involved in helping the Autobots with their projects.  They also stayed out of most of the fighting, keeping to a support role when the action started.

Danny filled that roll more with the ponies like making the recording of Bray to trick Grogar.  All Megan did was boss them around.

It would have been better if they had kept Megan a bit apprehensive about the ponies' world.  What if she ended up trapped in their world?  There's an idea.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Gator on April 25, 2017, 04:23:45 PM
Despite the haters, I will always like Megan
http://foxspotted.deviantart.com/art/Saying-Goodbye-192930324
Lord knows most of my life I've prayed for something magical to come take me away to something better.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: dragonfly on April 25, 2017, 04:41:16 PM
I'm not sure who was more whiney, Shady, G1 Spike or Molly.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Strawberry Swirl on April 25, 2017, 04:51:15 PM
I've always kind of felt that in most of the original cartoon's episodes, Megan was there to drive the plot and the ponies were just there because they were required to be. You can guess that I like watching episodes that are without any of the human characters a lot better as a result.

Also I never got into Jem stuff but I totally agree with Taffeta's headcanon. >:3c
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Ponyfan on April 25, 2017, 07:23:37 PM
I think Megan was maybe supposed to a character that little kids watching the show could imagine was them. I never had a Megan doll or Sundance growing up and I agree that Megan's best appearance is in Rescue at Midnight Castle where she doubts herself and even though she isn't sure how to defeat Tirek she's willing to try.

I like the idea that Megan keeps the Rainbow of Light with her to keep it hidden from the ponies enemies. I think it's funny that at the end of Escape from Catrina she gave the locket to Powder but by the time the movie came out the ponies had to find her to get it back.

I do like how the ponies deciding to get Megan in the Golden Horseshoes is handled. The ponies get Megan when they realize Mimic's illness is not something they've seen before. 

Ponyfan 
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: lostpony on April 25, 2017, 08:48:42 PM
I'm not sure who was more whiney, Shady, G1 Spike or Molly.

I'm.the whiniest.

No wait, I wasn't in G1. No fair.

If there's a reboot, I wanna be dragged to Ponyland and none of you will be complaining about me being boringly perfect...maybe being too whiny, "i'm in Ponyland, how come I don't get to have hooves or wings", that kind of thing.

I agree it seems Megan is there so we can replace her with ourselves, and she has to be important so we can be heroic in our fantasies, yes just like in Narnia.

As to the ponies being people in pony costumes...G4 does seem more like people as ponies than in G1 so maybe there's no humans in G4 because we insert ourselves as ponies. Or maybe dragons or apple trees, no wait that's Fluttershy and she's already in G4.

Just trying to liven things up a bit.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: kissthethunder on April 25, 2017, 08:56:35 PM
I'd wager Megan was left deliberately blank, much as what's-her-name from Twilight, for the same reason.  Both are meant as viewer/reader inserts, for whomever is watching to drop themselves into the story along with a very stereotypical little brother and little sister.   I mean the bushwoolies have more character development than Megan...  :huh:

She's just very... decent at everything, has no outstanding flaws and thus no real room or motivation for improvement.  It's also what makes her rather bland, since it tends to be a characters struggles that make them feel human.

I'll second this, Megans purpose was always the viewing childs insert character. I think she was purposely made that way while other characters were far more fleshed out.

It, like most things, was a marketing ploy to make her a desirable 'perfect pony girl' for young girls to pretend to be and I think she served that purpose very well.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: MJNSEIFER on April 26, 2017, 11:02:18 AM
I agree with those who have said that Megan was essentially supposed to be "you" (the target audience was, and still is girls after all), pretty much the first thing I thought of was that the over all feeling of Megan was supposed to be "She's making friends with the ponies, that means I could make friends with the ponies!", but literally being a stand-in for the viewer makes sense too.

Ulitmately I don't have anything against Megan, in fact I genuinely like her, but my main opinion her is that she served her purpose.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Motion-Paradox on April 26, 2017, 04:03:24 PM
Well they do have parents, in the movie we see Molly practicing horseback riding and Megan says "By the time Mom & Dad get back you'll be a champ"

I have to admit though, her having the Rainbow of Light made sense to me for two reasons: 1- The Ponies don't have fingers and Button's is the only one with levitation magic. 2- If I remember correctly there were a few villains who either wanted the Rainbow of Light or who likely would have wanted it, so having it be held onto by somebody who lives in a different world would be good for keeping it safe.

Though one thing we can get from her character is that she values fairness, which may be why she's made the judge for contests and whatnot since she is also a nutural third party, though the issue you're having could serve as a starting point; She could still want to help the Ponies, but feel limited by her role as the species' big sister and want to become the Witch's apprentice to help her get a better idea of who she is
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Jinxxy on April 26, 2017, 10:24:58 PM
I always assumed she was just a basic blank slate for any little girl to project themselves onto. If they had strong opinions and likes/dislikes it might interfere with that.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Taffeta on April 26, 2017, 11:18:05 PM
I always assumed she was just a basic blank slate for any little girl to project themselves onto. If they had strong opinions and likes/dislikes it might interfere with that.

If this is the case, though, it royally backfired, since so many people grew up not really liking her very much. Or is that just those of us still into MLP and the ones who used Megan as a SI moved on from the series?

(Not trying to generalise, I am sure there are some Megan fans still among us, but the vast majority of the time people here seem neutral towards her, or to dislike her).

I saw her as irrelevant as a child and resented her being there when she was, so it totally failed to work on me. But as I said before, I loathed blonde dolls because it was all we ever had in the UK. I wanted some ethnic diversity, even at age five - so Megan was absolutely not getting any attention from me. (This all bearing in mind I was a white, British kid who, at that time, had blond hair).
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Al-1701 on April 27, 2017, 01:57:26 AM
I've wanted to say Megan is fair, blond, and blue eyed because she is of Scandinavian heritage which actually has some bearing on her connection with Pony Land.  Hey, the ponies use a natural occurring Bifrost to reach her ranch and the G1 world has many things based on Norse and other Northern European mythology and folklore.

I'm with Taffeta that if they left her blank to be an insert character, it backfired.  She had just a little too much personality for that, and was far too overbearing on the ponies.  This is their world, and she is a visitor.  The relationship should have been the opposite with the ponies competent and protecting and guiding Megan through a world filled with wonders and terrors.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: MJNSEIFER on April 27, 2017, 05:49:47 AM
She had just a little too much personality for that, and was far too overbearing on the ponies.  This is their world, and she is a visitor.  The relationship should have been the opposite with the ponies competent and protecting and guiding Megan through a world filled with wonders and terrors.
This would have been a much better choice, I think.  It would have helped the whole "She's filling in for the viewer" thing, if that's really what her purpose was, and would just make generally more sense.  They can still have her be the one to solve things sometimes, like if two ponies fell out, she could help there, but have the ponies be the ones looking after her more, especially during the adventure stuff.

Side note: Does anyone else like how her full name is coincidentally the first name of one G4 writer (albeit spelled differently) and the surname of another?  On the 1% chance she's used in G4, I want those two writers to write the episode.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: LadyMoondancer on April 27, 2017, 07:52:05 AM
The thing about the "she's the proxy for the viewer thing" is that, first of all I don't think kids really need a proxy to imagine that they're best friends with the heroes.  Just look at anyone's early fanfics, lol.  I used to pretend I was BFF with the X-Men, but it never occurred to me to pretend I was Jubilee, the kid-appeal character. (I did like Jubilee, but I didn't particularly identify with her and she wasn't my fave.  My fave was Gambit, then Storm and Wolverine about equally.)

Second, I think a lot of kids prefer to pretend that they're one of the ponies, not a human hanging out with the ponies. Like, dang, we go through our lives being human anyway, let's pretend we're something magical for a while, lol.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: MJNSEIFER on April 27, 2017, 08:50:20 AM
The thing about the "she's the proxy for the viewer thing" is that, first of all I don't think kids really need a proxy to imagine that they're best friends with the heroes.
Yeah, good point.  I think a lot of us did that as kids, I mean I totally did, and sometimes of still do. 

Second, I think a lot of kids prefer to pretend that they're one of the ponies, not a human hanging out with the ponies. Like, dang, we go through our lives being human anyway, let's pretend we're something magical for a while, lol.
Maybe that's one of the reasons they dropped the humans - they realised everyone was putting themselves in the ponies' place more?
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: lostpony on April 27, 2017, 10:05:54 AM
I might have more of a megan opinion if i watched when i was a kid. Now, i really don't. She seems ok to me. I suppose. Seems nice enough.

I find it odd that no one has stepped up to say they really like her. Did no one?

Wonder if thats why no humans at all in later gens.

Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Galactica on April 27, 2017, 10:10:25 AM
I think they had Megan and later Molly simply so they could sell dolls for the line, plain and simple. Lets remember that the SOLE purpose of vintage MLP cartoons was to sell product.

I actually really loved the dolls as a kid but NEVER liked the Megan cartoon character. She was so bossy and SUCH a know it all. Way worse than I was at that age (lol). 

I didn't like Molly either since she was such a crybaby. But again, I loved her doll...
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: LadyMoondancer on April 27, 2017, 10:21:10 AM
I think they had Megan and later Molly simply so they could sell dolls for the line, plain and simple. Lets remember that the SOLE purpose of vintage MLP cartoons was to sell product.

Ha ha, good point!  "Why sell just ponies when we could sell ponies AND dolls?"  I never had the Megan or Molly dolls, but I did love the picture of Megan in the brochure.  I loved her dress (which is funny because I hated wearing dresses as a kid, lol) and her hair was just perfectly done.

Picture of it from Ponyland Press (http://www.ponylandpress.com/pamphlets/):

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Looking back, I don't think I even thought of cartoon-Megan as the same person as doll-Megan.  Doll-Megan looked so much younger.  Also I had an impression that doll-Megan was more of a "solo" girl who just hung around with Sundance, not with ALL the ponies.  Probably I thought this because the brochure pic has her a fair ways away from Dream Castle, with it far in the background. 

Also the phrasing "in SEARCH of new friends and exciting adventures".  Sitting around at Paradise Estate is not being "in search" of anything. So I thought she was just having travel-adventures with Sundance.  Like a blonde Indiana Jones in a dress.

I also had no idea what Sundance's symbol was since it was hidden in the brochure picture and since I never got the set.  I was pretty disappointed when I finally saw it.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: lostpony on April 27, 2017, 10:44:27 AM
That picture does suggest all those things and that doesn't even look like the cartoon megan.

I like Molly for her pigtails. That's all i need in a human pony character and megan doesn't even have em so i barely notice she exists.

Is that bad? :what:
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Koudoawaia on April 27, 2017, 12:03:54 PM

Second, I think a lot of kids prefer to pretend that they're one of the ponies, not a human hanging out with the ponies. Like, dang, we go through our lives being human anyway, let's pretend we're something magical for a while, lol.

A little bit offtopic maybe but this is pretty much exactly why I prefer playing non humanoid characters in games. It's like, I'm a human already. Why would I want to play one?
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: brightberry on April 27, 2017, 02:04:28 PM
LadyMoondancer, your kid thoughts about doll-Megan were adorable!   
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Gator on April 27, 2017, 03:06:51 PM
More Megan appreciation art:

http://foxspotted.deviantart.com/art/Rainbow-bars-the-way-206810842

http://foxspotted.deviantart.com/art/Sky-Battle-206774425

http://foxspotted.deviantart.com/art/poster-206810143
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Ponyfan on April 27, 2017, 03:45:12 PM


Second, I think a lot of kids prefer to pretend that they're one of the ponies, not a human hanging out with the ponies. Like, dang, we go through our lives being human anyway, let's pretend we're something magical for a while, lol.

Good point. :) I don't ever remember prentending to be Megan but I do remember watching the Glass Princess and pretending that I was one of the ponies being tied down to the conveyor belt and forced to go through the pony wash.

Ponyfan
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: scarletjul on April 27, 2017, 03:48:34 PM
I do think Megan was meant, if anything, as the self-insert character.  And if she backfired, well...  those characters often do.  It isn't just her; there's a lot of people who don't like Bella from Twilight for the same reasons.

Personally, I don't mind her.  I'd much rather be watching the ponies, but she doesn't bother me.  And I do like her dolls, for that 80s aesthetic.  :)
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Baby Sugarberry on April 27, 2017, 04:54:56 PM
The thing about the "she's the proxy for the viewer thing" is that, first of all I don't think kids really need a proxy to imagine that they're best friends with the heroes.  Just look at anyone's early fanfics, lol.  I used to pretend I was BFF with the X-Men, but it never occurred to me to pretend I was Jubilee, the kid-appeal character.

They don't, but what kids actually like/want has never played a big part in board room decisions by executives.  They'll go with what they THINK kids want, or what they think they SHOULD want, and push that.  So much of marketing is ass-backwards, to the point where popular shows get canned just because they pulled the 'wrong' demographic.  -_-

I greatly disliked Juibliee as a child.  I thought she was utterly useless and dumb, I mean fireworks? BAH.  Give me Storm or Jean Grey any day of the year over her. I liked Gambit and Wolverine too, because they were cool.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Haruna on April 27, 2017, 07:46:04 PM
I hadn't thought about it much before now, but I definitely agree with those who like Megan in her first appearance (Firefly's Adventure/Rescue At Midnight Castle) where she's a brave and interesting character. I didn't see My Little Pony and Friends until I was in my teens, and I still haven't seen all of them, but my general impression of Megan is meh. I don't hate her, but I could see why some people would dislike her; she's kind of a know-it-all and bossy, like a big sister, which I would not have liked as a kid. (I was the big sister myself, so that may have something to do with it.) :P

Maybe you can just have Majesty come dispose of her and paradise estate and set up shop in the castle again...

:lol: It bothered me so much when they gave up Dream Castle in the movie!! I was like, no! Keep your pretty castle!! There are only, what, five Grundles? They don't need the space, lol!

Despite the haters, I will always like Megan
http://foxspotted.deviantart.com/art/Saying-Goodbye-192930324
Gator, I like your art! I looked at some of your other pictures, too. "Flight of Ponies" I like especially. They remind me of my childhood a little -- my games were like what you're drawing, with the exception of Megan, who I didn't have as a kid.

I actually really loved the dolls as a kid but NEVER liked the Megan cartoon character. She was so bossy and SUCH a know it all. Way worse than I was at that age (lol). I didn't like Molly either since she was such a crybaby. But again, I loved her doll...
Yeah, when I got the Megan doll from a thrift store ponies in my older teens, I fell in love. She's an extremely sweet doll. I love her original dress and since getting her I've slowly collected all of the dresses I can for her (So Soft, Twice as Fancy, Flower Maidens, and some other outfits). Currently she's wearing a dress from a thrift store that happened to fit (not many doll clothes do, so I'm always happy to find clothes small enough). When I was a teenager I tried sewing her a dress myself; I learned I am no seamstress :lol: Like Lady Moondancer said, I don't really associate the doll with the cartoon character, for some reason.   
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Al-1701 on April 28, 2017, 02:26:52 AM
One thing the show did that I liked was there was apparently a friendship between Megan and Wind Whistler.  Wind Whistler was the pegasus pony she most often rode (she even photobombs Megan and Sundance in the second U.K. release).  Since WW is the designated heroine of Dream Valley (especially in my imagination), her and Megan being close makes sense.

Unfortunately Sundance was literally just an extension of Megan in their backcard, and we know what happened in Escape from Catrina.  Though, I like this idea that they had a falling out because Sundance treated Megan like a pet and loved putting her in dresses that matched her favorite cloaks.  Buttons thanked whatever deity the ponies worshiped when Megan finally said enough and spent more time with Wind Whistler.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: daffodil101 on April 28, 2017, 04:14:01 AM
I mostly liked her in the cartoon series, though we didn't have the full range, just a couple of video tapes from the local video shop.  Our favourites were the Magic Coins and the Quest of the princess ponies, and Return of Tambelon.  (Trying to remember if she even appeared in the Quest episode!)  But I loved her in Magic Coins.  I guess it depends on the episodes-- there were some where she did seem to be there for no particular reason, getting in the way of the plot rather than adding anything to it.  To me though, it's sort of like the Neverending Story.  You know-- how it was completely magical in your memory, and then you re-watch it as an adult and just can't quite believe how awful it is!  and yet the memories are that it was the best thing ever.  Even if it the cartoons were terrible, I'd still love them because of the childhood memories.

But if anything bothered me in particular, it was how tall she was drawn in the cartoons!  I felt she'd be too heavy to ride a pony that only came up to her elbow.  But I was never particularly anti-Megan.  In fact I think there's something kinda sweet and innocent about having a bland, perfect-ish character, something nostalgic.  I mean ponies were originally aimed at preschoolers and probably younger kids than some other toy lines.  I also loved the voice actor,and that she was also Rainbow Brite :

I've never liked the doll of her though (though her outfits are adorable), her face is really weird to me.  One day I'll try to find a Lady Lovely-locks doll as a stand-in!
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: bright rabbit 1 on April 28, 2017, 05:39:13 AM
I didn't have either Magen or Molly dolls, when I was little and I'm not going to be buying them from eBay.uk because they're expensive (on buy it now or auction).

I had a little rag doll that I called Megan, but now that I'm collecting ponies again I'm just gonna use Barbie sisters as the characters. As they fit on the ponies.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Mana Minori on April 28, 2017, 07:42:49 AM
i was just wondering the other day why they decided not to include humans in regular ponyville g4, and if anybody missed megan. i sort of mulled it over and decided that Why would Anybody miss megan, she was so darn boring; and they decided not to put humans in g4 so they could get more money by doing equestria girls.
though its not really the same thing, since theyre like, purple and stuff. i think they could still squeeze in megan if they wanted to. but i doubt they want to.
we already have Cadance, who is just as vanilla
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: bright rabbit 1 on April 28, 2017, 08:43:33 AM
i was just wondering the other day why they decided not to include humans in regular ponyville g4, and if anybody missed megan. i sort of mulled it over and decided that Why would Anybody miss megan, she was so darn boring; and they decided not to put humans in g4 so they could get more money by doing equestria girls.
though its not really the same thing, since theyre like, purple and stuff. i think they could still squeeze in megan if they wanted to. but i doubt they want to.
we already have Cadance, who is just as vanilla


Too true, I hate Cadance more than Megan.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Al-1701 on April 29, 2017, 05:49:18 PM
I would have to say Cadence is worse than Megan.  Megan is a girl from Somewhere, USA.  Cadence is the princess of the Crystal Empire?  What's her excuse for being as bland as she is?
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Baby Sugarberry on April 29, 2017, 08:10:18 PM
I would have to say Cadence is worse than Megan.  Megan is a girl from Somewhere, USA.  Cadence is the princess of the Crystal Empire?  What's her excuse for being as bland as she is?

Probably a bunch of old guys sitting around a board room table going "Little girls need a perfect princess otherwise they won't be interested!"
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: LadyMoondancer on April 29, 2017, 08:23:41 PM
Cadence wasn't even supposed to be an alicorn originally (just a unicorn), but gotta sell those pink alicorn toys!  I actually think Hasbro decided to alicorn her up after changing the Pepto-Bismo Celestia toys to white.

Cadence is kind of blah, but she's better than Megan because:

- she's not in most of the episodes, whereas Megan was in nearly every episode.
- no one immediately says "Quick, we have to get Princess Cadence!!" every time a crisis happens.

Like, I find Cadence completely contrived and unnecessary, but she's also pretty much a background pony, so I'm okay with her.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: kissthethunder on April 29, 2017, 10:19:53 PM
-sheepishly raises hand- I like them both. Funny thing is, my daughter who's their target audience loves them both too and went through a phase of stealing my Megan dolls to use with her ponies. Cadence is her favorite Princess. So while it's cool you don't like them, there's many people, especially children, who do. I myself have to remind myself that the toy brand is not catered to adults or collectors who will speculate on things being well designed and well written, but for little girls.

While it's amazing that the love of ponies has spread as far as it has, beyond gender and ages, I still think it's important to recall who it's meant for.

Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Al-1701 on April 30, 2017, 03:53:33 AM
My ire with Megan mostly comes from the viewpoint of a storyteller.  The ponies have spent their entire lives living in their world.  Why should they need a thirteen year old girl to tell them what to do?  On top of that, there is nothing to her character beyond being nice.  You essentially need to start from scratch with her even write something in canon with the series.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: lostpony on April 30, 2017, 04:23:30 AM
Because she's the viewer-insert character, for at least viewers who want to be with ponies but not Be ponies.

Besides, how is it a problem for writing? You can write anything you want n its congruent. Or, write nothing at all about her and just write about ponies.

Who wants to write about a bland character anyway. Wait, shes not just nice, others have said she's bossy so she does have flaws. As to the ponies' reliance on her, that's wide open: you can give any answer you like, and you are automatically right.

Seems more like a problem we want to have.
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Al-1701 on April 30, 2017, 10:58:48 AM
Perhaps.

Something I had thought is to end the story with the grundles running out of the castle and handing the ponies the keys and would give them their last months rent if they were paying rent.  The ponies go in and find Majesty lounging on her throne and she says, "Ponies, you're rightful queen and mistress has returned."
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Carrehz on April 30, 2017, 05:23:23 PM
I'm pretty sure all of the trips to Ponyland took place when the parents were away or somehow time in Ponyland isn't the same as our time. After all Megan, Molly and Danny spend several days at a time in Ponyland how come no one ever notices they're missing?

In Rescue at Midnight Castle when Firefly is brining Megan home it doesn't look like any time has passed from when she left. It is still dark and TJ is still in the stable.


Ponyfan

This has always been my headcanon (or whatever you'd like to call it), too. I always figured time ran differently in Ponyland, similar to Narnia - it just makes the most sense to me. :)

I like Megan, personally; I can totally see why others wouldn't though. (Heck, I didn't think I'd like her until I actually saw RaMC ^^;)

In terms of Danny, I actually quite like him, most of all because of the crossover into Jem. Basically there's a character called Danny in an episode of Jem who is a teenage runaway. He has very similar features to the MLP Danny, and so my headcanon is that (bearing in mind we see no parents for these guys) that Megan, Molly and Danny ended up in care and Danny thus ran away and turned into a troubled teen for Jem and friends to help.  In this episode of Jem, Danny runs away from an abusive father and ends up getting some of Jem's orphans into trouble with him, also running away. But at the end he helps save the day by interfering with Techrat's technology to allow JATH to play. You mentioned his technology interest, and that is hinted at here too. I absolutely am sure, considering that Jem and MLP writers and voice artists crossed over, that there was an inside joke here that this was the same character. Danny never had a doll, so there would have been a lot of carte blanche to do something like this.

Screencapture of Danny from Jem (The Music Awards) with MLP capture for comparison:
Spoiler
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That headcanoning through Hasbro's own products gives Danny depth for me that would otherwise be lacking.

Ooooh, this is interesting :O I agree, that's definitely got to be intentional on *someone's* part - they're way too similar for it to be just a total coincedence XD Did they both have the same VA?
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: lostpony on April 30, 2017, 08:12:41 PM
Perhaps.

Something I had thought is to end the story with the grundles running out of the castle and handing the ponies the keys and would give them their last months rent if they were paying rent.  The ponies go in and find Majesty lounging on her throne and she says, "Ponies, you're rightful queen and mistress has returned."

Hm, ok then but to keep this on topic, Majesty gestures and some other UK pony steps forward and hands an envelope to Megan. She opens the envelope and the letter inside begins something like:  "Thanks for your services but they are no longer required. Please return the rainbow of light and clean out your desk forthwith." Two more UK ponies step forward and walk Megan out of the castle and out of Ponyland.

(Sorry i dont know the names well enough to know which ones would be right)
Title: Re: The Issue With Megan
Post by: Firehooves on May 17, 2017, 11:02:06 AM
Perhaps.

Something I had thought is to end the story with the grundles running out of the castle and handing the ponies the keys and would give them their last months rent if they were paying rent.  The ponies go in and find Majesty lounging on her throne and she says, "Ponies, you're rightful queen and mistress has returned."

You do remember, I already did just that in my stories, right? And made the whole thing a conspiracy by Truly? Boy, how fast people have forgotten my work! XD

Anyway, Megan is an interesting problem for G1; she really does seem to lack any kind of defining personality trait. And having them solve ALLLL the ponies problems, as well as having her be the ponies go-to problem solver, didn't exactly endear Megan to the MLP fans back then. It's funny she is accused of dominating the show, while the ponies actually had more personality than she did.

My idea for exploring Megan is; how did a preteen girl react to being dragged into a fantasy world, and having her life put in jeopardy time and time again?  Did she experience any kind of emotional trauma because of it? And one thing I explored, why would she want to go back to a 'normal' life, once she had been and heroine in another world, and made all those friends? So I had her settle in Ponyland.

I'm interested in what others would do with her! ^^
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