The MLP Arena
TCB => Trader & Shipping Support => Topic started by: aniko79 on July 11, 2013, 11:14:12 AM
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Hi all, I got an Argie snuzzle two days ago from a popular ebay seller and when I opened her to clean her I was completely shocked. She was utterly dirty inside and the metal ring which held her tail was broken into pieces due to rust.I contacted the seller today about this problem asking for a partial refund and she reacted very unprofessional and completely furious. She said that I am evil to do this because she has two babies and needs the money urgently:-( I will never buy from this seller anymore that's for sure! What would you do in my situation?
Moving this over to Trader Support for you. SnorkMaiden, WYP mod
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Sounds like she reacted pretty unprofessionally-
but honestly I have very very rarely received a pony or doll from Argentina that was not really dirty...
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but..how could she know what the pony looks on the inside? and isnt dirt cleanable? its a used toy. i wouldnt refund to this reasons. the worth isnt affected to me (maybe little cause of the washer but she couldnt see it)
i myself onetime sold something for about 3€ (normally way more expensive and i had fees etc) and she wanted money back cause she said something on the inside where broken. i got really angry too cause there are people who do this with every single item to get them for free or lower the price afterwards
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Was the pony's head removed when you bought it? What was the auction description like? Did you ask before you bought it?
In my experience every Argentina pony I had was filthy on the inside, and I had to replace almost all the washers ect. It's really not that uncommon and finding one that isn't disgusting I think is a miracle. I think typically the really clean nice Argies I've bought have already been in a collectors hands and were cleaned up.
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If you could see the pony had tail rust from the outside (which you often can by discolouring of the tail where it leaves the pony) and it wasn't mentioned then fair dos a bit of cash back should be expected.
However if the pony had no visible signs on the outside that she was a rust heap inside then you can't do a lot unless of course the head was loose and the seller knew about the condition.
A tip for cleaning would be clothes washing powder in warm water, worked on my lemon drop only bits left in her are bits in the legs i can't get too.
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I don't personally know anything about Argies, but I don't think it's ever appropriate for a seller to call a buyer evil. They could have dealt with this calmly and professionally.
As for asking about flaws beforehand, I don't always think that's a valid excuse. I don't think a seller is exempt from describing their items accurately because it's somehow the buyers responsibility to ask about all flaws an item could potentially have. Granted that doesn't seem to apply here.
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What was the description in the listing? Were there pictures? It's hard to say what I'd do without knowing the details. The seller's overreaction, though, was unnecessary.
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Can you be a little more elaborate on the situation? And can we please have a link to the auction?
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If there was no visible rust, then the seller is not at fault, especially if her head was sealed. From my understanding, breaking the seal on the head actually damages the value? At least on non-Nirvana's. I would not refund you either, if those two bits were true. I would not break a seal on one of my ponies to make sure they are clean inside as well as out. I would list the item as-is, period. When you break open the seal, it's yours, and if the tailwasher is broken inside, it's not a major issue, nor is the rust. Cream of tartar will fix that up. Most ponies are going to be dirty inside. They are a kid's toys and if they're coming from a non-collector, even more so.
Basically, let me put it this way. You buy a computer, okay? Well, the computer won't turn on, so what do you? You crack it open and you try to fix it. However, you can't, but you still want the seller to replace it? No, you voided the warranty and protection because the item is NOT in the condition in which it was received, whether it was broken previously or not. Sorry.
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If there was no visible rust, then the seller is not at fault, especially if her head was sealed. From my understanding, breaking the seal on the head actually damages the value? At least on non-Nirvana's. I would not refund you either, if those two bits were true. I would not break a seal on one of my ponies to make sure they are clean inside as well as out. I would list the item as-is, period. When you break open the seal, it's yours, and if the tailwasher is broken inside, it's not a major issue, nor is the rust. Cream of tartar will fix that up. Most ponies are going to be dirty inside. They are a kid's toys and if they're coming from a non-collector, even more so.
Basically, let me put it this way. You buy a computer, okay? Well, the computer won't turn on, so what do you? You crack it open and you try to fix it. However, you can't, but you still want the seller to replace it? No, you voided the warranty and protection because the item is NOT in the condition in which it was received, whether it was broken previously or not. Sorry.
Hmm I never thought about this (as far as a neck seal) before. Does breaking the neck seal negatively effect condition listing? It's true that if the seal was intact then breaking the seal would be a deviation from the original condition. However, if it was broken in order to clean her and repair her then the benefits of opening might outweigh the negative of breaking the seal. Unreturnable as a result?
If there was no outward indication of problems then I am guessing the buyer here would not have cracked open the neck seal. So they must have had some reason to think the innards had a problem, or else the seal must have already been broken. But if the seller didn't know much about ponies I'm sure they didn't think to pull the head off to look inside.
All and all I think the seller was rude in response, but depending on clarification of a few questions I don't think they meant to mislead you.
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Let's wait and see what the OP has to say in regards to this before we make any accusations. Thanks PonyLady
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I don't think breaking the neck seal to clean the inside of a pony would damage the value. On occasion I have had to do so to clean ponies that has nastiness inside. Sometime mold will grow inside a pony especially if it was used as a bath toy.
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I've bought well over 100 ponies from Argentina, and unless they are still in the package this is the condition that every single one was in. It's pretty much to be expected when buying an Argentina pony. I personally would not expect the seller to give a refund in this case. I do agree that the seller's reply was rude, but the condition is par for the course.
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I've bought well over 100 ponies from Argentina, and unless they are still in the package this is the condition that every single one was in. It's pretty much to be expected when buying an Argentina pony. I personally would not expect the seller to give a refund in this case. I do agree that the seller's reply was rude, but the condition is par for the course.
I have to say I agree.
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Also Argentina ponies don't have a glued neck, so breaking the seal is moot point. I forgot to include that in my original post.
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I am just not sure how fair it is to expect someone to look inside their pony before selling. Goodness, I would never expect that. I guess my opinion on this really doesn't matter much. I just know I have never asked a seller to check the inside of my pony and I probably never will. Good grief I mean what if I had to remove the head and arms of every doll I sold? Well, anyway...its just something I have never considered. This is just an opinion its not meant to accuse or suggest something was done wrong by anyone. I am just thinking out loud. :satisfied:
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I've bought well over 100 ponies from Argentina, and unless they are still in the package this is the condition that every single one was in. It's pretty much to be expected when buying an Argentina pony. I personally would not expect the seller to give a refund in this case. I do agree that the seller's reply was rude, but the condition is par for the course.
One learns new things every day about collecting ponies. Especially Nirvana, there's so much to learn! :D Thankfully we have some real experts here on the Arena!
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Thank you all for your reply. Well, the neck seam was not sealed. The tail has been Cut, too but I didn't notice that on the fotos in the Internet. Well I understand if she just says, something like I am sorry I can't refund anything or so, It wasn't too much of a problem for me. The problem for me is that she got very rude and unfriendly, telling me things like I am evil and god should help me to find the right path etc. That is what makes me angry.
Post Merge: July 12, 2013, 12:33:38 AM
I wanted to add that I opened her because she had tailrust on the outside of her tail, which I also didn't see on the fotos in the auction.
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where the pony in the auctionphotos posed so you couldnt see the tailrust and -cut? would change a lot
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I agree. They don't have to refund you, unless they do out of kindness, since they are not obliged to, that's the risk you take when you buy a 30 year old pony. It's typical of these types of ponies...
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Well I can live without a refund and I really asked friendly, but I can't live with sellers getting so furious.
Post Merge: July 12, 2013, 01:33:35 AM
I didn't notice the haircut on the fotos but probably I might have noticed a slight beginning of tailrust, if I took the fotos upon closer inspection, but I couldn't have seen how horrible it really was. You are right that is always a risk, but it never happened to me to get a pony in as poor condition as this one:-(
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I'm very sorry that you had such a bad experience, and while sometimes Nirvana ponies from non collectors can arrive in pretty rough condition (- its actually pretty common ), that does not excuse the way the seller spoke to you :( do you have a link to the auction so we can see the original photos/description (and the seller ID) please? that helps us understand the situation better and then we can give you better advice on how to proceed :awake:
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I am sorry, I couldn't find a direct link anymore, but the sellers Name is Reinascarlet and it was snuzzle with blue hearts and blue hair. I will clean the Pony to the best of my ability and then she will wander off most probably to the sales thread. I am just upset that somebody so nasty has now 194 Dollars from me.
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Is this the auction?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/RSC-VINTAGE-ARGENTINA-MY-LITTLE-PONY-HASBRO-82-PEACHY-SNUZZLE-BLUE-HEARTS-/360673830200?pt=TV_Movie_Character_Toys_US&hash=item53f9d5e538&nma=true&si=zIXFbAiJ0VVREFpGnZt7C%252BNCeW8%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
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Ponylady, you are great! Yes exactly, that was the auction. I could hit myself that I have bought that Pony:-/
Post Merge: July 12, 2013, 07:23:34 AM
Would you leave Feedback for this furious Lady in my Position?
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If i looked at those pics I would have expected rust probably rust to the point of disintegrating washer. I can see it in the tail and the butt has a concave look as though the tail came out at some point and was pushed back in instead of properly repairing it.
But at the end of the day you didn't notice it.
I think you should consider how much this effects that value of the pony and then decide if she is still worth keeping. If it makes her value drop a lot below what you paid, then you should look into ebay protection policy and return for a refund minus shipping instead of going for a partial refund. If you are upset that this lady was rude to you, but the value of the pony isn't suffering, then perhaps keep her and restore. I understand she was mean and I am sorry. Yet, at the same time I wonder how much of your strong negative is a reaction to the condition of the item, and how much of it is your reaction to her rudeness. Does that make sense?
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Well, the worst Thing for me was her rudeness, much much more than the Pony's condition.
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Ponylady, you are great! Yes exactly, that was the auction. I could hit myself that I have bought that Pony:-/
Post Merge: July 12, 2013, 07:23:34 AM
Would you leave Feedback for this furious Lady in my Position?
that pony is extremely rare and sought after. you are lucky to have gotten her for that price even in that condition. infact if i didnt already have her i would have been biddding and would have offered more than that lol... buuuut im kiiiinda obsessed with argies so, ya know :P. so major congrats to you!!
ive bought several argies from that seller and never had a problem with rudeness but if i got that in a message i would be furious as well!! yikes!
i had a situation with an argie from a different seller where the pics purposely didnt show how dirty and rough the pony was. i asked for a partial refund and the seller obliged but then blocked me from any future purchases. which has been a total bummer since they always sell argies and lots of them rare. i have always regretted that.
im not saying you shouldnt be honest but maybe "a soft answer turns away wrath" might be appropriate here.
not for their benefit but for yours
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I'm very sorry that you had such a bad experience, and while sometimes Nirvana ponies from non collectors can arrive in pretty rough condition (- its actually pretty common ), that does not excuse the way the seller spoke to you :( do you have a link to the auction so we can see the original photos/description (and the seller ID) please? that helps us understand the situation better and then we can give you better advice on how to proceed :awake:
Yeah, I can more than agree with that. I don't agree that the person should get a refund, but at the same time, the seller acted very badly too. Zealotry is bad, bad, bad, and telling someone they need to their personal god to be fixed is ridiculous. If I had been the seller, I would've been. . .curt, but to the point, and not bring that sort of crazy to the table.
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Exactly- the dirty/rusty is very much an expected thing in an Argentina pony (it is very humid there and unless the pony was MOC it will have some tail rust) - and that pony you can tell has tail rust from the pix- so no surprise.
But... she reacted very poorly and unprofessionally to your inquiry. If she is selling on the international market, she should expect a few of the buyers aren't going to be overly familiar with Argie toys direct from Argentina.
I'm guessing what happened was that she can't afford to refund the pony, and read into your question more hostility than was there, and overreacted. If you aren't satisfied with the pony, you could always send it back for a refund. I would steer clear of Argies in the future though if I were you- since unless someone bought them and cleaned them all up, they are all going to look a mess inside.
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I completely understand your disappointment and I understand your miffed at her response. I am just curious though when you initially sent her a message about the situation, where you cordial and address the situation properly? I only ask because she is in a different country and language barriers can be an issue. I am not saying that you were rude to her but she may have taken your inquiry differently than it was intended to be. Just a thought?
As far as the pony itself, the pictures in my opinion are pretty clear on the condition. And as relcelestia mentioned she is a rare and sought after pony. But if you are not happy with her then you need to take the necessary steps and return her for a refund. :huh:
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Yes I was always polite and tried to describe the situation as good as I could, I am not an english native speaker, myself too and possibly she had really understood something wrong. I am sure she is not able to pay the refund. Snuzzle has been to spa this afternoon and is more or less clean now, but her hair is really horrible. I could consider keeping her if she gets new hair. Thanks to everyone who tried to help me!
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the seller is probably not a native English speaker, either. I wonder if s/he had to use a translator to read your message, and it translated badly/made it seem rude? I know even the best translating programs are not all that good...
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Yes I was always polite and tried to describe the situation as good as I could, I am not an english native speaker, myself too and possibly she had really understood something wrong. I am sure she is not able to pay the refund. Snuzzle has been to spa this afternoon and is more or less clean now, but her hair is really horrible. I could consider keeping her if she gets new hair. Thanks to everyone who tried to help me!
Yea I could tell by the photos her hair was in really bad shape. Sorry the seller was rude. I guess it happens sometimes. It isn't right, but it does happen. Maybe there are some cultural issues involved not just with the language barrier but, how people might interpret a complaint in their culture. Still all the same its hard to deal with rudeness.
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Yes I was always polite and tried to describe the situation as good as I could, I am not an english native speaker, myself too and possibly she had really understood something wrong. I am sure she is not able to pay the refund. Snuzzle has been to spa this afternoon and is more or less clean now, but her hair is really horrible. I could consider keeping her if she gets new hair. Thanks to everyone who tried to help me!
She wouldn't be difficult to rehair if that's what you want, but that will effect her value and condition so I'd probably try to save the original hair if at all possible. Relcelestia is kinda our argie expert here on the arena so I'd definitely go with her thought/opinions.
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Snuzzle has been to spa this afternoon and is more or less clean now, but her hair is really horrible.
That was very obvious from the eBay pictures:
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The top view you can see the tail rust and the hair issues, especially if you use the zoom in feature on the photos. Sorry to say but even if the seller was rude, product-wise you got what you paid for in this case. I always buy ponies on Ebay with the expectation they're gonna come in a TLC state since not all Ebayers are collectors that know what to look for.
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Snuzzle has been to spa this afternoon and is more or less clean now, but her hair is really horrible.
That was very obvious from the eBay pictures:
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Dang, I could even see her hair has very thick, deep frizz. Keep conditioning and straightening, and she should be right as rain :)
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I have rehaired several argies but only when they had mowhawks. And only with real G1 hair.
IMO this pony doesn't need to be rehaired. Especially since she's especially rare to begin with. A hair straightener will work wonders!
Having said that, it is your pony to do as you please :) but also know that rehairing will chop her value in half.
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After seeing the listing, I agree that the condition was clearly shown in the pictures. I think that pony is worth about $250-300, and rehairing would significantly lower the price from what the auction ended at. I would not expect the seller to give a partial refund without returning the pony for a full refund.
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I have rehaired several argies but only when they had mowhawks. And only with real G1 hair.
IMO this pony doesn't need to be rehaired. Especially since she's especially rare to begin with. A hair straightener will work wonders!
Having said that, it is your pony to do as you please :) but also know that rehairing will chop her value in half.
From the pictures she is missing some of the forelock. Is filling in with donor vintage hair still going to decrease around the same amount?
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Adding any new hair, even donor hair from another g1 pony would probably reduce her value to under $100. Most people looking for very rare Nirvana ponies won't pay high prices for a pony with an type of restoration. A pony with a major hair cut to its original hair is typically worth more than a rehaired pony. The condition of this pony's hair is not bad given how extremely rare she is.
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There we have it! Hopefully, now that you have some more information you can decide what you want to do. :)
Thanks for being so helpful everyone. I'm happy we have so many really knowledgeable users willing to help out.
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Yeah, this pony has enough hair to be salvaged and a good styler could easily cover most of the issue of the hair and soften it. It seems like you're looking at all the faults of the pony and not her rarity or her good points?
Maybe you should pass her onto another member, I've seen several people state you got a good price for her and have seen this pony go for more. Maybe you should offer her up for the price you paid, plus shipping and plus $10-$20? Then you don't have a pony you don't like, you've gotten your money back and money for the trouble, right?
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Is this pony really that ultra rare? I think I will treat her hair with conditioner and probably resell her.
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Is this pony really that ultra rare? I think I will treat her hair with conditioner and probably resell her.
I think that is probably the best thing to do :bigups: there are probably a lot of people who would love that pony in their collection even in that condition ;)
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I would love her :) I totally don't mind frizzy hair either. I'll have to check my bank account though.