Buyer Backed out of Sale NEED Advice regarding deposit.

[kasin]

I'm not neutral on this (full disclosure)

We talked off boards about this situation and I think it should be brought up that the buyer wanted to switch from the pony they agreed to buy to another pony from Embers collection that was not for sale after making the deposit. The buyer simply doesn't want this particular pony anymore and wanted to go shopping in Embers collection. When Ember refused to switch the buyer accused her of stealing and is now taking it to the card company to try to force Ember to pay her back or give her a different item currently not for sale.

My personal feeling is that when you agree to buy something its sold. You are now responsible for paying for it and the seller is responsible for sending it to you when you are done paying regardless of how many payments are made over whatever amount of time. Neither party should be backing out if they simply don't feel like doing the transaction any longer unless both parties agree. This situation is completely of the buyers making and therefore its their problem if they are stuck paying for a pony they decided they no longer want and it should not be the sellers problem.

I don't know, I'm really sorry Ember, this is a bad situation you did not make and I'm sorry your forced to deal with it at this time.

[Ember1]

OK so I now offered to refund her deposit when I am able to find another buyer for the pony she backed out of.

I think this is fair.. I did let her know before she made the deposit that the money was going toward paying rent. So I just don't have that deposit anymore as it was used up last month as I told her it would be. Its only fair now to allow me to find another buyer and have her deposit  refunded once I have that money in hand.

What are your thoughts...

[ponycake]

How awful. She is a member here? We all know what a deposit means. In the future, state it outright though. If it was a bank card instead of a credit card like it sounds, she wouldn't be able to file a claim right? How ridiculous, she's going to ruin it for those of us who want to buy something with a payment plan and can actually stick to our word.

[Galactica]

OK so I now offered to refund her deposit when I am able to find another buyer for the pony she backed out of.

I think this is fair.. I did let her know before she made the deposit that the money was going toward paying rent. So I just don't have that deposit anymore as it was used up last month as I told her it would be. Its only fair now to allow me to find another buyer and have her deposit  refunded once I have that money in hand.

What are your thoughts...

That seems like a fair way to mitigate the damages from her breach of contract.  Kind of like finding another person to take over on a rental that was supposed to be for a certain amount of months.

[ponycake]

From your sales post:

"Hi All. I am currently jobless and looking for work so I am afraid I will have to try and rehome this beauty."

And they are surprised you can't just send that much money back to them immediately and think you are stealing from them? She basically entered into a contract to buy her, in my eyes.

So sorry. Hope this resolves in a positive way.

[ponycake]

It was in the sales post even. "Hi All. I am currently jobless and looking for work so I am afraid I will have to try and rehome this beauty."

She basically entered into an agreement (contract) to buy this pony and she's backing out and expecting $500 to be sent back to her immediately from a seller who made it clear she was out of a job and needed money?

It's totally reasonable to me that she wait until a new buyer is in the picture. The buyer is the one acting immorally in my eyes. It's pretty frowned upon in general to back out of a sale once it's agreed upon here, right? And she's doing it with a pony over $500 that she put money into already?   

[goddessofpeep]

What a terrible situation!  I'm very sorry to hear you're going through all this.  Sadly, this looks like a case of what's right isn't going to happen, and what's going to happen is all wrong. 

This buyer has already shown you that she's a problem and not willing to work with you on this.  I'd be willing to bet that even if you had stated upfront that the deposit is nonrefundable, she'd probably try to get it back anyway.  I can understand the buyer wanting $500 back. That's a lot of money to be out with nothing to show for it. However, the buyer did create this mess, and an understanding person would hopefully be more flexible.  You're going to have to refund the money whether you like it or not.  It's probably better to refund it than to have either Paypal or the credit card  take it from you.  Paypal has been know to freeze accounts for less, and you really don't want that to happen.  She's also shown you that she's not willing to wait until you find another buyer, so you might as well bite the bullet and do it now before she opens a case. 

If I were in this situation, I'd refund the money(somehow), and tell that buyer that she is no longer welcome to buy from me again in the future (mostly for the attempt to shop from the collection, and making this more unpleasant than it has to be). I'd also pull together a small terms of service statement that will (hopefully) cover future problem transactions, and post it on all future ads and send it in all future business emails. 

I'm also very curious who this buyer is.

[NovelNerd]

While I completely agree this isn't Ember's fault without a no refund policy I do not believe its within her rights to hold that money. It's part of the not spending money till your buyer receives an item thing. When I've done payments I don't spend it till the item makes it home. I feel for you Ember because I've been in your situation before selling something and needing the money then having issues. In the end without a before buying agreement. I think one way of handling it in the future might be to say a certain percent of a large deposit is non refundable. You must get this time just explain to her that you didn't expect her to back out and we're counting on the money so you need to pay her back in pieces and see how it goes?

[Ember1]

Paypal has some rules to protect sellers thankfully.
Stated below:
---------------
However, our purchase protection does not currently cover buyer remorse or issues not listed above that buyers may experience with their purchases.
If you suspect that you are being targeted by a buyer while the case is open, please send us as much information as possible about any related transactions and why you think the buyer may be at fault.
If the case has already been closed, you can appeal the decision on your claim and specifically reference “buyer abuse” as the reason for the appeal.

[ponylady]

Before the drama even starts here....was it disclosed your $500 deposit was non-refundable?

There is no written rule here on the arena that deposits are non-refundable, each transaction here is between members. So unless you have disclosed this in your sales post or have proof through PM's then you are obligated, in my eyes to give this person back their money, unfortunately.

If this was $20 or so dollars, I might fell a bit different but $500??? How would you feel?

In all my years of selling I have learned one thing and it is don't spend money you technically do not have.  In this case it was a down payment for your rent and I would never have banked on that, she still owed you money for the pony. I honestly am not trying to be harsh but unless this a complete and finished sale, I just personally would not have spent that cash without knowing I could pay her back.

Also I want to point out that Paypal is not going to protect you, as you never shipped anything out. There is no proof of the sale, except you received money. They are going to want to know where the the item is??? Again not being harsh, just pointing out the facts.

 

[LadyMoondancer]

"Buyer's remorse" is considered a situation like . . . you sell a pony for $30, send it off, all is well . . . but then the buyer finds it online somewhere else for $10 and gets upset and starts haranguing you to accept a return.  In this case all PayPal is going to care about is that you received money and didn't send out a product.

Can you afford to gradually refund the $500 over a period of time?  That seems fair, since the other person gradually paid the deposit.

I feel for you, as I've been in a situation where I had to sell part of my collection to pay the rent too.  This is why I never accept gradual payments on items.  There's a weird feeling of the item being "on hold" all that time.

[Ember1]

the fact is from this point forward i will not be doing many payment plans. It truly is not feasable if the payment stretches over six months or more to keep every cent incase the buyer backs out. Its impossible if you are jobless. Anyways i have a few things for sale. Hopefully ill be able to refund her sooner rather than later with the money from those sales. Thats the most i can do.

[MikeysGrrrl]

I would think the best thing to do in this situation would be to part with something else in your collection that has a value around that amount. I know you said you weren't currently looking to sell anything at that value, but it would be the easiest way to please your buyer as well as yourself (not having to come up with money you don't have currently have).

That's what I would do anyways, I know I certainly couldn't cough up $500 out of the blue, I'm one of those people who almost always needs payment plans for anything over $40 unless I already have the funds available in paypal.

I do agree that once an arrangement has been made and a deposit has been placed, that 9/10 if the buyer backs out, the deposit is forfeited. However, those things are usually stated before money has changed hands. I'm not taking sides or placing blame, just providing my opinion along with a solution.

I hope you guys can get this sorted out so that no one is put out

[lovesbabysquirmy]

I am so sorry to hear that you are going through this Ember1.    truly sad after all you have done for the community.

Please feel free to PM me or share with us all, when all is said and done if you feel it is necessary...  *pony hugs*

[StarFaerie]

Deleted as it was very legal and I realised I didn't want to get into that.

But basically, I would suggest keeping whatever it has actually cost you like Paypal and bank fees and repaying the rest.