The MLP Arena
Pony Talk => Pony Corral => Topic started by: Wardah on May 18, 2020, 11:45:00 AM
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Those who have baity ponies on display or MOC ponies intact in yellowed packaging how can that not bother you? The reason to collect ponies (or toys in general) is to be able to look at pretty things. But if it's in bad condition it's not pretty at all.
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Baits can still be pretty!
I also collect to restore and clean up. I'll try to make a bait pony display as nicely as I can (I think curls negate the need for lots of body cleanup ha) but it's the journey not the destination or whatever.
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I had assumed this was gonna be a thread about what ponies other people considered ugly, but this seems pretty judgemental as a conversation starter.
People have the right to display what means something to them. I don't really think they need to justify it. :/
I mean, that 'baity pony' might be a treasured childhood memory.
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Yeah I agree with Taffeta, this isn't a kind way to start a conversation. It's very judgey sounding "I like pretty things, what's up with you that you don't?"
Just like in all things in life, Everyone has different preferences
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Just because your old toys are in good shape now, does not mean they won't develop problems eventually. This is the way of life. Everything decays.
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I ought to add, I don't collect ponies to 'look at pretty things', honestly.
I have zero problem with people who do, and wouldn't say anything against them for that preference.
But I collect MLP because of all the information and stuff around it. The nostalgia and the history. A beat up rare UK backcard or leaflet for me is way more precious in my collection than some of my loose ponies are, honestly speaking.
Everyone has a different reason for collecting, it's not a one size fits all.
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I am usually a fairly picky collector, but some of my most treasured ponies are original from when I was little and admittedly don’t display well. But when I thought about buying those same ponies in better shape to upgrade my collection I realized I wouldn’t love them near as much as the memories wouldn’t be there. Instead, I decided to try to find all my original ponies MIB or MOC so I can have my originals in their so-so condition to remember all the fun times I had with them as a child, but also the mint on card/box version to preserve my memory of first receiving them and all their awesome accessories.
So for example, now I have a Sweet Pop with faded hair and some cancer spots, but I also have her on US and Canadian cards just as I remember picking her out at Toys R Us. And to me that is the best of both worlds, so to speak. :)
Nicole
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A good few of my ponies are in more baity in condition I think it gives them more personality. My Waterfire has really bad scratches and cuts, I see them as scars because shes adventurous! I found them that way, I rescued them from thrift stores and flea markets
I clean them up and take care of them.
I see them as my friends, I could never just throw them away because they are "ugly"
I think its very superficial to only like the ponies that are perfect. Not to mention some people can't afford to pay 30$+ dollars for a single perfect or MOC condition pony. I don't know if its just the way you wrote this post but it just comes across as really rude and negative. The reason to collect ponies is because I love ponies regardless of condition.
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And to add to the points made by others, many G1 ponies are prone to plastic breakdown and other quality issues, so in many cases it is unavoidable. The pony you bought as mint/near mint several years ago may not be so minty when you unpack her from storage. I’ve been (re) collecting for about 20 years now and ponies that I originally bought as mint/nm have not all stayed that way. Many of my twinkle eye ponies for example have spots or plasticizer breakdown that has just shown up recently.
And to agree with another point, fixing up and restoring ponies who have had a rough life and aren’t in the best of shape in my opinion can be a lot of fun and you get the bonus of having done the work yourself. For me that gives me a greater attachment to them. For example, I have several ponies that I bought with severe haircuts just so I could replace their hair and I don’t think I will ever try to upgrade them because I adore them. They don’t always display as great as ponies in original good condition but that just makes them different and I’m ok with that.
Nicole
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Personally I pick each new pony carefully to make sure I've found one in the right condition, as I have a very limited space for ponies and prefer to focus on quality rather than quantity, but I can understand why someone would see appeal in baity, worn ponies :D
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I respectfully disagree. I get that collectors collect and like to look at a flawless collectible, but ponies were toys first and foremost. Kids playthings. If they have a few battle scars from surviving a kid’s dog or have survived the vicious roughhousing of some rambunctious Little girl’s playtime, then there should be no shame in that. Their battle scars tell these pony’s stories, and should not be considered ugly. Just as yellowing is a mark of age and respect, I feel.
All ponies are beautiful.
Post Merge: May 18, 2020, 02:07:47 PM
Baits can still be pretty!
I also collect to restore and clean up. I'll try to make a bait pony display as nicely as I can (I think curls negate the need for lots of body cleanup ha) but it's the journey not the destination or whatever.
agree 100 percent! I got a tailless Moondancer while thrifting. I quite like her without her tail and I never replaced it (also because I don’t know how to reroot). But there’s an intrigue as to how she lost it- fighting and surviving a pack of giant hellhounds out for pony blood? Or something else? Same with my buzzcutt Scoops. How did she lose her mane? Yeah. Some kid got a little too scissor happy, but rather than considering her ugly for it, I made her an outfit to cover it and that developed into a whole identity/ alter ego persona for her.
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My Glory and Moondancer both came to me tailless and I had to get them donor tails from a trader in the US. But they are super precious to me because neither of them were sold here in the UK and they are the only ones I have ever found in the wild here. They were ponies from my childhood stories that I had stopped believing were actually real...
So even though they've seen better days, they're my Glory and Moondancer. And I refuse to upgrade them.
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The G1 ponies, as popular toys of the age, were a part of 80s and early 90s culture. The toys existing now are all there is, there will be no more original ponies. Every baity pony that is thrown away is one less toy that can never be replaced. Because of this, even the non-minty ponies have value, as pieces of toy history. Nothing lasts forever, in time the plastic of even the best preserved ponies will begin to break down. But preserving the old toys in the hands of collectors for as long as they can last is in my opinion a worthy effort.
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well as the saying goes, "beauty is in the eye of the beholder". What YOU think is "ugly", others might think is beautiful. People collect for any number of reasons... not just "cause it's pretty".
Although, I'll admit that I don't really understand the appeal of yellowed MOCs, either - I can *sort of* get the appeal of MOCs but I'll admit I've seen some cards that are so beaten up that it's like "why not just open them up? the package is practically falling apart already!". But eh, if it makes people happy then who am I to judge. *shrug*
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Umm I'm curious as to how bad you think "baits" look on shelves. Most of the ones I've had, (and I've quite a few) haven't looked that much different from mint ponies on display. I think there's something special about "used" ones but I personally don't like basically destroyed ones, which is really where the word bait should be used to me, when a pony is un-repairable. I don't know why someone would want a basically destroyed object on display, but that's just my opinion and ultimately with the age they are now you gotta preserve what you can :'/ But yeah, really most of the time they don't look that different, they're still pretty, broken and all :)
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I think the question at hand is if people display baits -- why is that. I'm kinda curious too. I never really displayed baits when I had them.
I'm at the point I've collected for so long, that most things have been upgraded to a great condition. Not mint or perfect, because I don't believe in mint. But then again, my collection is pretty curated... so it's easy to do with smaller numbers.
The baity-est pony that I have displayed is my childhood Truly. I have a great condition Truly I wish I could just replace her with, but then I don't know what I'd do with my childhood one. I ended up donating the rest of my childhood collection a few years back.. I don't know if I can do it with the last remaining pony. x_x I probably could do that if I had a dear and close friend who collected ponies that I could entrust her with, but... :/ I don't really have pony friends.
I find this discussion better then "what pony do YOU think is ugly" (which tends to be ponies I really like, and that makes me sad). I think it could of been worded a tiny bit better, as the way it has been worded has stepped on toes. People always have different reasons for collecting -- and beauty is in the eye of the beholder, as someone else said here.
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A while back I had a g3 port o bella who was baity. A little frizz in her hair, and covered in marker. She was my absolute favorite, I loved the patterning she had from the different marker colors!
Of ponies I've moved on she's the one I miss the most. Beauty is really in the eye of the beholder, everyone has different tastes.
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First things first! Let's tweak that a bit, ok
Those who have baity ponies on display or MOC ponies intact in yellowed packaging how can that not bother you? The reason I like to collect ponies (or toys in general) is to be able to look at what I would consider pretty things. But if it's in bad condition it's not pretty at all. not my preference
Ok so...Oof
Opinions are not fact.
It's startling to see someone judge people and their collections so harshly based solely on looks along with the assumption that everyone has the exact same taste as you....individuality does exist.
Honestly, and as respectfully as is possible in this situation, the same could be asked of you... why do you bother collecting if you have no real connection or nostalgia for the items? It's just a bunch of pastel plastic horses on a shelf. You could just as easily look at photographs of them and get the same empty validation since there's no true meaning to your vapid material collection.
See how judge-y and rude that sounded?
So ya, let's try to understand our differences in opinions.
Like, I understand where you're coming from, I really do. Who doesn't love a beautiful minty MLP :biggrin:? I can empathize with you and your thought process there, and that's because I realize the entire world doesn't revolve around me and my personal ideals alone. You gotta try to put yourself into other folks' shoes. A lot of us grew up with MLP and quite a few of us still have our childhood ponies. In my case alone, those ~nOt PrEtTy ponies have been with me for almost 32 years of my life. I look at them, I remember all the fun I had with them. And when I get a random "baity" pony in a lot on eBay, I again think about what all adventures she may have gone thru. She meant something to some kid out there and I respect that greatly. Also I ~LOVE~ doing restorations so I sometimes purposely get some TLC lots, hehe :lookround: That's another facet of MY reasons behind collecting. Restoration means I get to actually do something with them other than just look at them and I enjoy it greatly!
Anyways,
Everyone in the world is unique to some degree and you just gotta understand that. That may actually be what you're attempting to do in this thread, but the OP just comes off as very snide. I almost skipped over it bc I've had an exhausting day and just thought I was being overly sensitive and reading too much into it until I saw the other posts that felt the same way.
And that was a massive post :blush:
TL;DR is basically everyone's different and that's pretty cool :P
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I'm sorry if I worded it wrong since I sometimes forget that for some people they still have their childhood toys and that they want to hold on to them for sentimental reasons. I totally understand that is a good reason to hold onto well loved ponies. If I still had my childhood LPS I would probably feel the same way about them. I was more referring to about how some people are against customization of G1s even if they are in really sad condition and against opening MOCs even if the bubble is in really bad condition and the pony would actually look better off the card. While I feel such things give new life to something that looked tragic.
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Collectors can collect for different reasons, and they can collect and display their collections differently. Some people are mint collectors and only want mint items, but that’s not every collector. Some people like to display their well-loved childhood or gift ponies. Some people like ponies that have had a “full life”, and enjoy the idea of giving these ponies a good home where they can be appreciated. I remember there used to be an online “pony rescue” where the site owner would collect bait ponies, and then post her collection pictures online for everyone to see. She’d make up stories for some of them like an animal rescue site. I always thought that was a lovely way to respect a toy that obviously brought a lot of joy over the years.
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I'm not a super picky collector. In fact, a lot of my G1s would probably be considered bait by a lot of other collectors. But I think these ponies deserve just as much love. Not all ponies need to be restored or customized. These "ugly" baity ponies have been well-loved, and sometimes it's nice to see that kind of wear and tear on an old toy.
People collect for different reasons, and everyone has their own preferences. A lot of people want to preserve ponies, regardless of their condition. Some people don't want to open a beat up MOC pony because, well, it's not like we're getting any more of those. Same goes for any old generation pony. What's out there is all we've got, so we might as well do our best to preserve them for as long as we can. These old toys are kinda like a time machine.
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More than half of my collection are childhood ponies. I don’t want to replace them. New ones wouldn’t be as meaningful to me. I also enjoy seeing them. So on display they go.
I don’t have a problem with people restoring ponies. If I were buying online, I’d probably lean towards a good restore over “natural”. However, even baity ponies have their appeal. I like seeing those too. They’re a part of history and it’s been written on them.
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Collectors can collect for different reasons, and they can collect and display their collections differently. Some people are mint collectors and only want mint items, but that’s not every collector. Some people like to display their well-loved childhood or gift ponies. Some people like ponies that have had a “full life”, and enjoy the idea of giving these ponies a good home where they can be appreciated. I remember there used to be an online “pony rescue” where the site owner would collect bait ponies, and then post her collection pictures online for everyone to see. She’d make up stories for some of them like an animal rescue site. I always thought that was a lovely way to respect a toy that obviously brought a lot of joy over the years.
I am not sure if it's the same thing you're referencing, but my sister had (still has actually) a sanctuary of ponies she rescued as a kid from the carboot sale as a kind of sanctuary. They went up on the website, they all had bios and stuff. It may be that you're thinking of. If so, the ponies are still rescued :)
As for the opening a faded MOC, from my personal perspective, I think it's one of the most destructive things you can do to open any MOC item. I look at this as a historian, bearing in mind that's my academic training, and it's the same to me as if you were to excavate a roman site and decide you don't like that some of the mosaics are crumbling so you decide to take the mosaic apart so you can see all the individual tiles, completely losing the sense of what the whole once was.
I can see why people would open a MOC that was going mouldy because that's a different matter. But a yellowed card MOC...nope. The thing is that (again, for me as a historian), I know there are limited numbers especially of MOC items from here in the UK. Some no longer exist. The idea anyone would decard ANY UK packaged MOC pony gives me chills because it quite possibly could be the last existing example.
MOC ponies give you information not just on how the pony was packaged and sold but also accessory variations between regions and releases, backcard stories, etc etc etc. They're not just "things" on shelves to look pretty- at least, maybe to some people, but not to me.
And for me as well, as someone else said, getting a MOC example of a childhood well loved pony is also a target for me. Some I won't ever get because either they're too expensive or as far as I know none have been found to survive (I'm thinking of Fireball and Thundercloud right now). I am still looking for Rainbow Magic, who is super precious to me but of which I only know of one surviving MOC example, total.
Taking someone else's grail away because you decided it doesn't look pretty on your shelf makes no sense to me. That's what ebay is for. Selling something you don't find pretty to someone who treasures it is a good thing...and raises money for you to buy that pretty thing for your shelf.
So yeah, ultimately, my mantra is do no harm. Do no harm to existing MLP stuff, do no harm to other people's hopes and grail aims, do no harm overall.
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I think there's a lot of value to be had in "baity" ponies. (And not just because they're generally easier on the wallet) giving a damaged pony down on its luck a safe new home and restoring them to their former glory is hugely rewarding, and an extremely important part of my overall experience as a collector.
But even more important, it's serves to remind us that these ponies are, in fact, toys. They weren't originally conceived as collectors items, they were for little girls all over the world who loved pastel ponies. I love looking at some of my ponies and thinking about how once upon a time, they were someone's beloved childhood toy. For example, my princess Serena has the initials J.A.D.E on her hooves in neon pink marker. It makes me think about all the fun 'Jade' must have had with her. Maybe she put her name on Serena's hooves so she wouldn't get mixed up with a friend's herd? Maybe now she's in her 30s or 40s, and she sometimes wonders what became of her ponies?
If nothing else, remember that most 'flaws' such as pony cancer and yellowing are purely the result of ageing plastic. Give it ten years, and your mint ponies might be in the exact same state.
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This is an interesting discussion and I agree with others, in particular with milkywaymochi.
The reason it is not bothering me is because ponies were mostly sold as toys to be played with. It makes sense that they are not in perfect condition anymore and I don't expect every pony in my collection to be perfect. When I choose to display a pony with flaws, I want to show that the pony was a beloved toy once and is now a beloved pony in my collection. Seeing a bait pony also shows their (sometimes long) history and also how unique that pony is.
Now for people who don't want to customize or restore ponies, I guess it depends on what can be considered to be a really sad condition. Personally a few pen marks and spots are okay for me, but a pony without any hair would be a good restoration project IMO.
So maybe I also have some ponies on display that others find to be in a very sad condition? I think everyone has their own standards for what is a flawed but displayable pony, or for a bait pony who could use some restoration before displaying.
In addition, I think it's important to consider that not every collector has the time, skills, or resources to start a restoration or customization project. For example, I don't have all the right tools for rehearing but that doesn't mean I will pass on ponies with a haircut that I find pretty to display.
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I am one of those collectors and the reason I
would do display "bait" ponies is because it's all I could aquire/afford.
Knowing I have achieved a collecting goal by obtaining a certain set of ponies I wanted, may mean one of them is in not such mint condition.
All of my childhood ponies and ponies I have bought over the years grace my display shelf in the used condition of having been played with and enjoyed as a toy for many years. Am I happy that my childhood Confetti is more brown than white? My once mint orange Partytime is blotchy pink? Not really, but being on this forum had taught me that every pony is still a pony that deserves love.
We are all collecting the same (for the most part) 35+ plastic toys, with only a few left in pristine condition. There is simply not enough minty versions of the same pony for all of us to have.
I would gratefully display a bait Rapunzel on my shelf given the chance. Lord knows I'll never be able to collect a mint original.
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I've got two ponies with names on them. A very pretty Skydancer I bought from a kind soul here, whose childhood owner has Erin written on the bottom of her hoof.
And a Toola Roola I bought at the swapmeet for my birthday with braid-wavy hair that won't straighten and who has all kindsa marks and the name Samantha something written on her butt. My kiddo called it a tramp stamp, and I thought it was funny. I ended up keeping her instead of trading her because I liked her so much, and she's pretty and will be a reminder of a fun day out with my daughter.
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I am also someone who keeps and displays “bait” ponies. Most of my collection was found second hand in thrift stores over the years. About half of my ponies are childhood ponies I never sold. I like the thrill of hunt, and there’s a chance you might find a bunch of ponies for cheap. Their condition bothered me at one point in time, because I felt like my collection was somehow “less” for not being near mint. Over time I came to appreciate their markings and chopped hair, it gave them a personality that was unique to them! Some of my regrind and spotty ponies have grown to be favorites in my collection now, because they have become one of a kind in a way. For me, my ponies are not just to look at, they serve as inspiration for me when I’m doing art and they just cheer me up!
As others have said, time will wear down even the mintiest pony anyway. I know I have a few where when I bought them they looked fresh off the card, but now their plastic is starting to deteriorate in one way or another, even though I try to keep them in good condition. Taffeta brings up a good point about the yellowed cards as well, they really may be the last example of the pony on the card!
There are a lot of great examples and stories in here of why baits deserve love too. :) It makes me happy there are so many collectors who will take in a less than perfect pony and give them a loving home!
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A lot of my childhood ponies still have my initials on their hooves, but some it's faded off and I find it a bit sad that it's gone xD I know that's odd but the fact they had my name on meant two of them that went astray when I was a kid got back home safely :)
I have zero problem with kid names on hooves, and I also wonder about the adventures the pony had in the past life wherever they lived. Especially if it was in another country, which I may never visit. For example all my US obtained ponies who lived their US childhoods with US kids and then came to live with me in the UK. It's pretty cool to think about that.
I don't restore ponies. I can reroot just fine. I don't do it. I don't have a problem with someone else doing it if the pony needs restoring, but I won't buy a restored/rerooted pony unless I am looking to buy a custom of some kind because to me rerooting and repainting is always customisation. I understand that this is a bit of a binary perspective, especially given that there are sometimes grounds for restoration rather than full scale remake - but the historian in me dictates this again and I will not remove or replace something original to the pony.
There is only one pony in my collection that is an exception to the above rule, and that's Greek baby Bluebelle who came to me with no eyes. PKW painted new ones for her beautifully. I bought Baby B because she had no eyes with the intention of getting her repaired, but the trade off for me is that even though she now looks beautiful, she's no longer original and I see her as a semi-custom. I wouldn't ever sell her or even try to because of this.
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I agree with others, that baity does not always been ugly to me! Infact, usually the opposite! I love all ponies, I don't discriminate, lol. As far as ponies covered in pen marks, missing body parts, those I do agree would be better to customize, but who am I to say? Ones in my herd would be, but not in others' and that's fine!
I also agree with the yellow bubbles, it would look better to open them up and maybe display them separately so the pony isn't ruined (but keep the card! Like Taf said those are really cool pieces of history) but that is just my opinion! (And luckily for MOC collectors, I am not one so I won't be doing that! lol :P )
I personally have a lot of "baity" ones that hang out in my personal collection. Especially G3s because I thrift them so much! Mostly a lot of haircuts with them, but a lot of the time I like the funky looks it leaves them with! Little bobs, funky mohawks... There's a few it looks so good on! A couple with some scuffs.
As others have said, they are toys. I have personally always found it a little odd to obsess on getting absolute perfection with them, even with newer store bought toys! (I totally got wonky eye placement, but things like "These seams are much too large, it looks unprofessional." "These stitches are slightly too visible." especially with dolls and stuff, they will never look perfect, they are not made like collector's items!) But especially with older toys, where some of the ponies are older than even some of us collecting them! They have had their own lives and stories as well, not a lot of them made it out without some battle scars, as others have said! I like embracing the "battle scars," I think it makes them interesting. Some of mine have their own and interesting stories to go with them, I wish my 2nd hand ones could tell me about theirs. :)
I also agree with not replacing childhood ponies. It would never be the same.
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I also agree with the yellow bubbles, it would look better to open them up and maybe display them separately so the pony isn't ruined (but keep the card! Like Taf said those are really cool pieces of history) but that is just my opinion!
Just to be clear, they are pieces of history SEALED on the original card. Once loose they are simply more loose ponies in a world where there are already thousands of loose ponies. So that's not exactly my point. I would keep a yellow bubble MOC pony. I would never open it. I also collect the backcards, but MOC and backcards are not the same thing at all and it wasn't my intention to imply that they were. For me decarding a G1 is the same as cutting a Nirvana pony's hair because you think it looks better that way - they are a complete unit and after this many years, should stay that way unless the package is seriously mouldy and disgusting.
I've thought about downsizing my MOC collection a few times but people talking about opening MOC reminds me there's a reason why I keep my collection as it is...
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I'm one of those who dont understand why people open MOCs, even if the cards/Boxes are really bad. Open a MOC is like destroying a collectible for someone else, because you think it looks better out of package, and as already mentioned, that might be the only one left that exists. For me, its comparable to cutting of a ponys leg for example. You destroy something that can never be put back to original, and a collectors piece is lost forever. If you dont like your MOCs in damaged packages, better sell it to someone who apriciate it, and buy one of those plentifull loose ponies instead.
For example I have a MOC spanish carded FT baby Fifi. Its the only one I have ever seen MOC of her, so it might be the only one existing. The card is badly beaten up and bent, but I would never open her, as if opened up, she would only end up as another baby Fifi, among thousands and thousands of others, instead of maybe being OOAK.
That said, I'm no fan of yellowed bubbles either, but if the pony itself is the important thing, and not the whole MOC experience, I would just by it loose instead.
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I should mention that by baity I mean really bad. Like haircuts and heavy uneven discoloration or permanent marker all over the body or badly scuffed factory paint. Not minor marks that don't detract from a pony's beauty. I don't have that many G1s but one has words under the hoof where it isn't visible and one has a tiny dark dot that's kinda like a beauty mark. Those I don't consider baity and would never customize them.
I also agree with the yellow bubbles, it would look better to open them up and maybe display them separately so the pony isn't ruined (but keep the card! Like Taf said those are really cool pieces of history) but that is just my opinion!
Just to be clear, they are pieces of history SEALED on the original card. Once loose they are simply more loose ponies in a world where there are already thousands of loose ponies. So that's not exactly my point. I would keep a yellow bubble MOC pony. I would never open it. I also collect the backcards, but MOC and backcards are not the same thing at all and it wasn't my intention to imply that they were. For me decarding a G1 is the same as cutting a Nirvana pony's hair because you think it looks better that way - they are a complete unit and after this many years, should stay that way unless the package is seriously mouldy and disgusting.
But think about it this way. A museum, when it displays a mummy for example, they open the sarcophagus and display what was inside with it along with it. They would never just display a dirty sealed sarcophagus. They would keep it together of course for the sake of preservation. Then again I'm not talking about slightly yellow but when it's at the point where you can't even tell what the pony actually looks like anymore.
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Those who have baity ponies on display or MOC ponies intact in yellowed packaging how can that not bother you? The reason to collect ponies (or toys in general) is to be able to look at pretty things. But if it's in bad condition it's not pretty at all.
I have a vintage glitter pony somewhere- NRFB - SORTA. I mean it has it's backcard and bubble, but the bubble is mostly off due to glue drying up and probably more has come up since very little is attached- the bubble is also quite yellowed and makes the pony look yellowed inside even though she is perfect. STill, I haven't pulled her out of the package because it's still kinda special and she's the only vintage pony I have that still has her packaging... I don't normally try to collect MLP packaging, I've long thought I should just sell her to someone who would appreciate the packaging more and get a replacement that just looks very nice :)
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I should mention that by baity I mean really bad. Like haircuts and heavy uneven discoloration or permanent marker all over the body or badly scuffed factory paint. Not minor marks that don't detract from a pony's beauty. I don't have that many G1s but one has words under the hoof where it isn't visible and one has a tiny dark dot that's kinda like a beauty mark. Those I don't consider baity and would never customize them.
I also agree with the yellow bubbles, it would look better to open them up and maybe display them separately so the pony isn't ruined (but keep the card! Like Taf said those are really cool pieces of history) but that is just my opinion!
Just to be clear, they are pieces of history SEALED on the original card. Once loose they are simply more loose ponies in a world where there are already thousands of loose ponies. So that's not exactly my point. I would keep a yellow bubble MOC pony. I would never open it. I also collect the backcards, but MOC and backcards are not the same thing at all and it wasn't my intention to imply that they were. For me decarding a G1 is the same as cutting a Nirvana pony's hair because you think it looks better that way - they are a complete unit and after this many years, should stay that way unless the package is seriously mouldy and disgusting.
But think about it this way. A museum, when it displays a mummy for example, they open the sarcophagus and display what was inside with it along with it. They would never just display a dirty sealed sarcophagus. They would keep it together of course for the sake of preservation. Then again I'm not talking about slightly yellow but when it's at the point where you can't even tell what the pony actually looks like anymore.
First and foremost, your original post makes no explicit indication of how much you consider unacceptable level of yellowing. I'll be honest and say I wouldn't buy a very yellowed MOC to the point it obscured the pony unless it was the only known one in existence, but even if one of my existing collection got to that point it wouldn't change anything.
And your information is out of date. In the past - for example, the 1920s - it was common, yes, to open sarcophagi and display mummies and in doing so some got destroyed (for example Tutankhamun). But now they tend to NOT open them. Instead they MRI scan them to find out what is inside, and sometimes put cameras through cracks to see if they can get a better look or a tissue sample.
The ones you see in museums all taken apart were almost certainly taken apart decades ago, in a time when the same rules of preservation didn't apply.
And it changes nothing, anyway. Leikin put it extremely well. Decarding a pony is vandalism of the same level as removing a leg, an ear, or the hair. But there is no 'restoration' of a MOC. Once off it's off forever.
In my collection I have some ponies who have been off the card but who still live in the bubble because that's how I got them. I have some with the bubble coming off but not enough that the pony has ever been out. I have a couple with cracks in the bubble. The vast majority of my MOC collection is intact and mostly if yellowing has occurred it's very minor and tends to be on the early US ponies (Glory, Medley etc) rather than the rarer early UK ones that I mostly go after...BUT...that said, there are also MOC in my collection, and probably also others in Leikin's than the one she mentioned, that are the only known examples in existence.
So if they yellow now, you would say it was entirely justified to decard the last surviving example of a MOC pony just because in your view it looks prettier loose on the shelf?
Well, that is of course an opinion you're entitled to, but frankly, it isn't one that I understand.
Loose ponies are easy to get. MIP ones, not so much. There are far fewer of them because they weren't originally intended to be kept in the package, and mostly people didn't buy them that way in the sense they have with G2-4. That makes them in some cases extremely limited.
Again, not everyone collects to have a trinket shelf. It's fine if you do, but if something isn't pretty to you, either don't buy it, or sell it to someone who will value it...or if you don't want to do either of those things, at least don't destroy it so that it no longer exists at all.
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I do understand wanting to rescue a pony from a really gross card but Taffeta is right, there won't be any more of those coming around. And honestly, there are probably nicer ponies already out of the box that can be had instead. It's why I don't buy ponies on card. It's not what I'm looking for. Besides, there is a good change that pony is damaged on the other side.
I love minty ponies. But, even the worst of baits can have their own charm. If someone loves it and wants it in their collection, I can't see any thing bad about that at all. There is no negative to them having it.
I am hopeful that companies like Basic Fun will continue to create G1 ponies. Knowing that they can is pretty exciting. It means people can have a minty pony without having to decard older ones.
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If we're on the subject of MOC ponies, I personally feel that keeping a pony MOC is an absolute waste of a pony. It just looks terrible to me, it doesn't display well at all in my eyes, and the pony would look so much nicer mint off-card. Even factory errors display better off-card, imo. MIBs are different for me - they actually stand up on their own, for one. I actually collect some MIBs, but I consider them kind of a different collection from loose ponies.
But that's just my onion. It's why I don't buy MOC ponies. I obviously don't expect (or want!) anyone else to decard their MOCs. I just don't see the appeal at all. I know that's a wildly unpopular opinion, lol.
And I've got plenty of baity ponies on display, mostly nirvanas who I can't afford mint, lol. Some flaws (regrind, stray marks, rubs, glitter loss, some chews, haircuts, certain discoloration) don't really bother me, while others (cancer, severe head/body mismatch, any yellowing, and worst of all, frizzy hair) are dealbreakers. So I've got plenty of ponies on display who others might consider bait, and I might consider bait what others consider display-worthy.
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But that's just my onion. It's why I don't buy MOC ponies. I obviously don't expect (or want!) anyone else to decard their MOCs. I just don't see the appeal at all. I know that's a wildly unpopular opinion, lol.
To clarify, I am fine with that being anyone else's opinion. It's the people who go out of their way to destroy MOC ponies because they prefer ponies loose, as opposed to going out for ponies that are loose already (of which there are so many more). It's two different things. Nobody should collect MOC if they don't want them, obviously. xD.
I have some ponies in my collection that came from a decarder. They are absolutely pristine, and I have their cards and all their accessories as well.
They are some of the saddest ponies in my collection, though, because they are so pristine and perfect on display.
They're neither one thing nor the other. They were never a loved childhood toy, but are also no longer the pristine sealed on card collector's item that they should have been because someone decarded and then got bored with their collection and sold the ponies off.
People who decard always say they'll never sell so why does it matter? In 20 years I've seen a lot of those people sell up their decarded collections, though. It's a waste that has reduced MIP stock and put MOC prices much higher than they were when I began online collecting (the first MIP ponies I had, I paid $30 apiece for, or sometimes $15).
And it's just really sad looking at ponies that never got played with, but are now no better than any other loose pony, only not as loved. I guess for me just looking pretty on the shelf isn't enough. THey have no history, and it's sad.
Of course, I love them for their mintness, but it makes me wish the person who owned them before had thought for the longterm, rather than leaving those ponies in their weird limbo.
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If we're on the subject of MOC ponies, I personally feel that keeping a pony MOC is an absolute waste of a pony. It just looks terrible to me, it doesn't display well at all in my eyes, and the pony would look so much nicer mint off-card. Even factory errors display better off-card, imo. MIBs are different for me - they actually stand up on their own, for one. I actually collect some MIBs, but I consider them kind of a different collection from loose ponies.
I'm completly opposite of that. I prefer them on card then in box actually :lookround: I just think theboxed ones get so much strange shadows, and seem to gather more dust then the carded ones. At least the ones that are plastic sealed to the card on the box. Those that are just fastened in the box with a plastic window are even worse, as the window so easily falls off or breaks. :P
Not to mention the bags. The BAGS! Those are impossible to display nice :lol:
I have some ponies in my collection that came from a decarder. They are absolutely pristine, and I have their cards and all their accessories as well.
They are some of the saddest ponies in my collection, though, because they are so pristine and perfect on display.
They're neither one thing nor the other. They were never a loved childhood toy, but are also no longer the pristine sealed on card collector's item that they should have been
I have never thought of it that way, but it is kinda sad now that you mention it. Poor ponies :heart:
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Well I have my childhood collection which are well loved. I also started collecting again as a teenager and back then most of my collecting was from garage sales and flea markets since ebay was just starting out. Then I moved out and my ponies stayed at my parents house where my niece played with them for 8 years. Then I went and got them for my daughter when she was 3/4 so she played with them for several years. Then I decided to collect again but didn't have a place to display so they sat in storage for a couple years. Now I have a pony/toy collection room but haven't had time to go and clean everyone up yet. Any new purchases from ebay or the thrift store get cleaned and styled when they arrive. But sadly I haven't had time to clean up the 200+ ponies that I've been collecting forever and have gone through several children playing with them but they are all out on display in my pony room for me to enjoy while I sew. I have lots of doubles and lots of poor condition ponies in the mix. One day I'll get to clean and style each one and sort through who to sell and who to keep of the duplicates but for now I'm super happy to see all their beautiful faces on my shelves instead of sitting in boxes like they have for so many years. :)
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I enjoyed this quite challenging conversation starter! Sometimes I think it's nice when people invite you to challenge them in a debate. I'm not always in the mood, but this is an interesting topic. It's drawn out some great comments so far. I especially like the points made that baity ponies have a uniqueness that can bring back childhood memories and maybe they might inspire the imagination as to what kinds of adventures they might have had.
Personally my childhood ponies were given away although my sister shared hers with me which is nice. I have the memory of going with my Mum to buy Braided Beauty for her and a green Fairytale Bird who she has now gifted to me since she no longer collects.
I do like to look at something pretty so I have made compromises such as deflocking, hairstyles or accessories so that although not completely original they do look good (even if I do say so myself :P). I have also re-rooted a few forelocks and touched up eyes or symbols in some cases, so I have a few ponies who look perfect to me but I know it would be hard to sell them since people don't like to buy re-rooted or re-painted ponies. If anyone is wondering, I've initialled them with aerospace marker under a hoof, so if by chance they did end up back on the market then that should signal to collectors that they may have been altered.
I find that the condition that ponies arrive in from sellers really varies. If the difference from the description is major then I will send back however often it's subtle or subjective so in which case I will keep the pony and decide what to do later. If the head has been removed previously I'll do a soft restore which is basically a wash and style, however if there are bigger problems then I will decide whether to restore and keep the pony or whether to sell it on. If I recieve certain ponies that are too perfect (it does happen!) I tend to re-sell them and keep one that I've worked on, because the perfect pony is so straightforward to sell. If I'm only able to buy a pony once due to distribution or rarity then I tend to find the best one I can and never do any work on it.
I must say i completely afgree wth Taffeta about packaging which is one reason why I personally don't buy G1s in packaging. It is ephemeral and will lose condition so I just don't feel I have the space and environmental conditions to look after it properly. Also I do like to get my ponies out and make little worlds for them and photograph them so they need to be free of packaging. Finally I do admit I enjoy the process of grading, cleaning and potentially restoring certain played with ponies and I also respect, display and enjoy the items that have suffered some damage but should be left in thier original condidtion due to rarity and value.
This Shady is a great example of a successful soft restore. She was absolutely gross with mould and wet inside, pindot and frizzy lank hair. I touched her eyes up with aerospace marker (it's removable).
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Some choices are harder to make. I have de-flocked Twilight and styled her hair, but not re-painted her eye. She still has a problem with her neck seam. I don't think this is an original body and head since they don't fit together very well. I still can't decide what to do with her.
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Heart Throb has an obvious 'do' which was fun to do and she's gorgeous. I sold her to a collector.
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Dutch School Bag has pin holes in his ears, presumably someone pierced them for earrings. I would never try to work on this flaw as he is too rare and it doesn't other me.
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Rainbow magic's pink streak has faded and her paint has rubbed, however I wouldn't work on these these since I consider her rare. Likewise I would not try to re-pink Wind Whistler. I find both these ponies beautiful. Lady Flutter is pretty much perfect, but is another one of those ponies I would only expect to find once so I would accept her as she is regardless.
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These two have minor flaws, Baby has a hair cut and symbol wear and Mom has slight wear to her eyes. I wouldn't try to 'hard restore' iether of them because they are too rare so i just gave them some accessories. Baby's haircut reminds me of the regrettable 'short sides' do i had as a kid when Mum let me go tot eh hairdresser on my own :lol:
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Finally, Baby Ember has touched up eyes and a new forelock. I had found her strangely hard to find and Taffeta let me have this one. I decided to carry out these 'hard restore' options because (1) she looked very unhappy before (2) she's not considered super hard to find at least in the USA 3) these were easy fixes with a big impact 4) she's never going to look minty again in general due to the ageing to her plastic, so she would never be highly valuable. I think a gentle amount of work on her has made her look pretty again without trying to make her look perfect and it was the right thing to do. I initialled her hoof as well 'CM' to show she has been restored.
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I put a lot of thought into these decisions as you can tell. I understand that everyone has different opinions about what is right for their collections and I do try to think of others when I carry out permanent work even to ponies that I'm planning to keep forever.
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I don't think Wardah meant any harm in their post. :) To answer the question... Some of my most beloved childhood ponies are quite "bait" at this point in time. I gave most of the boys haircuts like the boy ponies in the MLP Tales cartoon, and I played with them a lot outside so some are stained with pitch, dirt, sand, and hair frizzed out from bubble bath and salty ocean water. A few even lived on my window sill so they got a bit moldy and faded. While they may not be the most aesthetically pleasing anymore, they still make me very happy to look at. I have a special little shelf just for them, separate from the rest of my ponies. To me they're more treasured than some of my mint condition ponies.
Now... I did once do the unthinkable and de-card a Nirvana pony. It's true! However before you all chase me with torches, let me explain!
It was the early 2000's and Argentina ponies were just popping up on eBay. Well I managed to acquire the green Rockin' Beat unicorn on a VERY damaged card for super cheap (I believe it was like 15$ USD). When I received her the card was actually slightly damp, and clearly water damaged. Ink blotchy, warped, bubble yellowed and mostly peeled off... But what I noticed most was the smell of mildew and the little tiny droplets of liquid on the pony inside. I made the difficult decision to open her, and I am SO glad I did. She was very sticky/slimy and smelled quite foul. I assume it was plasticizer leaking out as she was also quite visibly porous and soft. I ended up cleaning her off just fine, and she and her accessories were salvaged though even to this day she smells a bit off. I dried the card out and ended up keeping it as well, but just think of how awful that pony would be today had I left her in package. She was literally rotting away... I've heard of similar things happening to other peoples Argies from around that time.
So there you have it. (Just to clarify I would NEVER de-card otherwise.) I'm gonna go wall up my windows and doors now. :)
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^ That's what I meant when I was talking about super beaten up cards before :) IMO if the card is in such bad condition that it's actually starting to badly affect the pony... it's time to decard. I get the reasons people collect MOCs but there's really no point keeping them that way if it's in that bad shape.
Glad to hear that pony got a good home :)
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Tbh I don't put ponies on the shelf to display them. I put them there because that's where they go and I don't wanna deal with tangled hair. I also never owned any sort of toybox.
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I bought a MOC Milky Way a few years ago and a few weeks ago I saw that Milky Way had neon pink spots in two places on the body. I'm not a MOC collector, but that annoyed me a bit. I don't know what to do about that...
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...Of course, I love them for their mintness, but it makes me wish the person who owned them before had thought for the longterm, rather than leaving those ponies in their weird limbo.
What a great way to describe it.
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I'm another person of the opinion that the provenance and history is important. Especially since Hasbro themselves didn't save much, if anything. I admire the Lisa Frank company for saving one of EVERYTHING. All the merch, all the sticker sheets, all the original art, everything, is in a giant archival vault.
Many people are trying to keep their MOC ponies in good condition, not opening them, not keeping them in bad storage/strong UV light, etc. But if the MOC pony is mildewing and dripping plasticizer, and the cardboard card is rotting off, please take as many detailed photos as possible and then open the pony. There are only a few ponies where we have OOAK examples. But if that one example is far beyond appreciating its existence or causing its owner health issues, by all means, use other preservation methods like documentation.
In that respect, it is different than a mummy ; that's the only King Tut we have, we probably shouldn't be whacking off his fingers to set up in a museum display. We will find another pony. And we could find its accessories and backcard and display it together, even if not in-situ. I mean, the latter example is 90% of most museum's collections!
Eeeeeeesh to the MOC collector who got bored and de-carded. Ugh, she should have sold the MOCs and started again with loose ponies. At least the ponies themselves and backcard/accessories were saved, and it wasn't a vengeful ex-partner trashing them or a family member taking them.
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Very well said LBS :) I agree with documenting MOCs however possible if their card is beyond saving, that's a really good point.
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This has been an interesting read, as someone who owns an incredibly moldy/damaged MOC pony. (The pony itself even has mold dots!) The pony is still TECHNICALLY MOC, and since the pony inside is already damaged, it would theoretically lower her value even more to open her... and yet I haven't brought myself to do it. Moldy and water damaged, she's still my only MOC! It's an interesting conundrum, and reading all of the opinions has been interesting!
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Baits can still be pretty!
I also collect to restore and clean up. I'll try to make a bait pony display as nicely as I can (I think curls negate the need for lots of body cleanup ha) but it's the journey not the destination or whatever.
It is the best, restoring and cleaning and leaving everything as best as possible. I have ever bought a pony bait and my mother is very pleased to see the before-after cleaning.
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I guess everyone has a different standard of what is acceptable to them. I don't really 'display' my ponies, other than to have them lined up in my bathroom linen closet on shelves, because I don't want to dump them in a box, and honestly, with 3 kids let's face it, it's not like I'm ever going to get the luxury of my own space in a bedroom or anything. Guess it also keeps them away from most UV light and fading, too. But I do move the prettiest ones toward the front, because they are the ones that I have to look at when I open the closet. The childhood ponies that have faded hair or a rusty beddy bye eye (but I don't have the heart to part with) go in the back, but none of them are truly hideous. The really baity ones that I've purchased in lots as an adult go in a separate bait box to either try to clean up better when I have the time, or eventually sell as a bait lot when I decide they aren't salvageable to my tastes. Some spots I can live with, unless I suspect the beginning of plasticizer breakdown, and they aren't too big or dark; haircuts I can't deal with, but I'll rehair them if that's their only problem. Frizzy hair is not acceptable in my collection, but I'm finding that very few ponies I come across have hair that can't be salvaged. I'll touch up an eye here and there, because it bothers me if I feel like the pony looks blind or something because there's a big scrape right in the middle of her pupil. Yellowed white ponies don't bother me too badly as long as there's no major head/body mismatch. I can't see myself paying top dollar for a Nirvana or MOC pony that wasn't new looking, but that's just me. I don't collect those items because of that.
Some I'm on the fence with; I recently acquired what turned out to be a really beautiful Cherries Jubilee in a bait lot. She was filthy, but once I cleaned her up and repaired her hair, she looked like she just came out of the package except...some idiot in a thrift shop wrote a price on her in black sharpie marker! Who DOES that?!? I've tried acetone and magic eraser and good ole' elbow grease, but haven't put a dent in it. I'm trying to decide how much it bothers me; should I keep her as part of my collection or will it bug me into making her be a placeholder until I find another? Not sure.
Some of my pickiness I chalk up to being space-related; if I lived alone and had all the space in my house to myself I might be more willing to accept more flaws in my collection by setting up army rows of the same pony in various conditions, but currently I'm forced to whittle it down to only the ones that make me happy.
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I have one box with yellow blister and I rlly love it. It's history for me you know... Only rlly old items has problems like that. When you see something like that you feel all this years of little ponies and specifics of this collecting :heart:
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Some I'm on the fence with; I recently acquired what turned out to be a really beautiful Cherries Jubilee in a bait lot. She was filthy, but once I cleaned her up and repaired her hair, she looked like she just came out of the package except...some idiot in a thrift shop wrote a price on her in black sharpie marker! Who DOES that?!? I've tried acetone and magic eraser and good ole' elbow grease, but haven't put a dent in it. I'm trying to decide how much it bothers me; should I keep her as part of my collection or will it bug me into making her be a placeholder until I find another? Not sure.
Would perhaps some clothes cover up the price?
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I don't like baity ponies either. I feel awful for it, because I want to love all G1 ponies, and "ugly" ponies usually have the sweetest stories.
However, they display awfully, and if I only have a baity version of a particular pony, I will still check the "don't have her" box if she is POTD. :lookround:
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Some I'm on the fence with; I recently acquired what turned out to be a really beautiful Cherries Jubilee in a bait lot. She was filthy, but once I cleaned her up and repaired her hair, she looked like she just came out of the package except...some idiot in a thrift shop wrote a price on her in black sharpie marker! Who DOES that?!? I've tried acetone and magic eraser and good ole' elbow grease, but haven't put a dent in it. I'm trying to decide how much it bothers me; should I keep her as part of my collection or will it bug me into making her be a placeholder until I find another? Not sure.
Would perhaps some clothes cover up the price?
I think so. It's on her front flank area on her display side (of course!). I'm usually not a fan of covering up my ponies with clothes that potentially clash with their colors, but maybe this is a case of putting my rusty sewing skills to the test and designing some sort of cute cherry-picking apron or something. There was also a Bowtie in that lot with the writing on as well, but she is unfortunately beyond (my) help, as she is riddled with cancer spots I was unable to remove and definitely fits into the 'ugly pony' category the original poster was talking about!
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I have a rare MOC Alternate Birthflower Daffodil/March on the horizontal Scandinavian card. The pony is still mint, however she has discoloured to yellow/brown on the display side, probably from being displayed in direct sunlight by a previous owner. I could decard her and treat the damaged vinyl and restore her to a crisp white pony, but she is more valuable as one of the few remaining examples of this line of pony in its original packaging. So she'll stay yellowed and discoloured, but it's more important to preserve her intact.
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Baity ponies have their charm, in a way. And I greatly enjoy restoring them when possible. Sometimes, even after restoration, they still have a few flaws, but I think that's a bit charming, because even though they have some scars, they at least got better. A bit like real life. I have a G1 Galaxy and G2 Teddy with their hair cut, but they look like punk and they're fun.
I do have an extremely beat up pony displayed. She's an Italian Bowtie, my childhood Italian Bowtie. She has her eyes a bit rubbed off, matted hair, she's yellowed and rattling of rust, has pen marks and grime. She IS filthy, I won't be lying. I do want to restore her, but I want to make it special and actually FILM the whole project. The thing is, I just don't have the time nor material to do that video yet, so she's been waiting for years and still waiting.
At least, when she's displayed, I don't forget about her. I can't wait to be able to do that video and restore her to her former glory.
I also have a MOC ponywear. This is my only MOC and it's rather beaten up. I don't know where it has been stored until that flea market where I bought it from, but the bubble is lifting off, the card is dirty, has a few price tags and that cardboard hook/hole to hang it from is destroyed. It's in rough shape but you'd be absolutely right to think I will never decard this precious thing. Just because it is intact. It is a bit of a historical piece to me. Plus I won't be loosing pieces of the ponywear, as they are all well kept in the same place. :D
I also keep my 35th and World's Smallest MIB/MOC, but they're still fresh and new so they look actually good on display, hehe. ^^
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Some I'm on the fence with; I recently acquired what turned out to be a really beautiful Cherries Jubilee in a bait lot. She was filthy, but once I cleaned her up and repaired her hair, she looked like she just came out of the package except...some idiot in a thrift shop wrote a price on her in black sharpie marker! Who DOES that?!? I've tried acetone and magic eraser and good ole' elbow grease, but haven't put a dent in it. I'm trying to decide how much it bothers me; should I keep her as part of my collection or will it bug me into making her be a placeholder until I find another? Not sure.
I agree that's a hard one to deal with. It's tough when a pony is in otherwise great condition but has one unfixable flaw. I've never come across a pony that I knew for sure was damaged by an adult before. Maybe I would keep her and display her on the other side.
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I love to give un-loved toys a home. I definately feel some sort of "kinship" towards loved or worn out toys. The purpose of my collection isn't to look pretty, it's to make me happy. Giving what others would consider trash or worthless a home and value makes me very happy