The MLP Arena
Pony Talk => Pony Corral => Topic started by: Pop!Star on October 07, 2015, 08:53:01 PM
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Ok, so I've been a collector for nearly 30 years now, I've seen the rise and fall of every generation, and there's just something that's irking me!
Why Hasbro do you insist on churning out the same repeat characters..over..and over again!?
I understand they want to create a "brand" with recognizable characters which is great but can they seriously not release a whole line of new characters?
We get maybe 5 new characters a year, but yet we get tons of re-releases of the Mane 6 over and over again! Which is great, continue doing that Hasbro but could we maybe JUST maybe get one or two releases a year of new characters?
I'm sorry but it breaks my heart going into the stores and just seeing ponies SIT on the shelves.
It's the reason why I don't purchase ponies anymore, and it's aggravating. Ponies literally sit on the shelves all year long because no one wants the same repeated ponies time and time again.
Atleast from a collector stand point I don't. This is why I've begun collecting Monster High/Ever After High and other toy brands such as The Zelfs.
Which both sets of toys do rerelease characters but they also release new characters each season.
Why isn't Hasbro catching on and understanding the fact that if they would release a set of new characters that they would sell, and not sit in the shelf.
Parents don't want to buy multiples of the same character just because it has rainbow hair, or a new accessory.
Hasbro really needs to pull it together.
The least they could do is release a new set of characters and keep the Mane6 for things such as Funko figures, or other various things.
Why won't Hasbro listen to the people that have been supporting their brand for nearly 30 years but they'll completely pander to the newest generations of fans?
It boggles my mind!
Anyone else feel this way?
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Yes, absolutely I agree with you. It sure is frustrating. I understand why they rerelease the main characters all the time. People getting into the show at any stage will want to buy their favourite character, so it's nice that they are always available. However, what happens once people have already bought the main 6? There's nothing to keep them interested really...
It's such a shame, considering at the start of the toyline they DID have a bunch of different characters! And now they will release only 1-2 additional characters alongside the main 6. And even those are repeated over and over (seen Skywishes, Daisy Dreams, and that other pink one with green hair a bunch of times now).
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Well, apparently little kids enjoy owning 500 Pinkie Pies, or the line would have long died out by now.
But yeah, I definitely agree on how frustrating it is. Cutie Mark Magic was doing so well for diversity, and with the previews of Explore Equestria, it looks like we're going right back to monotony. Even this year's SDCC exclusive was just ANOTHER Pinkie Pie with a new outfit!
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It's not that kids want 30 Pinkie Pies. They want Pinkie Pie, and 6 months later they've "grown out" of MLP and are onto something else, and Hasbro knows this. I often get the feeling that collectors see themselves as a larger group than they actually are. Lifelong supporters of the brand don't have that much influence because they are a small part of the market and the brand is meant to cater to little girls so hasbro produce what their market research suggests little girls would like. All the gimmick-y ponies I'm sure are based on this. Adult/teen fim collectors have gotten more attention in recent years, yes, and there has been licensed merch. geared towards them but I think that has more to do with pop culture trends.
More often than not it seems kids are only into something for a few years at best before moving onto another thing they like. I was the same way when I was a kid. This is why we see so much repeat. I think the stagnancy on store shelves is more of a mix of economy and other things competing for kid's attention than the lack of new characters. I do think hasbro has made some dumb decisions and missed opportunities as far as mlp goes but the model they are following seems to work for them or else the would change. They have made several strives to stretch the appeal of MLP to older and younger kids (playskool, EqG, expanded licence merch. etc.) but I think while maybe I, as an adult G4 collector like more, different characters, that may not be what would keep most of the current generation of kids interested.
It does seem to be becoming more "socially acceptable" for adults to like cartoons and collect figures and merchandise but MLP focus is more to be relevant to kids of a certain age group than to attract a group and foster lifelong collecting of the same thing. I hope I somewhat make sense I'm tired
:zzz:
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You do!
Hehe the thing I don't get those is yes adult collectors are a small percentage but adult collectors or parents are the ones mostly buying these ponies. If they k ow their kid already has a Pinkie Pie they're not going to buy another one just because it's slightly different.
MLP is very cheap compared to things like MH/EAH and yet those are always sold, so I'm not sure I agree with the whole
Economy point.
I'd rather buy a $5 pony, but not if its a boring version of one I already have, but is gladly spend $20 on a new doll.
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The age range for MLP is younger than the age range for MH/EAH. The age range for MLP is really into Shopkins right now.
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I feel your pain all I want is single brushable boys but that probably won't happen..
I think Hasbro thinks they are covered on making tons of characters with the mini/ blind bag line, so they don't feel the need to make tons of characters in brushables, its probably cheaper to make lots of different characters in mini size, verses the larger brushable or fashion style ponies.
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I do agree it is frustrating, I miss the days when you could go into a store and find a new set with new ponies and the circulated a few times a year. I really stopped buying new ponies when the core seven came out with G3 because I didn't want another toola roola just with a different hat.
But Flitter is right, collectors make a very tiny percentage of the market, and you also have to bare in mind some collectors love a certain pony much they will buy him/her over and over. But it is essentially aimed at little kids and sadly little kids have short attention spans now a days (lets face it if it isn't on a screen they aren't interested) and they are so desperate to grow up.
My mum is a child care and has two sisters she looks after age 4 and 7. A year ago the 7 year old told me she didn't like MLP any more because its for little girls and it wasn't grown up. Whilst I stod there like "pfffff! You're 6 you are a little girl!" Because of that her sister isn't interested either. So I can see why from a marketing point of view they don't have to put time and effort into designing new characters and lines ... Because they have such a short life as an 'it' toy. Whilst I think EqG, MH , EaH style fashion dolls have a much broader range, little and older girls can like them so that where concentration isis put in.
But I agree I'm getting sad now, seeing the same ponies on the shelves as there was 10 months ago.
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Because is a strategy that is working right now?
But when you think about it, there is a TON of pony stuff out there. To like the brand you don't have to have a shelf full of ponies.
Eta:the reason mane 6 is warming the shelves is so any kid who gets into the series at any time can pick one up. The gimmicks... That strategy isn't new (rainbow hair, taf, so soft, etc). Its to have an updated product each year.
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Eta:the reason mane 6 is warming the shelves is so any kid who gets into the series at any time can pick one up.
Thank you, this is what I was trying to say, but you are much more eloquent ... And I got distracted. But to sum it up you've hit the strategy right in the head.
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The problem with what Flitter said is their strategy is to make My Little Pony disposable to the buyer. "Kids don't hold interest in things as much anymore." "Then let's make our brand even less interesting!" Anyone else see the problem here? I think their market research people have a defeatist attitude and are willing to settle. My Little Pony has grown in popularity, but are they really helping the brand's legacy. It's supposed to be Hasbro's flagship brand for girls, but their attitude it suggests otherwise. Kids come in and go out in a year. It makes money, but leaves little of an impression.
How hard is it to create new characters to sell along side the Mane 6?
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ARE they selling? I mean, sure the ponies slowly trickle off the shelves, but at a pitiful pace. I think it's pretty apparent that this is hurting Hasbro in the long run. (Or maybe they just sell really slowly around here, haha.)
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This is a big reason why people start looking for prototypes and leaks/fakies. It just gets old seeing the same thing over and over.
I imagine kids also lose interest but just move into the next colourful thing and get sucked back in when there's a new pony related thing.
I don't think the current strategy is helping the MLP legacy at all. Third gen had a huuuuge list of characters... What's going on with this? The cartoon is so popular with tons of characters. Is it that much effort to make them when they have already been designed in the show? Are they truly keeping people engaged?
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But when you think about it, there is a TON of pony stuff out there. To like the brand you don't have to have a shelf full of ponies.
THANK YOU!
I say this every time a thread like this pops up (which is incredibly often...) and I think the issue is the mentality of collectors that have been doing this since the beginning: A pony is only a toy with brushable hair and everything else is invalid.
Nope nope nope.
And as someone who is part of this "newer generation of fans" (even though I also collect G1), I feel like this community looks down on me and others like myself because we collect ponies that aren't just brushable and we support other companies that have partnered with Hasbro.
And to say that they're pandering to us? We have the SAME complaints as you do when it comes to the lack of different characters for brushables.
It's fine and dandy to dislike Funko figures, or the various brands of pony plushies, or blind bags, etc. but don't pretend that these are something other than My Little Pony. They may not be your MLP, but they're still MLP. Brushables aren't the only toys that exist for this franchise anymore, sorry. Funko has done a wonderful job of giving us a variety in characters, say what you will about them. The blind bags, while I can see why collectors aren't fond of them, are also doing well in the variety department and we're even getting new poses and play sets with those!
If you pay attention to other toy lines, you'll notice that the smaller, molded, blind bag type toys are actually pretty popular (Shopkins...Shopkins EVERYWHERE) and most toys with brushable hair tend to be dolls (MH, EAH, EqG). It makes a lot of sense why Hasbro has gone the direction they have with ponies, even if we, as collectors, don't totally agree that it's the right direction.
Also, to piggyback off of a previous post, I don't believe collectors make up much of the fan base here. Hasbro isn't trying to appeal to us.
Brands like Funko (I know I keep bringing them up, but they always come to my mind first for stuff like this) are trying to appeal to the collectors for this generation, and even little kids like them! It's really not all about brushables anymore. Times change, you know?
I'm truly sorry, I'm not trying to come off as being mean or anything, but I was kinda right there with the OP until the "pandering to the newest generation of fans" statement and that kinda riled me up, but I'm good now. :thumb:
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Good point, Moonbeam. I'm personally not a fan of collecting the Funko ponies, but there are a lot of really beautiful ones. There's also the chibi ponies and other vinyl figures. Talk about cute!!!!!! I think those chibs are what I'm going to ask for as my Christmas gift since I'm already being bothered about it. :devious:
Most people's issue seems to lie with the variation of official Hasbro brushables in comparison to previous generations. Yes, there are tons of other types of g4 products that are totally fabulous but the lack of ponies found in your average store shelves is what highlights this problem.
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The only reason my DD has umpteen Pinkie Pie and Fluttershy is because those two are released with EVERY.SINGLE.PLAYSET. It drives me bonkers that she has so many repeats. Having a bunch of PP isn't too big a deal, since that's her favorite pony, and she mostly uses them to re-enact the Mirror Pond/Too Many Pinkie Pies episode.
I want to see more boys, and NOT in the blind bag size. WHY is there not a Big Mac yet, hasbro?!?!?!!?
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Of course it's all My Little Pony, but ponies with brushable are the core the very concept of My Little Pony. It's like the handheld RPG's for Pokemon. There's tons of other spinoff games and merchandise for Pokemon, but the handheld RPG's are what define the brand.
The problem is not that these annexes exist. The problem is they've taken over the brand. They're the ones that have a wide variety of characters and better designs. Money is going into them while brushables seem to be an after thought.
And, as a business major, I can tell Hasbro seems to only care about the short-term wins with this brand. They don't care about customer retention and maintaining the legacy. Sure it makes money now, but what happens when Friendship is Magic ends and it's time to move on? You're going to lose the vast majority of bronies and the money they put into this secondary market that's commandeered the brand. The brand itself will have a reputation for being limited and cheap. If they've trademarked the name, Hasbro should be making a brushable of it.
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I want to see more boys, and NOT in the blind bag size. WHY is there not a Big Mac yet, hasbro?!?!?!!?
I do question why we've gotten like...3 Shining Armor's and no Big Mac, despite Big Mac being in the show much longer. Ridiculous.
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The problem with what Flitter said is their strategy is to make My Little Pony disposable to the buyer. "Kids don't hold interest in things as much anymore." "Then let's make our brand even less interesting!" Anyone else see the problem here? I think their market research people have a defeatist attitude and are willing to settle. My Little Pony has grown in popularity, but are they really helping the brand's legacy. It's supposed to be Hasbro's flagship brand for girls, but their attitude it suggests otherwise. Kids come in and go out in a year. It makes money, but leaves little of an impression.
How hard is it to create new characters to sell along side the Mane 6?
Unfortunately, for the most part, kids (and FiM enthusiasts) want what they see on TV. I know when I first started collecting, I only wanted the mane 6, CMC and princesses. I wasn't even interested in more minor characters like Trixie. It's like we've seen in Suited for Success and Canterlot Boutique - you can make the most creative and innovative and beautiful thing ever, but people will still reject it in favor of what they're most familiar with.
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Good point, Moonbeam. I'm personally not a fan of collecting the Funko ponies, but there are a lot of really beautiful ones. There's also the chibi ponies and other vinyl figures. Talk about cute!!!!!! I think those chibs are what I'm going to ask for as my Christmas gift since I'm already being bothered about it. :devious:
Most people's issue seems to lie with the variation of official Hasbro brushables in comparison to previous generations. Yes, there are tons of other types of g4 products that are totally fabulous but the lack of ponies found in your average store shelves is what highlights this problem.
I'm pretty excited for the chibis. Ponies in dynamic poses? Gimme gimme!
You're right, which is why I added that I think most of us have the same issue with the lack of variety in brushables. I guess, personally, it doesn't bother me as much because I do collect other pony related things. Like I'd love to see more fashion style ponies, but considering Hasbro also has this huge problem with distribution, it makes it harder to care. :cry:
I suppose my lack of nostalgia for My Little Pony is why I sort of went off like I did. I guess if brushable ponies are all you've known and loved, then it's hard to see Hasbro move away from that. At the same time, I'm aware that things change to fit what's popular and for a brand that has children as the target audience, us adults will likely never fully understand what kids really want and like.
When I first began collecting G4, I didn't want any pony that wasn't familiar to me. Now? My tune has certainly changed and I embrace any new characters we can get, but I don't doubt that there are other collectors and even kids out there that would rather pick up a familiar pony as opposed to one that they don't recognize.
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I've actually lost track of how many times I've overheard a kid in the pony aisle ask for something, and their parents refused because they don't want to pay for something they already have, like a new princess that was packaged with Pinkie Pie etc. I can see that. If my son was asking for a toy that came bundled with something he already had, or it was just another version of something he already had, I would refuse too.
I see that they want to have the mane 6 available, but I wish they would have 1 of each out, along with a whole wave new ponies. I haven't been tempted to buy MLP in quite a while
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I guess I'm one of the "old timers" who likes nostalgia mixed with ponies. I just have a hard time adapting to collectible ponies without the brushable hair. But at the same time, I adore my Funko ponies and consider them a part of my collection. I keep up with them and buy them regularly. I just wish that, alongside these releases, we could get some new brushables. In the beginning of the G4 line, Hasbro was doing this. And those brushables seemed to sell. So why now have they limited themselves to the main characters with maybe a couple new ones each year? To me, they are limiting themselves. There is nothing wrong with having some different characters on the shelves along with the main six. Variety is great. I am sure that not all kids that play with the toys are even into the show, so they won't all be hesitant to pick up an unknown character.
Hasbro apparently has their own strategy, and it's not what most collectors want. I really wish I could see the appeal of blind bags. I almost thought of selling all mine. To me, they just can't compare to my G1s and G3s I love so much.
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Hasbro apparently has their own strategy, and it's not what most collectors want. I really wish I could see the appeal of blind bags. I almost thought of selling all mine. To me, they just can't compare to my G1s and G3s I love so much.
DD isn't allowed to take the brushables into the bath with her, only the blind bags :) They are good for that, and for small rewards (like for good behavior at preschool/kindergarten). We used Squinkies for potty-training, but that was before she started to like ponies, otherwise I'm sure we would have used blind bags. I can see how they wouldn't appeal to you if you aren't part of the target market though LOL She loves the G3s because of the magnet hoof--she sticks them all over the house, it's hilarious. Plus, it was a good learning experience with magnets ;)
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I suppose my lack of nostalgia for My Little Pony is why I sort of went off like I did. I guess if brushable ponies are all you've known and loved, then it's hard to see Hasbro move away from that. At the same time, I'm aware that things change to fit what's popular and for a brand that has children as the target audience, us adults will likely never fully understand what kids really want and like.
Nostalgia has nothing to do with it. I had g1s as a kid. I had access to like a really large collection that my "sister" had.
I welcomed g4 because it was a change... A really needed change in my opinion because ponies were bleh to me since themid 90s
However in 10 years from now it'll be different, and that's fine
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Thinking about it, I think the only MLP thing I see sell quickly is the Blind Bags. Cheap, tons of variety, I see why people go for it.
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Unfortunately, for the most part, kids (and FiM enthusiasts) want what they see on TV. I know when I first started collecting, I only wanted the mane 6, CMC and princesses. I wasn't even interested in more minor characters like Trixie. It's like we've seen in Suited for Success and Canterlot Boutique - you can make the most creative and innovative and beautiful thing ever, but people will still reject it in favor of what they're most familiar with.
That goes into how insular the show is written. In five years, few ponies outside of the Mane, Princesses, CMC (throwing Cherilee, Dimaond Tiara, and Silver Spoon in here since they've fixtures of their arc as well) we don't have much characterizations to the other ponies. The few who do haven't seen brushables. No Mrs. Cake, no Granny Smith (old or young), no Big Mac or Mr. Cake. The Wonderbolts have been turned into a farce to make episode to teach dunderhead Rainbow Dash lessons. Sassy Saddles will hopefully be a semi-regular working with Rarity but who knows.
This is the problem with making this a sitcom. Sitcoms rely on the cast being a clique with little to do outside of each other other than their jobs and family. The people rest of the world is basically there to populate the background, and Friendship is Magic has taken this to the extreme. If Ponyville was written more like a community populated by individuals rather than one-note gags on legs, the audience (the actual intended audience) would connect with those other characters as well. One of the reason that episode was such a waste.
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And then you have kids and collectors that do not watch the show. Yes, we actually exist. And we'd love more than just the same 6 characters.
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I get that Hasbro is marketing primarily to kids and not collectors, and I have no problem with all the additional, non-brushable toys and merchandise, but continuously producing new character toys used to apparently work, so what changed? That's what I don't understand.
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so what changed? That's what I don't understand.
Hasbro Marketing: "Pretty, pretty, shiny, shiny. Pretty, pretty, shiny, shiny."
That's their reaction to the brony craze. A bunch of people with a lot of disposable income. They have very little loyalty to the greater brand, but appealing to their tastes makes money now. That's good enough.
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I want to see more boys, and NOT in the blind bag size. WHY is there not a Big Mac yet, hasbro?!?!?!!?
I do question why we've gotten like...3 Shining Armor's and no Big Mac, despite Big Mac being in the show much longer. Ridiculous.
I think they counted Shining Armor as an accessory to Cadance.
Post Merge: October 08, 2015, 03:09:23 PM
so what changed? That's what I don't understand.
Hasbro Marketing: "Pretty, pretty, shiny, shiny. Pretty, pretty, shiny, shiny."
That's their reaction to the brony craze. A bunch of people with a lot of disposable income. They have very little loyalty to the greater brand, but appealing to their tastes makes money now. That's good enough.
Umm, have you ever been around bronies? The majority of them are broke high-schoolers that can't afford much beyond blind bags and maybe a plush or Funko or two.
There's also nowhere near enough of them to make an impact on the main toyline, especially since most of them prefer the merchandise geared more towards their demographic- (vinyl figures, trading cards, etc.)
They're not the cause of everything that's wrong with G4, no matter how much you like to blame them for it.
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You can't deny bronies have caused Hasbro to warp this brand. Whether their impact is tangible or not, the show staff and the company has concentrated on them.
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I have seen how little girls are all over EQG dolls and have little interest in ponies, of the latest releases Coco Pommel, the non main 6 of the cutie mak magic and the breezies sold fast, the main 6 stays in shelves for months
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I'm waiting patiently for new brushables (my fav kind of pony), but we also collect BBs and Funkos, because, pony!
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The age range for MLP is younger than the age range for MH/EAH. The age range for MLP is really into Shopkins right now.
See that's what I don't get.
Clearly Hasbro sees that little kids want to collect various things..
Post Merge: October 08, 2015, 06:23:05 PM
The problem with what Flitter said is their strategy is to make My Little Pony disposable to the buyer. "Kids don't hold interest in things as much anymore." "Then let's make our brand even less interesting!" Anyone else see the problem here? I think their market research people have a defeatist attitude and are willing to settle. My Little Pony has grown in popularity, but are they really helping the brand's legacy. It's supposed to be Hasbro's flagship brand for girls, but their attitude it suggests otherwise. Kids come in and go out in a year. It makes money, but leaves little of an impression.
How hard is it to create new characters to sell along side the Mane 6?
I couldn't agree more!
Post Merge: October 08, 2015, 06:23:24 PM
ARE they selling? I mean, sure the ponies slowly trickle off the shelves, but at a pitiful pace. I think it's pretty apparent that this is hurting Hasbro in the long run. (Or maybe they just sell really slowly around here, haha.)
They definitely aren't in my area.
Post Merge: October 08, 2015, 06:27:23 PM
But when you think about it, there is a TON of pony stuff out there. To like the brand you don't have to have a shelf full of ponies.
THANK YOU!
I say this every time a thread like this pops up (which is incredibly often...) and I think the issue is the mentality of collectors that have been doing this since the beginning: A pony is only a toy with brushable hair and everything else is invalid.
Nope nope nope.
And as someone who is part of this "newer generation of fans" (even though I also collect G1), I feel like this community looks down on me and others like myself because we collect ponies that aren't just brushable and we support other companies that have partnered with Hasbro.
And to say that they're pandering to us? We have the SAME complaints as you do when it comes to the lack of different characters for brushables.
It's fine and dandy to dislike Funko figures, or the various brands of pony plushies, or blind bags, etc. but don't pretend that these are something other than My Little Pony. They may not be your MLP, but they're still MLP. Brushables aren't the only toys that exist for this franchise anymore, sorry. Funko has done a wonderful job of giving us a variety in characters, say what you will about them. The blind bags, while I can see why collectors aren't fond of them, are also doing well in the variety department and we're even getting new poses and play sets with those!
If you pay attention to other toy lines, you'll notice that the smaller, molded, blind bag type toys are actually pretty popular (Shopkins...Shopkins EVERYWHERE) and most toys with brushable hair tend to be dolls (MH, EAH, EqG). It makes a lot of sense why Hasbro has gone the direction they have with ponies, even if we, as collectors, don't totally agree that it's the right direction.
Also, to piggyback off of a previous post, I don't believe collectors make up much of the fan base here. Hasbro isn't trying to appeal to us.
Brands like Funko (I know I keep bringing them up, but they always come to my mind first for stuff like this) are trying to appeal to the collectors for this generation, and even little kids like them! It's really not all about brushables anymore. Times change, you know?
I'm truly sorry, I'm not trying to come off as being mean or anything, but I was kinda right there with the OP until the "pandering to the newest generation of fans" statement and that kinda riled me up, but I'm good now. :thumb:
I don't agree, and I'm sorry if these threads bother you, but it's something you've just now come into contact with. People that have been collecting most of their lives have seen this struggle with the brand over and over again.
G4 looked promising in the beginning because they were releasing new characters.
And I'm not too sure I get your Funko point? Because they seem to be rereleasing the same characters over and over again as well..NMM, Lyra(which was only named that because of Bronies..when did Hasbro do that for us?), BonBon, SweetieBelle...
Post Merge: October 08, 2015, 06:30:12 PM
Of course it's all My Little Pony, but ponies with brushable are the core the very concept of My Little Pony. It's like the handheld RPG's for Pokemon. There's tons of other spinoff games and merchandise for Pokemon, but the handheld RPG's are what define the brand.
The problem is not that these annexes exist. The problem is they've taken over the brand. They're the ones that have a wide variety of characters and better designs. Money is going into them while brushables seem to be an after thought.
And, as a business major, I can tell Hasbro seems to only care about the short-term wins with this brand. They don't care about customer retention and maintaining the legacy. Sure it makes money now, but what happens when Friendship is Magic ends and it's time to move on? You're going to lose the vast majority of bronies and the money they put into this secondary market that's commandeered the brand. The brand itself will have a reputation for being limited and cheap. If they've trademarked the name, Hasbro should be making a brushable of it.
Yes, this!! x infinity!!
Post Merge: October 08, 2015, 06:31:34 PM
The problem with what Flitter said is their strategy is to make My Little Pony disposable to the buyer. "Kids don't hold interest in things as much anymore." "Then let's make our brand even less interesting!" Anyone else see the problem here? I think their market research people have a defeatist attitude and are willing to settle. My Little Pony has grown in popularity, but are they really helping the brand's legacy. It's supposed to be Hasbro's flagship brand for girls, but their attitude it suggests otherwise. Kids come in and go out in a year. It makes money, but leaves little of an impression.
How hard is it to create new characters to sell along side the Mane 6?
Unfortunately, for the most part, kids (and FiM enthusiasts) want what they see on TV. I know when I first started collecting, I only wanted the mane 6, CMC and princesses. I wasn't even interested in more minor characters like Trixie. It's like we've seen in Suited for Success and Canterlot Boutique - you can make the most creative and innovative and beautiful thing ever, but people will still reject it in favor of what they're most familiar with.
Aaaaaand what did we learn in the end of that episode? XD
Ultimately that's not what makes others happy!
Post Merge: October 08, 2015, 06:36:15 PM
I want to see more boys, and NOT in the blind bag size. WHY is there not a Big Mac yet, hasbro?!?!?!!?
I do question why we've gotten like...3 Shining Armor's and no Big Mac, despite Big Mac being in the show much longer. Ridiculous.
I think they counted Shining Armor as an accessory to Cadance.
Post Merge: October 08, 2015, 03:09:23 PM
so what changed? That's what I don't understand.
Hasbro Marketing: "Pretty, pretty, shiny, shiny. Pretty, pretty, shiny, shiny."
That's their reaction to the brony craze. A bunch of people with a lot of disposable income. They have very little loyalty to the greater brand, but appealing to their tastes makes money now. That's good enough.
Umm, have you ever been around bronies? The majority of them are broke high-schoolers that can't afford much beyond blind bags and maybe a plush or Funko or two.
There's also nowhere near enough of them to make an impact on the main toyline, especially since most of them prefer the merchandise geared more towards their demographic- (vinyl figures, trading cards, etc.)
They're not the cause of everything that's wrong with G4, no matter how much you like to blame them for it.
Eh....I'd have to disagree.
Post Merge: October 08, 2015, 06:37:38 PM
You can't deny bronies have caused Hasbro to warp this brand. Whether their impact is tangible or not, the show staff and the company has concentrated on them.
Exactly, and yet they don't really buy the merchandise, as was stated above.
So why does Hasbro keep pandering to them? No offense to those who identify as Brony
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The age range for MLP is younger than the age range for MH/EAH. The age range for MLP is really into Shopkins right now.
See that's what I don't get.
Clearly Hasbro sees that little kids want to collect various things..
That's what the mini figures are for. These days it seems the brushables are just being done to fulfill contractual obligations. Tbh I'm not even sure having a variety of characters would fix the brushables not selling well. I recently saw a mom suggesting her daughter to get a brushable pony because it's a character she doesn't have but she didn't want it. But the girl would rather spend her money on a couple of blind packaged things.
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I have been starting to feel this way again. This is what happened to me when the core 7 and the 3.5 ponies came out. I left the hobby! I was so sad that no new ponies would be coming out.
It took me a while to start to like the G4 ponies, I did not buy one till the end of 2011. I really got into them for a while but now I have stopped. They are all the same and starting to look to weird for me.
I guess that is why I have taken up Breyers again. They sure at not cheap! But I like how they are always bring out something different. I am sad to say but I think Hasbro is going to lose me again. But I don't think they really care.
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And I'm not too sure I get your Funko point? Because they seem to be rereleasing the same characters over and over again as well..NMM, Lyra(which was only named that because of Bronies..when did Hasbro do that for us?), BonBon, SweetieBelle...
I'm actually a little confused by this now. Aside from variants (which Funko does for ALL of their products btw) when have they rereleased the same characters over and over again? As an avid collector of the Funko figures and someone who has all of the regular and chase vinyls, I'm not sure I get what you mean. :huh: There are 20+ different characters in the regular vinyl line right now, some of whom never even got a brushable yet, and we're getting 4 more new ones before the year ends. As far as I'm concerned, these are way more varied than the brushables that Hasbro has been putting out.
Also, if you mean that Funko is just putting out ponies that Hasbro already has, Bon Bon (Sweetie Drops) had a Funko figure way before they ever gave us a brushable of her. ;)
Like I said, you can dislike the non-brushables all you want, I understand, but I was just pointing out a fact. I was going off of what someone said about not having to own brushables in order to still love the brand.
I'm with you in that there need to be more variety in brushables (which I keep stressing), but, also as I said, because I collect outside of the brushables, it really doesn't bother me as much.
As Wardah said, little kids actually do like the blind bags and things that aren't brushables. Blind bag type toys are everywhere, so why wouldn't Hasbro get in on that if they want to make money? 30 years ago maybe this wouldn't have worked, but times change and each generation of children is interested in different things than the last.
I'm sorry if I offended you in anyway or if I'm coming off as condescending or anything like that. I guess this is just a case of people being on two different sides of the spectrum, huh?
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Well, there is one similarity between bronies and collectors: they're both never happy with what they're given.
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Well, there is one similarity between bronies and collectors: they're both never happy with what they're given.
That's actually what really bothered me about bronies in general: they aren't even buying the toys, yet they complained. Collectors complaining? Makes more sense. Either way, both groups make a small dent compared to the target audience.
But yeah, you're right. Everyone needs to complain about something. :lol:
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You can't deny bronies have caused Hasbro to warp this brand. Whether their impact is tangible or not, the show staff and the company has concentrated on them.
If Hasbro concentrated on bronies, Twilight wouldn't be a Princess, Equestria Girls wouldn't be on shelves, and everything would have molded hair. They'd also definitely de-pink all of the packaging.
How many of them do you know personally, and do you really interact with them often or at all?
I'm around these people frequently- in forums, in streams, in person- and have been for years now. I can tell you one thing for certain: they don't actively collect merchandise like we do and they aren't interested in the kid's toys. Only a couple I know personally have enough merchandise to call it a collection, and in total is about as much as most of us get every four months or so. They're fans of the show, not toy collectors.
How can they ruin the toy line when they as a whole have almost no interest in it? Or, again, when the bulk of them are still in high school and have very little or no money to spend?
What exactly have you seen that gives you the impression they're the focus of what you see in the toy aisle? Because I'm not seeing it.
You know, that whole fandom has pulled a lot of crap that made me not want to consider myself a part of it anymore, even if I am around them a lot. Even so, if I'm going to blame them for something, it's going to be for something that's actually their fault, and not just out of blind hatred.
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You can't deny bronies have caused Hasbro to warp this brand. Whether their impact is tangible or not, the show staff and the company has concentrated on them.
If Hasbro concentrated on bronies, Twilight wouldn't be a Princess, Equestria Girls wouldn't be on shelves, and everything would have molded hair. They'd also definitely de-pink all of the packaging.
How many of them do you know personally, and do you really interact with them often or at all?
I'm around these people frequently- in forums, in streams, in person- and have been for years now. I can tell you one thing for certain: they don't actively collect merchandise like we do and they aren't interested in the kid's toys. Only a couple I know personally have enough merchandise to call it a collection, and in total is about as much as most of us get every four months or so. They're fans of the show, not toy collectors.
How can they ruin the toy line when they as a whole have almost no interest in it? Or, again, when the bulk of them are still in high school and have very little or no money to spend?
What exactly have you seen that gives you the impression they're the focus of what you see in the toy aisle? Because I'm not seeing it.
You know, that whole fandom has pulled a lot of crap that made me not want to consider myself a part of it anymore, even if I am around them a lot. Even so, if I'm going to blame them for something, it's going to be for something that's actually their fault, and not just out of blind hatred.
DitzyDoo, DrHooves, DJPON3, Octavia, Lyra..
These are just a few things.
I honestly feel as though EQG was brought on by the rampant humanized "art" made by Bronies as well.
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You can't deny bronies have caused Hasbro to warp this brand. Whether their impact is tangible or not, the show staff and the company has concentrated on them.
If Hasbro concentrated on bronies, Twilight wouldn't be a Princess, Equestria Girls wouldn't be on shelves, and everything would have molded hair. They'd also definitely de-pink all of the packaging.
How many of them do you know personally, and do you really interact with them often or at all?
I'm around these people frequently- in forums, in streams, in person- and have been for years now. I can tell you one thing for certain: they don't actively collect merchandise like we do and they aren't interested in the kid's toys. Only a couple I know personally have enough merchandise to call it a collection, and in total is about as much as most of us get every four months or so. They're fans of the show, not toy collectors.
How can they ruin the toy line when they as a whole have almost no interest in it? Or, again, when the bulk of them are still in high school and have very little or no money to spend?
What exactly have you seen that gives you the impression they're the focus of what you see in the toy aisle? Because I'm not seeing it.
You know, that whole fandom has pulled a lot of crap that made me not want to consider myself a part of it anymore, even if I am around them a lot. Even so, if I'm going to blame them for something, it's going to be for something that's actually their fault, and not just out of blind hatred.
DitzyDoo, DrHooves, DJPON3, Octavia, Lyra..
These are just a few things.
I honestly feel as though EQG was brought on by the rampant humanized "art" made by Bronies as well.
Hasbro pretty obviously just wanted in on all that doll money MH and EAH were earning. I really don't see how anyone can think it was of brony influence...Hasbro is really into chasing "hot" toy trends right now. Look at blind bags too.
Gonna have to agree with zombienixon...bronies do not buy these things. Every time merch gets announced on the big sites, there's always a big stream of "Too girly" "No molded hair, no buy" "I don't want this" "I don't want to be caught with merchandise"
The amount of bronies who buy merchandise is pretty small. Probably much smaller than the collector base.
I'll actually say that that's how I ended up on this forum to begin with. Out of all the brony type forums...NONE of them had any interest in discussing the toys or merchandise. A lot of them even looked down on people who were into it.
I can't help but wonder...if bronies did not exist, but blind bags and EQG still did, who would everyone be blaming for the stuff they don't like? Just Hasbro? Interesting to think about.
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You can't deny bronies have caused Hasbro to warp this brand. Whether their impact is tangible or not, the show staff and the company has concentrated on them.
Bronies have caused most warp in the show, rather than the merchandise. If the two thing I've noticed in the latter was that Bubbles/Muffins/:muffin: Pony became an actual figure, and various background ponies recieved brony-based nicknames, such as Lyra, or DJ Pon-3. And that Equestria Girls was named Equestria Girls and not Horseshoe High or something.
Thing is, bronies don't really care about the merchandise (heck, collectors are shoved into the 'rabid brony' sub-category most of the time which is the most ironic thing ever), but rather spend their money own their own creations, such as music albums, documentaries about themselves, adult magazines, pictures about their OCs, etc...
As I always say, the brony fandom is the fandom of itself.
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But when you think about it, there is a TON of pony stuff out there. To like the brand you don't have to have a shelf full of ponies.
THANK YOU!
I say this every time a thread like this pops up (which is incredibly often...) and I think the issue is the mentality of collectors that have been doing this since the beginning: A pony is only a toy with brushable hair and everything else is invalid.
Nope nope nope.
With both of you here. Brands change.
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I've got a question...
Someone mentioned before that MLP is targeted at children who are concentrated on Shopkins nowadays...
How many years do those kids have?
Was MLP always targeted to that age range?
Because, if I'm not wrong, Shopkin fans are really little kids, but in the G1 years I heard of people who had ponies and shown them without shame even in highschool years...
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In G1 they took the "3 and Up" label as not just a safety warning but a demographic. They kept the brand fresh year after year so fans new and old had something to grab their attention. "A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush" as they say. Similar thing with G3. We started to see some characters run through the brand due to popularity, but there were always new ponies coming in. G4 was the same at first, but marketing has decided to aim low for customer retention. They care about new customers, not trying to keep those who have already bought all the Mane 6 and are looking for more ponies when it comes to the brushables.
And brands due change, but the identity remains the same. Again, Pokemon will always be about handheld RPG's at its core. That's what makes Pokemon Pokemon. What makes My Little Pony My Little Pony is a toy pony with brushable hair. Not mini-figures. Not supplemental merchandise. I feel like Hasbro has forgotten that.
And might I add that certain documentary about bronies started with an introduction written by a (now former) member of the staff and featured two prominent voice actors from the show belittling the brand's past by reinforcing the stereotypes and stigmas that have been wrongfully slapped on it by its detractors? If I was in charge of MLP and saw that, I would have said, "Amy, Tara, John; you're all fired."
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If I was in charge of MLP and saw that, I would have said, "Amy, Tara, John; you're all fired."
Then this'd have happened.
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I think the weird thing to be is that despite the fact most bronies aren't particularly into the merchandise, they still have a level of influence over it. I don't think it is necessarily their fault per se, but more of Hasbro's for actually listening to them complain about merch they don't buy. I think Hasbro has a bad tendency to overestimate the sales they can get out of bronies or something.
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And brands due change, but the identity remains the same. Again, Pokemon will always be about handheld RPG's at its core. That's what makes Pokemon Pokemon. What makes My Little Pony My Little Pony is a toy pony with brushable hair. Not mini-figures. Not supplemental merchandise. I feel like Hasbro has forgotten that.
What makes MLP MLP are cute, colorful small horses marketed towards children. I feel like collectors have forgotten that.
Post Merge: October 09, 2015, 06:23:37 AM
Well, there is one similarity between bronies and collectors: they're both never happy with what they're given.
[mic drop]
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What makes MLP MLP are cute, colorful small horses marketed towards children. I feel like collectors have forgotten that.
This x1000000
We're adult collectors. Hasbro absolutely doesn't have to conform to our wants, no matter how entitled some of us think we are.
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What makes MLP MLP are cute, colorful small horses marketed towards children. I feel like collectors have forgotten that.
A-FREAKING-MEN!!!
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I agree, that's why I'm collecting different G4 ponies rather than core 6 ponies. I know G1 is still top of generations, I loved simple design and colourful.
Of course G4 is better than G3 because there's villains and males! <3 I do love Funko vinyl figures.
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What makes MLP MLP are cute, colorful small horses marketed towards children. I feel like collectors have forgotten that.
I think you've failed to understand the term "brand identity." "Cute, colorful, small horses marketed towards children" is vague, broad, and poor for identifying yourself. "Cute, colorful, small horses with brushable hair marketed towards children" narrows the definition to make it more identifiable. It tells us what to expect in terms of the play experience when purchasing them. Similar to how Transformers aren't just "Toy robots" but "Toy robots that transform into toy vehicles."
Again, Pokemon is defined by its handheld RPG's. Gundam is defined by the titular robots and their distinctive look.
These characteristics are not the be all and end all of the brand. Spinoff products and merchandising add their profile as well as revenue. However, they should be the characteristics that pop into people's heads first when they hear those names.
Why is this so hard for some people to wrap their head around this?
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What makes MLP MLP are cute, colorful small horses marketed towards children. I feel like collectors have forgotten that.
I think you've failed to understand the term "brand identity." "Cute, colorful, small horses marketed towards children" is vague, broad, and poor for identifying yourself. "Cute, colorful, small horses with brushable hair marketed towards children" narrows the definition to make it more identifiable. It tells us what to expect in terms of the play experience when purchasing them. Similar to how Transformers aren't just "Toy robots" but "Toy robots that transform into toy vehicles."
Again, Pokemon is defined by its handheld RPG's. Gundam is defined by the titular robots and their distinctive look.
These characteristics are not the be all and end all of the brand. Spinoff products and merchandising add their profile as well as revenue. However, they should be the characteristics that pop into people's heads first when they hear those names.
Why is this so hard for some people to wrap their head around this?
all you did was add one more identifier to the toy to continue to funnel down the description--at the end of the day, it's small horse toys used for pretend play by young girls. That's it. Nothing else. None of your high and mighty business class arguments--My Little Pony is just that: A LITTLE PONY.
And your last sentence is really rude (actually, your whole response and tone towards others in this thread), which I really don't appreciate, considering IT IS JUST A TOY.
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Hasbro has already going on like this like for some years. I'm not surprised anymore and I still ask why this arguments keeps popping up. I personally think Hasbro is going a good ways with a lot of variety for everyone. Don't like Brushables? Have some Blind Bags etc. I mean G1 also had the Petittes which weren't brushables. Besides we have advanced a lot in terms of technology which makes it able to make different kind of toys.
I'm just going to be honest. I don't post much new releases anymore because I'm kinda tired having these arguments popping up. Like I mentioned, Hasbro is already going this way with the line since... 2009-2010. At least they're trying and I respect that.
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What makes MLP MLP are cute, colorful small horses marketed towards children. I feel like collectors have forgotten that.
I think you've failed to understand the term "brand identity." "Cute, colorful, small horses marketed towards children" is vague, broad, and poor for identifying yourself. "Cute, colorful, small horses with brushable hair marketed towards children" narrows the definition to make it more identifiable. It tells us what to expect in terms of the play experience when purchasing them. Similar to how Transformers aren't just "Toy robots" but "Toy robots that transform into toy vehicles."
Again, Pokemon is defined by its handheld RPG's. Gundam is defined by the titular robots and their distinctive look.
These characteristics are not the be all and end all of the brand. Spinoff products and merchandising add their profile as well as revenue. However, they should be the characteristics that pop into people's heads first when they hear those names.
Why is this so hard for some people to wrap their head around this?
all you did was add one more identifier to the toy to continue to funnel down the description--at the end of the day, it's small horse toys used for pretend play by young girls. That's it. Nothing else. None of your high and mighty business class arguments--My Little Pony is just that: A LITTLE PONY.
And your last sentence is really rude (actually, your whole response and tone towards others in this thread), which I really don't appreciate, considering IT IS JUST A TOY.
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The title of this thread is "Why, Hasbro?" meaning we are getting into the business side of this. At which point we're not looking at My Little Pony as a toy. We're looking at My Little Pony as a product produced by a company to earn revenue as well as a brand the longevity of which needs to be cared for.
The issue being discussed is a business one. Why is Hasbro limiting the variety of characters with brushable hair? Brushable hair has been a defining characteristic of the brand since its inception. It's as intrinsic to the brand as Transformers transforming. Even the dinosaur had a brushable mane. Why is Hasbro tradmarking names and likenesses but not making them into what has been this brand's bread and butter for almost 35 years?
And yes, the brushable hair is an added descriptor to funnel down the definition. That's how branding works. Crispx is a checkered cereal. However, Crispx having a corn side and a rice side makes it Crispx and different from other checkered cereals like Chex.
Just because the end product is a toy doesn't mean we can't discuss the business decisions going on behind it we find odd or disappointing.
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O_o the brand has nothing to do with being brushable. And... Things change.
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I agree with those who have said that having brushable hair is not the defining characteristic of the brand. This has never been how I've seen My Little Pony, and I've been a collector since I bought the FF Bluebelle from a dept. store. For me, the My Little Pony brand is encapsulated by colorful ponies. G1 mainly consisted of plastic ponies with brushable hair, but even G1 had their own version of the blind bags- the Petite Ponies. There were also comics, playsets (for both petite and standard ponies), plushies, party supplies and tons upon tons of merch. If MLP is only brushable ponies, then are Petites not part of the MLP brand? I think of the MLP brand as being more broad and everything produced as supporting the brand identity.
Still, just because this is how I see the MLP brand, it doesn't mean this is how Hasbro sees it, or should see it. Even if "colorful ponies" was 100% Hasbro's brand identity in the 80's and 90's, it doesn't mean that is or should be their brand identity now. I don't think anyone can say, 100% what MLP brand is other than Hasbro, should they come out with a brand statement or something. All individual collectors can say is what the brand is for them. Likewise, I don't know what's working for them or isn't working for them. I have no desire to shoehorn myself into the mindset of Hasbro's target market- kids and I don't have my finger on the pulse of hip new directions in toy options. I do know that my 9 year old daughter is fiercely into shopkins which I honestly think are creepy as heck.
ETA: I still love the brushables best though and as a collector of brushables, I'd be happy as anything to see more of them in the store.
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What makes MLP MLP are cute, colorful small horses marketed towards children. I feel like collectors have forgotten that.
I think you've failed to understand the term "brand identity." "Cute, colorful, small horses marketed towards children" is vague, broad, and poor for identifying yourself. "Cute, colorful, small horses with brushable hair marketed towards children" narrows the definition to make it more identifiable. It tells us what to expect in terms of the play experience when purchasing them. Similar to how Transformers aren't just "Toy robots" but "Toy robots that transform into toy vehicles."
Again, Pokemon is defined by its handheld RPG's. Gundam is defined by the titular robots and their distinctive look.
These characteristics are not the be all and end all of the brand. Spinoff products and merchandising add their profile as well as revenue. However, they should be the characteristics that pop into people's heads first when they hear those names.
Why is this so hard for some people to wrap their head around this?
all you did was add one more identifier to the toy to continue to funnel down the description--at the end of the day, it's small horse toys used for pretend play by young girls. That's it. Nothing else. None of your high and mighty business class arguments--My Little Pony is just that: A LITTLE PONY.
And your last sentence is really rude (actually, your whole response and tone towards others in this thread), which I really don't appreciate, considering IT IS JUST A TOY.
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The title of this thread is "Why, Hasbro?" meaning we are getting into the business side of this. At which point we're not looking at My Little Pony as a toy. We're looking at My Little Pony as a product produced by a company to earn revenue as well as a brand the longevity of which needs to be cared for.
The issue being discussed is a business one. Why is Hasbro limiting the variety of characters with brushable hair? Brushable hair has been a defining characteristic of the brand since its inception. It's as intrinsic to the brand as Transformers transforming. Even the dinosaur had a brushable mane. Why is Hasbro tradmarking names and likenesses but not making them into what has been this brand's bread and butter for almost 35 years?
And yes, the brushable hair is an added descriptor to funnel down the definition. That's how branding works. Crispx is a checkered cereal. However, Crispx having a corn side and a rice side makes it Crispx and different from other checkered cereals like Chex.
Just because the end product is a toy doesn't mean we can't discuss the business decisions going on behind it we find odd or disappointing.
Dude, chill.
The truth of the matter is, if new pony characters with brushable hair were selling like hotcakes, Hasbro would continue to make very many of them. No person in their right mind on Hasbro's marketing team would continue doing the same old thing just for the sake of brand identity. If they couldn't make their brand work with present trends in toy sales, MLP would be nowhere.
I only collect brushable ponies myself, and I too am disappointed by the lack of variety. All you can do is not buy the stuff you don't want to see. There are HUNDREDS of brushables from all the previous generations of MLP for everyone to collect if they don't like the newer products in the MLP line.
You can't force the same old product down people's throats just for nostalgia's sake...
At the end of the day, brushable ponies are just cheap, mass-produced toys, made for a very narrow target audience.
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Thank you for that -- I think of this line whenever these overly-serious topics come up XD
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I think the weird thing to be is that despite the fact most bronies aren't particularly into the merchandise, they still have a level of influence over it. I don't think it is necessarily their fault per se, but more of Hasbro's for actually listening to them complain about merch they don't buy. I think Hasbro has a bad tendency to overestimate the sales they can get out of bronies or something.
I think this is where a lot of frustration comes from. To a lot of collectors brushables are the most important part of the toyline. So it sucks to see that part of the toyline decline while bronies get a lot that caters to them.
You can't say "you can't complain cause this is just a toyline aimed at kids" while other adult fans get what they want. Personally i'm dissapointed that the brushable toyline is boring beyond belief but there is still enough that keeps me amused. (Though these days i enjoy collecting Pokemon more) If G4 stops entertaining me i will just collect older gens or wait for G5.
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I've already said brushable ponies aren't the be all and end all of the brand. Never has been, never will be. I like the Pokemon comparison because it has had several iterations and a why range of spinoff games and merchandise while what has been at the core of the brand (the RPG's for handhelds) remains the core. Could you imagine Pokemon creating a species and having merchandise made of it and including it in their spinoff games and not having it in their next handheld RPG? That's what these characters not coming out as brushables feels like.
Another thing that disappoints me about brushables is they're not that well designed. The proportions seem off which is not a problem with the blindbag ponies. They should design the molds better (like take the better designed fashion-style molds and proportionally scale them down for the standard size). My friend said that is why he is turned off by them.
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True, the other day I went up to "snowcatcher" that wanted a custom and they were just the same as ever.
use google translator, the translation might not be correct
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What makes MLP MLP are cute, colorful small horses marketed towards children. I feel like collectors have forgotten that. [And, on preview, so on and so forth]
Ehhh... I get what you're saying, but from a technical perspective of the toy industry, this is slightly inaccurate. "My Little Pony" as a brand can (and does!) encompass many iterations on the "colorful horses" theme, from miniature figurines (Petites/Ponyville/BBs) to category-jumping "big girl" fare (Dream Beauties/EQG). But for My-Little-Ponies-as-product, "hair play" is one of the key features that drives its play pattern. The characteristic of being horses provided a welcome respite for kids who didn't care for humanoid fashion dolls and allowed MLP to explode in its niche, but from a broad toy perspective, this is somewhat secondary. If you distilled Barbie down into "blonde woman" you wouldn't be wrong, but you would be off the mark as to why she's a successful toy. This seems to be a conflict of perspective between people who merely consume toys and those who are also interested in what goes on "under the hood" which isn't going to be resolved by a bunch of back-and-forth NO U'ing so... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I will say My Little Pony traditionally had two other main factors that drove its success, besides the non-human hair play aspect. One was a pony's adaptability: it could be played with a certain way one day and another way the next, and provided a lot of room for imaginative, story-building play. The other was collectibility: each pony was distinguished from the next, and the prospect of constantly adding to your collection is inherently marketable. What MLP is is only one leg of the toy success tripod, with what you can have and what you can do them being the others.
Hasbro has been frankly slacking on collectibility since G2, recycling colors schemes, names, and symbols, with a return to form in early G3 but a rapid drop-off circa 2008 which choked out the line. Unless you were a fiend for cheap accessories, "catching them all" was laughably easy to accomplish. Adaptability was also sacrificed in late G3-G4 with Hasbro's steadfast and inexplicable desire to hang the MLP franchise on characters instead of character. There's little room for creative, open-ended play when the only ponies you can buy are "pre-loaded" with personalities, and little engagement with the new products once you buy all the characters. To be clear, these are both issues that predate FiM, but it's a lot easier to notice that the tail is now wagging the dog when the tail is frankly the dog's most distinctive feature by design.
The sticking point for curmudgeon collectors is that, with the diminishing investment in "brushable" production, MLP is now falling on all three of these of its traditional features. The Venn diagram overlap between collectibility, adaptability, and "colorful hair to style" in a pony-shaped package has effectively shrunk to nil, and the brand identity has gone with it. So what is Hasbro's vision for the My Little Pony brand now? Fashion dolls? Mini figures? Art & craft kits? (Not including the plush, collectible cards, and designer vinyl toys from outside licenses.) If Hasbro has no direction other than "a cute, colorful small horse" (or apparently human-horse hybrid!) being all a toy needs to be a My Little Pony, then that's not brand diversification, that's brand dilution. My Little Pony got to where it is because it was different from other girls' toys and spawned copycats; to see the brand become the copycats instead of innovating on their core theme is kind of sad.
Yes, brands need to change and incorporate trends to stay fresh and current, but changing into whatever is popular is a recipe for no one to like you because there's no you to like. Basically, the plot of every kids' show: Be confident and true to yourself, and you'll make your real friends who respect you for being you. Blindly mold yourself to fit every fashion, and you'll eventually alienate everyone for being fake and hate yourself in the morning.
I think the issue is the mentality of collectors that have been doing this since the beginning: A pony is only a toy with brushable hair and everything else is invalid.
I feel badly for collectors who have come on the scene with FiM; sometimes you seem take long-time collectors' opinions very personally. (Not meaning YOU you here, but general-you.) I realize it can't be very fun to show off your Funko collection and have someone respond with "so you don't have any actual ponies?". It sucks to feel like you're being put down, but it's not a judgement on you, just that G1-3 collectors have become so accustomed to specifying that they have n ponies plus or minus x petites, y plush, z fakies, etc., that its sometimes counter-instinctual to imagine collections consist solely of minifigs or non-Hasbro products or fashion dolls. It doesn't mean your love for MLP is invalid, just that it's in a different form than what collectors have become used to over the decades, and they sometimes don't cushion their words enough to soften the fact that they can't immediately relate to your perspective.
On the other hand, please keep in mind that its also not fun for something that you've enjoyed for 20+ years to get edged out so much that you have to specify "brushables" for what was once the entire line. It also hurts to have a new crop of pony fans come on the scene and say "you've had your time with MLP; it's ours now" and claim that long-time collectors, of all people, have forgotten what ponies are. When a new MLP fan says "the brand has to change", a stubborn previous-gen collector hears "the brand has to change to suit me", and having Hasbro tacitly agreeing just rubs salt in the wound. At least the majority of long-time fans learned from the G2 wars that it's not worth attacking other collectors over, so their community is relatively free of "what you like sucks, ergo, you suck." (Hasbro and their decisions are still free game though!)
Just something to think about if you feel like you're being unfairly persecuted. ;) I hate to see people flame out.
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Right on, BlushingBlue! Very well-written insights, and I wholeheartedly agree with it all. :)
Al-1701, how do the Fashion Style toys differ from the small brushables in design? Better proportions overall? I was looking between the two and the most I noticed was that the small dolls seemed to have larger heads and smaller eyes.
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It's not that kids want 30 Pinkie Pies. They want Pinkie Pie, and 6 months later they've "grown out" of MLP and are onto something else, and Hasbro knows this. I often get the feeling that collectors see themselves as a larger group than they actually are. Lifelong supporters of the brand don't have that much influence because they are a small part of the market and the brand is meant to cater to little girls so hasbro produce what their market research suggests little girls would like. All the gimmick-y ponies I'm sure are based on this. Adult/teen fim collectors have gotten more attention in recent years, yes, and there has been licensed merch. geared towards them but I think that has more to do with pop culture trends.
More often than not it seems kids are only into something for a few years at best before moving onto another thing they like. I was the same way when I was a kid. This is why we see so much repeat. I think the stagnancy on store shelves is more of a mix of economy and other things competing for kid's attention than the lack of new characters. I do think hasbro has made some dumb decisions and missed opportunities as far as mlp goes but the model they are following seems to work for them or else the would change. They have made several strives to stretch the appeal of MLP to older and younger kids (playskool, EqG, expanded licence merch. etc.) but I think while maybe I, as an adult G4 collector like more, different characters, that may not be what would keep most of the current generation of kids interested.
It does seem to be becoming more "socially acceptable" for adults to like cartoons and collect figures and merchandise but MLP focus is more to be relevant to kids of a certain age group than to attract a group and foster lifelong collecting of the same thing. I hope I somewhat make sense I'm tired
:zzz:
nicely said.
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Seriously, thank you for that post, BlushingBlue.
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I can't help but think if they had focused on brushables as the main tentpole of the brand they would have ended up doing like they did with G2 and folded up MLP (in the US at least). But they put so much effort into the show that they can't accept that fate and instead are trying to adapt MLP to today's trends.
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Ahh, I get it now, BlushingBlue. Thank you for posting that.
Also, g2 wars? :o
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Hasbro has already going on like this like for some years. I'm not surprised anymore and I still ask why this arguments keeps popping up. I personally think Hasbro is going a good ways with a lot of variety for everyone. Don't like Brushables? Have some Blind Bags etc. I mean G1 also had the Petittes which weren't brushables. Besides we have advanced a lot in terms of technology which makes it able to make different kind of toys.
I'm just going to be honest. I don't post much new releases anymore because I'm kinda tired having these arguments popping up. Like I mentioned, Hasbro is already going this way with the line since... 2009-2010. At least they're trying and I respect that.
The petite had brush able tails tho :/
Bling bags would be so much better if their tales were brush able!
Post Merge: October 09, 2015, 04:13:24 PM
O_o the brand has nothing to do with being brushable. And... Things change.
Uhnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnmmmmm...
Post Merge: October 09, 2015, 04:15:48 PM
I think the weird thing to be is that despite the fact most bronies aren't particularly into the merchandise, they still have a level of influence over it. I don't think it is necessarily their fault per se, but more of Hasbro's for actually listening to them complain about merch they don't buy. I think Hasbro has a bad tendency to overestimate the sales they can get out of bronies or something.
I think this is where a lot of frustration comes from. To a lot of collectors brushables are the most important part of the toyline. So it sucks to see that part of the toyline decline while bronies get a lot that caters to them.
You can't say "you can't complain cause this is just a toyline aimed at kids" while other adult fans get what they want. Personally i'm dissapointed that the brushable toyline is boring beyond belief but there is still enough that keeps me amused. (Though these days i enjoy collecting Pokemon more) If G4 stops entertaining me i will just collect older gens or wait for G5.
Thank you
Post Merge: October 09, 2015, 04:23:18 PM
What makes MLP MLP are cute, colorful small horses marketed towards children. I feel like collectors have forgotten that. [And, on preview, so on and so forth]
Ehhh... I get what you're saying, but from a technical perspective of the toy industry, this is slightly inaccurate. "My Little Pony" as a brand can (and does!) encompass many iterations on the "colorful horses" theme, from miniature figurines (Petites/Ponyville/BBs) to category-jumping "big girl" fare (Dream Beauties/EQG). But for My-Little-Ponies-as-product, "hair play" is one of the key features that drives its play pattern. The characteristic of being horses provided a welcome respite for kids who didn't care for humanoid fashion dolls and allowed MLP to explode in its niche, but from a broad toy perspective, this is somewhat secondary. If you distilled Barbie down into "blonde woman" you wouldn't be wrong, but you would be off the mark as to why she's a successful toy. This seems to be a conflict of perspective between people who merely consume toys and those who are also interested in what goes on "under the hood" which isn't going to be resolved by a bunch of back-and-forth NO U'ing so... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I will say My Little Pony traditionally had two other main factors that drove its success, besides the non-human hair play aspect. One was a pony's adaptability: it could be played with a certain way one day and another way the next, and provided a lot of room for imaginative, story-building play. The other was collectibility: each pony was distinguished from the next, and the prospect of constantly adding to your collection is inherently marketable. What MLP is is only one leg of the toy success tripod, with what you can have and what you can do them being the others.
Hasbro has been frankly slacking on collectibility since G2, recycling colors schemes, names, and symbols, with a return to form in early G3 but a rapid drop-off circa 2008 which choked out the line. Unless you were a fiend for cheap accessories, "catching them all" was laughably easy to accomplish. Adaptability was also sacrificed in late G3-G4 with Hasbro's steadfast and inexplicable desire to hang the MLP franchise on characters instead of character. There's little room for creative, open-ended play when the only ponies you can buy are "pre-loaded" with personalities, and little engagement with the new products once you buy all the characters. To be clear, these are both issues that predate FiM, but it's a lot easier to notice that the tail is now wagging the dog when the tail is frankly the dog's most distinctive feature by design.
The sticking point for curmudgeon collectors is that, with the diminishing investment in "brushable" production, MLP is now falling on all three of these of its traditional features. The Venn diagram overlap between collectibility, adaptability, and "colorful hair to style" in a pony-shaped package has effectively shrunk to nil, and the brand identity has gone with it. So what is Hasbro's vision for the My Little Pony brand now? Fashion dolls? Mini figures? Art & craft kits? (Not including the plush, collectible cards, and designer vinyl toys from outside licenses.) If Hasbro has no direction other than "a cute, colorful small horse" (or apparently human-horse hybrid!) being all a toy needs to be a My Little Pony, then that's not brand diversification, that's brand dilution. My Little Pony got to where it is because it was different from other girls' toys and spawned copycats; to see the brand become the copycats instead of innovating on their core theme is kind of sad.
Yes, brands need to change and incorporate trends to stay fresh and current, but changing into whatever is popular is a recipe for no one to like you because there's no you to like. Basically, the plot of every kids' show: Be confident and true to yourself, and you'll make your real friends who respect you for being you. Blindly mold yourself to fit every fashion, and you'll eventually alienate everyone for being fake and hate yourself in the morning.
I think the issue is the mentality of collectors that have been doing this since the beginning: A pony is only a toy with brushable hair and everything else is invalid.
I feel badly for collectors who have come on the scene with FiM; sometimes you seem take long-time collectors' opinions very personally. (Not meaning YOU you here, but general-you.) I realize it can't be very fun to show off your Funko collection and have someone respond with "so you don't have any actual ponies?". It sucks to feel like you're being put down, but it's not a judgement on you, just that G1-3 collectors have become so accustomed to specifying that they have n ponies plus or minus x petites, y plush, z fakies, etc., that its sometimes counter-instinctual to imagine collections consist solely of minifigs or non-Hasbro products or fashion dolls. It doesn't mean your love for MLP is invalid, just that it's in a different form than what collectors have become used to over the decades, and they sometimes don't cushion their words enough to soften the fact that they can't immediately relate to your perspective.
On the other hand, please keep in mind that its also not fun for something that you've enjoyed for 20+ years to get edged out so much that you have to specify "brushables" for what was once the entire line. It also hurts to have a new crop of pony fans come on the scene and say "you've had your time with MLP; it's ours now" and claim that long-time collectors, of all people, have forgotten what ponies are. When a new MLP fan says "the brand has to change", a stubborn previous-gen collector hears "the brand has to change to suit me", and having Hasbro tacitly agreeing just rubs salt in the wound. At least the majority of long-time fans learned from the G2 wars that it's not worth attacking other collectors over, so their community is relatively free of "what you like sucks, ergo, you suck." (Hasbro and their decisions are still free game though!)
Just something to think about if you feel like you're being unfairly persecuted. ;) I hate to see people flame out.
Someone said the mic was dropped earlier??
Well the mic just detonated the stadium after this reply!!
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Uhnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnmmmmm...
But it's true. It was something that the brand did focus on in the 80s... but it's different now. I mean, some of the very first G4 toys didn't have brushable hair. The brand now is so much more than "brushable hair ponies". In fact, as an example, I can include my family in this generation. My husband has something he likes-- my baby has retro G1 clothes and playskool toys. :/ It's so cool how this generation is so branched out into different age ranges with something for everyone.
It was writing on the wall at the end of G3 that we were going to have something that was different for this generation.
I *GET* it. I get not liking what's out there on the shelves. I didn't like ponies since G1 ended. But things change. 5-10 years now, it'll be different.
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BlushingBlue, that was one of the best posts I have ever read. I see myself quoting it every time this topic comes up from now on.
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Thanks for the kind words. :blush: I have a bad habit of getting super rambly, so I'm glad I managed to make my points coherent.
Ahh, I get it now, BlushingBlue. Thank you for posting that.
Also, g2 wars? :o
Oh man... If you weren't around for the G2 wars, consider yourself lucky. G2 was the first time that the pony collecting community was forced to face the sea-change of a new generation, so there was an almost biblical level of garments rent and teeth gnashed. It didn't help that pony people were literally less mature back then (early 20s at max, I'd say) and G2s were radically different from G1s. There was a lot of "This is an insulting abomination that no real pony fan would want!!!" knife-sharpening from one camp, and "Real pony fans would love ALL ponies, so you MUST love this (or it will end MLP foreverrrrrr)" wailing from another camp, plus a bunch of people caught in between who just wanted to like what they liked without a lot of hard feelings and hateful words. Basically whatever you can imagine with G1-3 vs G4 turned up to 11. Some fine folks dropped out of the community, either silently or spectacularly, because of the constant drama.
They were dark days -- even Hasbro themselves sometimes elide G2 when speaking of MLP history -- but it tempered both the brand and the community into greater resiliency. The price was steep, but that's what made the lessons learned so valuable.
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Thanks for the kind words. :blush: I have a bad habit of getting super rambly, so I'm glad I managed to make my points coherent.
Ahh, I get it now, BlushingBlue. Thank you for posting that.
Also, g2 wars? :o
Oh man... If you weren't around for the G2 wars, consider yourself lucky. G2 was the first time that the pony collecting community was forced to face the sea-change of a new generation, so there was an almost biblical level of garments rent and teeth gnashed. It didn't help that pony people were literally less mature back then (early 20s at max, I'd say) and G2s were radically different from G1s. There was a lot of "This is an insulting abomination that no real pony fan would want!!!" knife-sharpening from one camp, and "Real pony fans would love ALL ponies, so you MUST love this (or it will end MLP foreverrrrrr)" wailing from another camp, plus a bunch of people caught in between who just wanted to like what they liked without a lot of hard feelings and hateful words. Basically whatever you can imagine with G1-3 vs G4 turned up to 11. Some fine folks dropped out of the community, either silently or spectacularly, because of the constant drama.
They were dark days -- even Hasbro themselves sometimes elide G2 when speaking of MLP history -- but it tempered both the brand and the community into greater resiliency. The price was steep, but that's what made the lessons learned so valuable.
Again, I love the way you put things.
And just to add my own two cents by restating what you said in a slightly different way. Most of us "old-time" collectors (yes us old decrepit 30 somethings) come from a time before generations. There wasn't even a g1 term. There was simply My Little Pony. The generation designations came much later. So for most of us mlp is seen through that lense. Ponies had brushable hair just like they were brightly colored and had symbols on their rumps. (Yes, there were the petites but they were such a minor part of the line and most people didn't "count" them when stating how many ponies they had).
We have learned to deal with changes to the design of the ponies through previous gens but G4 is the first time we have had to deal with such truly major changes such as not focusing on the "brushables" or marketing that has changed from focusing on the toys to toys that are focused around the marketing.
Here is a little example.
I've heard several people in this thread and elsewhere say that MLP is defined as "brightly colored ponies."
Just imagine the outcry all pony fans (including G4 and bronies) would have if when G5 finally rolls around ponies where no longer brightly colored. And not just a few but almost all of them. Browns and blacks and greys only.
But previous gens had ponies those colors, one side says. Not being candy colored doesn't mean it's not still My Little Pony!
While technically true, it would still be the kind of seismic shift in the brand as a whole that would make a lot of people wonder why they are collecting MLP and not some other line of fantasy horses/animals.
Don't get me wrong, I like G4. I collect G4. I even have a bunch of the blind bags (it's the playsets with the possibilities of expansive dioramas that really won me over.)
But also I totally get the frustration with the "sea change" as BlushingBlue calls it.
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Man, I want to be articulate as some of the posts on this thread. @_@
All I can really say at this point though is that when G4 is all said and done, I hope it makes the collecting community a lot stronger, just as G2 ultimately did. Maybe when the wounds aren't as fresh, we will be capable of looking back more objectively. For now though, I doubt we can come to a proper conclusion, give it a few years...
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Oh man... If you weren't around for the G2 wars, consider yourself lucky. G2 was the first time that the pony collecting community was forced to face the sea-change of a new generation, so there was an almost biblical level of garments rent and teeth gnashed. It didn't help that pony people were literally less mature back then (early 20s at max, I'd say) and G2s were radically different from G1s. There was a lot of "This is an insulting abomination that no real pony fan would want!!!" knife-sharpening from one camp, and "Real pony fans would love ALL ponies, so you MUST love this (or it will end MLP foreverrrrrr)" wailing from another camp, plus a bunch of people caught in between who just wanted to like what they liked without a lot of hard feelings and hateful words. Basically whatever you can imagine with G1-3 vs G4 turned up to 11. Some fine folks dropped out of the community, either silently or spectacularly, because of the constant drama.
They were dark days -- even Hasbro themselves sometimes elide G2 when speaking of MLP history -- but it tempered both the brand and the community into greater resiliency. The price was steep, but that's what made the lessons learned so valuable.
Doesn't sound worse than any other brony drama I've been into, really. Oh man, are we gonna have this again when G5 comes out? I am so ready.
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I think they might think that because Barbie and her handful of friends keep selling like crazy, every toy line only needs about 6 characters.
Though Barbie has some friends that she disowns for a few decades at a time (poor Midge!).
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I've heard several people in this thread and elsewhere say that MLP is defined as "brightly colored ponies."
Well, that's more of a perspective thing. If G1, G2, or early G3 was what introduced you to MLP, then there's going to be a more specific definition. For new collectors like me and others here it's going to be more general since G4 is what introduced us to MLP, and they've always had the blind bags and brushables alongside each other, so it's kind of what you're accustomed to, especially if you had no knowledge of or interest in previous generations.
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I've heard several people in this thread and elsewhere say that MLP is defined as "brightly colored ponies."
Well, that's more of a perspective thing. If G1, G2, or early G3 was what introduced you to MLP, then there's going to be a more specific definition. For new collectors like me and others here it's going to be more general since G4 is what introduced us to MLP, and they've always had the blind bags and brushables alongside each other, so it's kind of what you're accustomed to, especially if you had no knowledge of or interest in previous generations.
Exactly, that's exactly what I am trying to say. If you are newer to ponies, then your definition of what "My Little Pony" is comes from what is out now. But if you grew up with G1, then your definition is going to be different. Even if it has been decades since then, still G1 was the original version of "My Little Pony" and it can be hard to change that definition after all this time.
With my previous post I was trying to illustrate to newer fans what it would look like if *your* definition of "My Little Pony" was no longer what Hasbro was producing. That is how older fans feel and it can be hard to accept.
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I personally enjoyed how much selection the G3's had....
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Hasbro needs to figure out what today's children want and they need to produce that. If I want to buy it, I will. If not, I'll collect something else. I recognize and appreciate the fact that toys need to be designed for children of the times in which they are invented. That doesn't mean I don't wish there was more variety for me to collect in stores--it just means I know that whether I like them or not Hasbro isn't making them "for me".
I'm not too upset though, really. I do swaps here and get my g1 collection that way, my mom hunts for g3 for me at thrift shops and garage sales, I buy anything g4 that I do want, and I have a couple other blossoming collections that are eating up the finances I would put into MLP otherwise.