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It's only after reading these posts that I realise how odd it is that Spike has ears! I just never questioned it before haha Interestingly G2 Princess Silver Swirl's dragon friend also has ears (and wings!) so same species?I propose that Spike (and the aforementioned dragon) are a sort of 'domesticated' dragon breed - kind of like in domestic dogs/cats we humans tend to breed them to have features we find cute (https://www.dogwalkersmelbourne.com.au/articles-dog-walking-pet-sitting/71-dog-neoteny-puppy-love ), so Spikes' particular kind of dragon may have been bred to have ears (along with large eyes and maybe small stature?) for this reason, because it's cute and emotive to ponies/humans haha. You could also add in that (in animated canon at least) he originally lived with Scorpan, who was a prince, and royalty were the ones to first start breeding regular dogs into lapdog breeds (see Pekingese and Italian Greyhounds) so you could make that connection also? Idk, that's just my theory haha
Quote from: Crystal-Sushi on December 24, 2022, 02:06:12 AMIt's only after reading these posts that I realise how odd it is that Spike has ears! I just never questioned it before haha Interestingly G2 Princess Silver Swirl's dragon friend also has ears (and wings!) so same species?I propose that Spike (and the aforementioned dragon) are a sort of 'domesticated' dragon breed - kind of like in domestic dogs/cats we humans tend to breed them to have features we find cute (https://www.dogwalkersmelbourne.com.au/articles-dog-walking-pet-sitting/71-dog-neoteny-puppy-love ), so Spikes' particular kind of dragon may have been bred to have ears (along with large eyes and maybe small stature?) for this reason, because it's cute and emotive to ponies/humans haha. You could also add in that (in animated canon at least) he originally lived with Scorpan, who was a prince, and royalty were the ones to first start breeding regular dogs into lapdog breeds (see Pekingese and Italian Greyhounds) so you could make that connection also? Idk, that's just my theory haha Honestly I never ever thought about that. It's really a good theory and I like it. I mean somewhat it made sense about Spike's time with Scorpan. Though honestly I wish I have anything that would connect more to a domestic dragon type of thing. However I've also never brought up G2's dragon at one point but wish G2 show atleast have showed a dragon character that is like a baby dragon as well...Not sure if there's anything else to add to this topic but then again so far I'm still waiting how other theories would there be. Sorry if I'm at one point been getting to like get more attention but honestly I want to hear more about this and see what other people have in mind and maybe we could get an answer for it at one point.
Spike's toy came before the cartoon, yeah.
Yeah, the character designs were based on the toys in G1. But if you watch the D&D cartoon episode "Valley of the Unicorns" you can see some influence for the setting.- beautiful pastoral valley which is the home of magical equines- rainbow waterfall, just like in Rescue at Midnight Castle- D&D unicorns can teleport, which I presume is why Twilight (and, later, all G1 unicorns) had this power. Even the sound effect is the same.Maybe MLP 'n Friends was set in D&D all along, it would explain all the monsters.
Hopefully 4 months isn't too long to ressurect a thread, because I started looking into this last night and now I have OPINIONS about this topic Warning: Overthinking and pictures ahead, strap yourselves inDisclaimer: I stand by none of my theories, I think Spike is whatever kind of dragon is the most fun!That said, someone had to design the little guy. What might they have had in mind with his design? Why does he have ears? Why no wings? Why was he living with Tirac before the ponies came along? Maybe he's just a generic 80's fantasy dragon hodgepodge? They were selling toys, so they might not have been that invested in Spike's specifics (but I sure am going to be, lol)I started by looking at Rescue at Midnight Castle from 1984, since far as I can tell, that's Spike's first appearance (unless he was a toy before then, in which case )I spied 4 names of interest in the credits:visitors can't see pics , please register or loginvisitors can't see pics , please register or loginAnimation SupervisorJohn AhernModel Design TakashiGeorge GoodeJerry EisenbergMy guess is that these guys would have had a say in the design of the characters. I'm sure there were people from Hasbro with fingers in the mix as well, but I have no idea who how or when, so I'll stick with these fellas.Takashi right off the bat is kind of a bust because they didn't credit his surname, so lets set him aside for the moment. IMDB time!Ahern is pretty interesting on his own as an animator; he was an inbetweener and assistant animator on tons of Disney films, all the way back to Lady and the Tramp and Sleeping Beauty! He was also an animator on a 1978 film called Metamorphoses, which we'll come back to. For our purposes, I think the most relevant credit is in 1983 - animation supervisor for a Dungeons & Dragons animated TV show. For reference:visitors can't see pics , please register or loginMoving on to George Goode, I see a familiar credit - 1983, Dungeons & Dragons. Jerry Eisenberg... No D&D. Hm. But he DID work on Metamorphoses.What the heck kind of movie is that, anyways? I pull up Metamorphoses and what's this? visitors can't see pics , please register or loginWho is this director? Takashi Masunaga? Is that OUR Takashi?Yes, yes it is. Model designer for My Little Pony Tales AND 1983 Dungeons & Dragons. To recap, we have 4 guys responsible for animation and model design who have worked together before, and 3 who worked together on a Dungeon's and Dragons animated show. I think at this point we can safely say that there's a good, solid chance that they are aware of D&D specific dragons and draconic creatures, AND that that knowledge may have worked it's way into Spike's designs.Drake would a very valid choice for Spike's creature type. It's a dragon type creature with four legs and no wings that fits his description very well. But Spike is always saying he's a baby DRAGON, so for his sake, I'm going to keep looking for a dragon.Of course, that wouldn't be a dragon from the current list of a bajillion dragons that D&D has these days, it would be whatever they had available in 1983-1984.To the Internet Archive!Specifically, to the Monster Manual II, published in 83. visitors can't see pics , please register or loginLook at this guy! visitors can't see pics , please register or loginLook at those ears! and those spikes! and that boxy nose! I'm sold, I think Spike is a shadow dragon, personally. But let's KEEP GOING! To some still unanswered questions.Why doesn't Spike have wings?Your mileage may vary depending on your willingness to go with G4 explanations for a G1 character, but I'm inclined to think it's because he's a baby. He'll molt one day and get wings like he did in G4. visitors can't see pics , please register or loginBut he could also be a drake, or a dragon-drake hybrid, or any other explanation that is cool.More critically, I'd say Spike doesn't have wings because that would have made him a terrible hostage in Rescue at Midnight Castle. Why does he have cute little ears?I haven't watched all of the D&D cartoon, but I think we can pick up some design cues just from the dragon on the cover, specifically THIS guy - visitors can't see pics , please register or loginwho has what looks very much like ears to me. Maybe they are horns. Maybe they are frills. But ear-like protrusions seem to be perfectly acceptable for this big honking hydra dragon monstrosity, as well as for the shadow dragon artwork in the official D&D monster manual, so I'm just going to conclude that dragons can have ears.But why are his ears so cute and cat-like?More to they point, I think they are cute and pony-like, in the pony show for little kids who like ponies, so my personal opinion is just that they were made cute and triangular to better match the style of the show. That's pretty meta and not much of an in-universe explanation though, so go wild!In conclusion, if anyone wants references for Spike as an adult dragon/drake, I think it's a great idea to look at Dungeons & Dragons in general for inspiration, and the 1983 animated show specifically.
Spike's toy came before the cartoon, yeah. I'm not sure if any of the characters that exist in both the toyline AND the cartoon, were designed for the cartoon first. Maybe the Bushwoolies?(oh, and the Furbobs - their toys were cancelled - but didn't the timing there suggest they were created for the cartoon and then adopted by Hasbro, or am I misremembering?)But yeah, it'd be a Hasbro designer that came up with Spike, though of course the cartoon peeps had to adapt his design. It wouldn't surprise me if their take on the character had some influence from the D&D cartoon, I think other people on here (who've actually watched the D&D toon, lol) said Twilight's teleportation ability is likely inspired by Uni?
Do either of you happen to know when exactly the first Spike toy was introduced? I wanted to look that up when I started getting interested in this discussion, but I couldn’t think of where to start looking for that info
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