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Pony Talk => Pony Corral => Topic started by: Safflower on March 17, 2018, 12:52:24 PM

Title: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Safflower on March 17, 2018, 12:52:24 PM

Hello! I have recently acquired a huge lot of G1s, and quite a few have rust stains. So my first question: how does sunfading work with colored ponies? Does it brighten them or fade their color, is it as effective as white ponies, etc. Second question: How to cover thin tiny symbols? The worst pony is Sky Rocket, who has thin fireworks. Which brings me to my third question: Does sunfading damage twinkle eye eyes?

Anyway, thank you! I know how to sunfade generally, so I don't need any help with that :) Any responses are greatly appreciated! :happy:

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Breyer600 on March 17, 2018, 05:22:25 PM

Sunfading works just as well with colored ponies as it does with white ones.  It will eventually fade the color particularly if they are pink or purple, but I've found G1s to be handle being sunfaded for longer periods than G3s or G4s of similar colors.  If they are yellowed, sunfading can make them appear brighter.

Some examples:

Spoiler

Paintingtime sunfaded for a few weeks to a month:
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The Love Melody from the before pic is next to my near mint one in the after pic to show how her color did fade, but you can also see how discolored she was to start with.  I'm not sure how long she was faded, but it was at least several months.  (Her hearts are why I don't recommend relying on paint to cover symbols - I painted over them with white paint but only the very centers remained unfaded when I removed it.)
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Peppermint Crunch took quite awhile too.  The one that was faded is on the right in the comparison photo showing that her yellowing was improved while not fading her excessively.
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Twinkle eyes will fade.
Fizzy's side that wasn't sunfaded:
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Fizzy's side that was sunfaded without covering her eye first:
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Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Safflower on March 17, 2018, 06:24:11 PM

Thank you so much! I can't wait to try and sunfade a few! Sky Rocket and the others will look a lot better :) I know people have sun faded colored ponies, but for some reason I thought it was different than white ponies lol :lookround: And wow, that twinkle eye fading...

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Sawkinator on March 17, 2018, 07:19:11 PM

Quote from: Breyer600 on March 17, 2018, 05:22:25 PM

Sunfading works just as well with colored ponies as it does with white ones.  It will eventually fade the color particularly if they are pink or purple, but I've found G1s to be handle being sunfaded for longer periods than G3s or G4s of similar colors.  If they are yellowed, sunfading can make them appear brighter.

Some examples:

Spoiler

Paintingtime sunfaded for a few weeks to a month:
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The Love Melody from the before pic is next to my near mint one in the after pic to show how her color did fade, but you can also see how discolored she was to start with.  I'm not sure how long she was faded, but it was at least several months.  (Her hearts are why I don't recommend relying on paint to cover symbols - I painted over them with white paint but only the very centers remained unfaded when I removed it.)
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Peppermint Crunch took quite awhile too.  The one that was faded is on the right in the comparison photo showing that her yellowing was improved while not fading her excessively.
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Ooh, Love Melody actually looks pretty nice with that blueish color. (...but now I'm a little worried about the G1s I just started fading with the white paint method)

There's a handful of specific ponies that are more prone to sunburning/discoloration (there's a few older threads that list them), but it doesn't seem like color really matters unless you're in a place with intense sunlight.

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: flutterscotch on March 17, 2018, 07:56:22 PM

I've had a baby Blossom's bottom half out on my back porch in the sun for a week and a half now, and it hasn't done a thing to her (sadly for me, because I am trying to fade her body to match her head), if that is helpful.

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: BlackCurtains on March 17, 2018, 08:31:29 PM

I used very thin strips of Painters Tape to cover symbols.

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Breyer600 on March 17, 2018, 11:15:32 PM

Quote from: Sawkinator on March 17, 2018, 07:19:11 PM

Ooh, Love Melody actually looks pretty nice with that blueish color. (...but now I'm a little worried about the G1s I just started fading with the white paint method)

I think the main thing is to make sure you get a really thick coat on them.  I used paint on her eyes too and they didn't fade, but I was able to get the paint on in a much thicker layer than on those tiny little hearts.  (It doesn't show in that shot but the centers of some of the hearts where the paint was the thickest still have some pink too.)  It didn't help that that particular shade of pink fades so easily.

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Taffeta on March 17, 2018, 11:43:52 PM

This may sound crazy, but I kind of like Fizzy's eye like that. Especially that she has 2 different eyes now. Makes her unique :)

I have never tried to sun fade because I worry about the impact on the plastic longterm and whether it would increase breakdown. Is there any knowledge about that?

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Snapdragon on March 18, 2018, 03:09:09 AM

Okay, one thing I read here last week about painting - you can wrap the pony in cling-wrap, THEN paint over the symbols. Makes clean-up super easy, and probably makes it easier to glob on the paint and protect the symbols!! :O

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: tailrustedtealeaf on March 18, 2018, 09:44:25 AM

Quote from: Taffeta on March 17, 2018, 11:43:52 PM

I have never tried to sun fade because I worry about the impact on the plastic longterm and whether it would increase breakdown. Is there any knowledge about that?

You mean "age spots"? I thought someone had proved that it was a sort of fungus.

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Safflower on March 18, 2018, 09:53:59 AM

Quote from: tailrustedtealeaf on March 18, 2018, 09:44:25 AM

Quote from: Taffeta on March 17, 2018, 11:43:52 PM

I have never tried to sun fade because I worry about the impact on the plastic longterm and whether it would increase breakdown. Is there any knowledge about that?

You mean "age spots"? I thought someone had proved that it was a sort of fungus.

Age spots are not the only type of breakdown (plasticizer leakage, regrind, etc.) And age spots are not always caused by fungus. They can be caused by mold, but mold age spots aren't really age spots because they weren't caused from aging. Most age spots are not caused by fungus.

Seriously though, where is everyone getting this info that age spots come from fungus? Every time someone mentions age spots, people say that someone has proven they are always caused by fungus but that isn't the case. I'm really confused as it was common knowledge that they aren't? Is it because of the preservation project? I vaguely remember that site for age spots quoting a book and saying that fungus always causes these things and breakdown has nothing to do with it? Is that why? :what:

Yeah though, I know a few people who are concerned about sunfading doing damage to the plastic. Intense heat and light for an extended period of time may not be the best thing for plastic. Honestly though, I've never really heard of sun faded ponies breaking down faster, so let's hope it isn't an issue!

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: tailrustedtealeaf on March 18, 2018, 10:10:02 AM

Quote from: Safflower on March 18, 2018, 09:53:59 AM

Seriously though, where is everyone getting this info that age spots come from fungus? Every time someone mentions age spots, people say that someone has proven they are always caused by fungus but that isn't the case. I'm really confused as it was common knowledge that they aren't? Is it because of the preservation project? I vaguely remember that site for age spots quoting a book and saying that fungus always causes these things and breakdown has nothing to do with it? Is that why? :what:

Yes, that's probably where I got it. That and that hydrogen peroxide has been shown to take out the brown spots (at least for a bit) supports the idea to me. Hydrogen peroxide cannot reverse damage to the plastic. I also cannot find anything else stating that plastic in toys breaks down into brown spots (or stating this at all), but I'm sure it exists...somewhere.
We're still iffy about the exact cause, I suppose.

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: TheBeatlesPkmnFan42 on March 18, 2018, 10:12:57 AM

I was under the impression that there were two types of similar-looking spots, ones that are caused by mold, and ones that are simply the plastic breaking down.

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Safflower on March 18, 2018, 10:22:34 AM

Quote from: TheBeatlesPkmnFan42 on March 18, 2018, 10:12:57 AM

I was under the impression that there were two types of similar-looking spots, ones that are caused by mold, and ones that are simply the plastic breaking down.

Yeah, this is correct.

Tailrustedtealeaf, peroxide only works on age spots caused by mold, and they only go away if the mold hasn't stained. Peroxide isn't a foolproof method, and since a lot of age spots aren't caused by mold, it won't work a lot of the time. Not to say it doesn't work through, I've used it a few times and it lessened the age spot, but there was still some staining :) And like you said, we are still a bit iffy. We don't know exactly how or what the mold does, or how the plastic does its thing and causes spots. At least we know that mold spots usually have a ring around them and a dark spot in the center, but not always.

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: tailrustedtealeaf on March 18, 2018, 10:26:59 AM

Quote from: Safflower on March 18, 2018, 10:22:34 AM

Tailrustedtealeaf, peroxide only works on age spots caused by mold, and they only go away if the mold hasn't stained. Peroxide isn't a foolproof method, and since a lot of age spots aren't caused by mold, it won't work a lot of the time. Not to say it doesn't work through, I've used it a few times and it lessened the age spot, but there was still some staining :) And like you said, we are still a bit iffy. We don't know exactly how or what the mold does, or how the plastic does its thing and causes spots. At least we know that mold spots usually have a ring around them and a dark spot in the center, but not always.

I can live with this, I just wish age-caused age-spots had a bit more documentation. It'd be nice to see what factors actually affect the occurance of the spots.

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Taffeta on March 18, 2018, 10:31:50 AM

That was one reason I asked, although I was also talking about plasticiser breakdown etc as well. It's just a concern of mine that we relied (well, restorers relied) for a long time on acne cream only to discover the destructive properties a LOT too late to fix them. I am not persuaded that anything chemical we put on ponies or any exposure to UV is necessarily harmless in the long run and right now, with G1 being 30+ years old, we should be more looking at protecting the integrity of the plastic. We need one or two of our sciencey people to do some full scale experiments I guess...?

@Safflower, the reason there's confusion is also probably because ponypeople insist on using jargon to describe flaws. Often people just use the jargon term without any further detail. I've been here 20 years and I still don't understand half of the terms people use in the correct context. If I can't, albeit I don't restore, expecting newer collectors to come in and automatically know them is a tall order. Then information gets confused between different people reporting different things and it ends up like this.

I wish people would stop using jargon :/

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Safflower on March 18, 2018, 12:56:23 PM

I wish age caused age spots had documentation too. There is still debate whether they are contagious, how they develop, why certain ponies are more prone, etc. It would be nice to have facts!

And yeah, jargon isn't the best. I adapted quickly because in my very early collecting days I would spend every waking moment reading about ponies and the jargon and how to restore and all the flaws. A lot of new collectors aren't like me. Cancer is insensitive and doesn't accurately describe what it means. Age spots is a better term but is also used to refer to something similar but is actually caused by mold. Detail should really be provided, and sites like the preservation project and other restoration sites need to elaborate and give evidence. Although, I enjoy names like Smooze XD Plus there is no variance in pindot, it's just dirt in pony pores. It got there because children are children. Nothing like "this is caused by breakdown or mold but we don't know exactly how or when or why things happen." Plus it's from something pony. We really do need to perform some science experiments! :nerdy: :work:

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Henpatch on March 18, 2018, 03:10:21 PM

I have had a lot of success with simple sun-fadng.  Sometimes not even covering their hair or symbols. The trick is not to leave them on one side all the time..........I ended up with nearly white on one side pink pony cause she was in the STRONG sunlight too long.

As for age spots! People get age spots - some can be removed - some can't! Breakdown of the plastic is also almost impossible to fix.....especially pink ponies - they can look as though they have chickenpox or something.  Clever people can re-paint the pony but eventually the breakdown breaks though again.

Mould can be dealt with and various things will help - like a good clean inside and out and usinng some ordinary mould remover. Just depends on the pony colour too - white is easy but some of the coloured ones, the mold will go but also the pony colour will go lighter

Trial and error!

Title: Re: Questions about sunfading, but not the usual ones!
Post by: Taffeta on March 18, 2018, 04:20:04 PM

@Safflower - that's more than I did. When people began using them I tried to keep up with them but they were so vaguely used and often referred to different things between people that I gave up and now I just describe what I see and let the buyer figure out if it's something they can't deal with.