Doll nudity - a problem to you?

[AnnaPommes]

well i agree, that it is not "bad".  i had to smile while reading this, i really reminds me of the controvery about this:

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does anyone know this picture?
its from Manet and from 1863. at that time, fine art was nice with naked people, and with clothed people. but if you mix them, the nakedness is suddenly obscene.
here is more information: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_d%C3%A9jeuner_sur_l%27herbe

there was also someone who painted two pictures of a woman, laying on a sofa or something. then, when the exibition started, he put the pictures on top of each other, and after everyone has seen the dressed woman, he put the picture down and everyone was shocked of the picture of the same, but naked women.

i mean, if he would have just put the naked woman in the exibition, nobody would have cared!

i personally think, nudity is not "bad" but private. a body is part of a personality and i don´t reveal anything to anyone on the street, but it can be beautiful and placed great in art, when treated with respect.

with censoring dolls which have "nothing", you put kind of secrets on them they don´t have, in my opinion.
if the doll is anatomically correct, i am sometimes thankfull for censoring, because i don´t like someone telling me everything about his person in detail right away at the first glance too. too much privary on the first glance. do you know what i mean?

well, otherwise, i take nude drawing lessons at the university, and i was totally scared to get a male model. but afterall, they are just shapes of the body.  censoring dolls is a bit like calling voldemord "you-know-who", maybe?

[PrincessKnight]

well, otherwise, i take nude drawing lessons at the university, and i was totally scared to get a male model. but afterall, they are just shapes of the body.  censoring dolls is a bit like calling voldemord "you-know-who", maybe?

Life drawing is quite a funny thing. When I told some former workmates (older women) that I attended a life drawing class they were SHOCKED, and I was surprised that they were so shocked.

I'm not nervous at all about drawing nude people, but I've gotta admit - I don't draw the guys 'bits' - it feels too awkward studying 'em 

[AnnaPommes]

I was surprised that they were so shocked.

I'm not nervous at all about drawing nude people, but I've gotta admit - I don't draw the guys 'bits' - it feels too awkward studying 'em 

same here! i add smileys there sometimes. my best friend in (what is equivalent to your) highschool was from Kosovo and was SUPER shoked, when i told her. i explained it, and she just asked me not to look to close.

by the way, is that in your avatar you work? its beautiful!

back to the dolls, nobody cares about naked barbies on a fleamarket, right?

[PrincessKnight]

I was surprised that they were so shocked.

I'm not nervous at all about drawing nude people, but I've gotta admit - I don't draw the guys 'bits' - it feels too awkward studying 'em 

same here! i add smileys there sometimes. my best friend in (what is equivalent to your) highschool was from Kosovo and was SUPER shoked, when i told her. i explained it, and she just asked me not to look to close.

by the way, is that in your avatar you work? its beautiful!

back to the dolls, nobody cares about naked barbies on a fleamarket, right?

Hahah, I like the smileys idea. Much better than just leaving a strange blank area. I usually avoid hands too, I'm so lazy. I draw vaguely hand-shaped blobs.

And yep, the doll in the avatar is my custom



I never had dolls as a kid, but I had a collection of Trolls. This was when they released them wearing differently themed clothes - but I made them all naked. Troll dolls look decidedly weirder with clothes on. Hahah.

[Jocelyn]

I don't think anything of doll nudity either. I was showing some pictures I took of my Spectra once because I thought I did a really good job composing the picture and such, but she couldn't get over the fact that she was naked. I barely even noticed that fact (I just didn't have any clothes that would fit the mood that I wanted for the photo) but she kept on going on about how it was weird and strange for me to take a picture of a naked doll. Since then, I do try to take pictures of them fully clothed. Although I don't mind at all, I don't want people to read any extra connotations into them.

I've been taking life drawing classes too, and I always find it funny when people always overdraw the genital area, or underdraw it and leave it a vague haze while everything else is in good detail. It's just another part of the body. I think treating all those "inappropriate" bits differently draws much more attention to them.

[Fräulein_Kim]

I've been taking life drawing classes too, and I always find it funny when people always overdraw the genital area, or underdraw it and leave it a vague haze while everything else is in good detail. It's just another part of the body. I think treating all those "inappropriate" bits differently draws much more attention to them.

Word! xD
When students would do that at my university, profs and teachers would taunt them for being 'prude' even. No nice smilies down there for us!
I also felt awkward when I first went there.. but soon realized it's not that awkward at all. It's just what it is. Drawing a model. (that said, I usually still tried my best not to sit in the front row. LOLOLOLOL)

About the dolls, I don't like when my own dolls lay around naked. Mostly because it feels unorganized & unfinished to me. Not b/c I am ashamed that they're 'naked'. Those dolls that are custom fodder lay around naked for weeks until I get around to finish them.
With sales posts I'd even encourage people to post exactly what they're selling and in a neutral, doll-pose, please.
(I think Plastic Curves said something very interesting and true, when she pointed out that nude dolls won't look sexual, until you make them so by posing like they'd be ashamed of having their picture taken and halfheartedly trying to cover their private areas.)
If it's neutral like that, it will be just a toy and totally OK to look at in my book. After all, I've seen statuettes, paintings, drawings etc. of nude people since I was old enough to be dragged into a museum alongside my parents. (So since I was 2.. maybe 3 years old)
And it never weirded or grossed me out, since it was art. And just that.

And I know for sure that there is a difference since I, personally, have HUGE problems with nudists, saunas, japanese bathhouses or anything that involves being around other REAL people when they're naked. Getting naked myself in front of anyone else than my BF? NO CHANCE! LOL.
So you see, I'm actually quite the prude myself!

Yet in works of art, life drawing or artificial pieces resembling humans, I'm totally fine with it. xD;

[CrazyCatPony]

i dont have a problem with nudey dolls, but my 6 year old is under strict orders not to strip her dolls: legit reason: SHE doesnt put the cloths back on and makes me and her daddy do it(takes them off, we put them back on, 5 min later repeat with same outfit), thus daddy got annoyed, cloths went missing. cloths dont come off any more.... problem solved.

[SweetScoops]

Well, I would'nt have my first pic be a nude one. But I do see dolls as collectibles and as a collector I would like to see a pic of the nude doll if possible (To spot miscoloring or something like that)
I don't have a problem with nude dolls, but I understand that there are kids and parents who have. And I would show them respect by (for example) tell my buyers to contact me for nude pics if wanted

[Gingerbread]

I want to see pics of CAMS in blankets...

hee! When I get the new CaMs I'll take a blanket-pic for you 

[PrincessKnight]

I've been taking life drawing classes too, and I always find it funny when people always overdraw the genital area, or underdraw it and leave it a vague haze while everything else is in good detail. It's just another part of the body. I think treating all those "inappropriate" bits differently draws much more attention to them.

Word! xD
When students would do that at my university, profs and teachers would taunt them for being 'prude' even. No nice smilies down there for us!
I also felt awkward when I first went there.. but soon realized it's not that awkward at all. It's just what it is. Drawing a model. (that said, I usually still tried my best not to sit in the front row. LOLOLOLOL)

I never went to any real classes so I was never taunted - but if there had been back rows to sit it it would have been fine. Both life drawing places I have been to only have one row and I swear the model watches the people drawing the entire time. I'm sure it's just because they're bored and are trying to stay still but gosh it is off-putting. I hate people watching me draw

[Sapphire-Light]

For me it depends in the pose the doll is showed in the pic, if the doll is in a naughty pose then its hard to look at it 

[zannid]

OK I wasn't gonna say anything but I feel the need to now. I am not offended by doll nudity in dolls like MH, Barbie and Pullips. That being said I think that certain BJD need censors on them due to the fact that some of the boy dolls are atomical correct.

Its nothing about being purish its just the fact that my neice likes looking around the arena when she is here and I don't want her to see things like that. Even on a doll. And there are younger kids on here. I believe the sign up age is 13. Maybe there parents don't want them to see things like that either. Kids already grow up to fast as it is.

I think everyone has a right to their personal comfort level with things like nudity as long as you aren't trying to force someone else to have those same views. That said, I had a deep love for all thing Grecian, including art, when I was around 10, and so saw my fair share of artistic nudity. Have to say, it really didn't have a negative effect on me at all. If anything, I couldn't understand why the other kids felt the need to taunt something so innocuous.

I mean, clearly adult or sexual nudity is pretty much a no-go, and I do feel that people posing dolls in a sexual manner need to keep that stuff out of the main fandom because of younger children. However, there's a major difference to me in regular nudity vs sexualized nudity. It is a major cultural thing that in the US we've come to view almost all nudity as automatically sexual and thus taboo when in most other countries it's viewed as perfectly okay.

I feel like children are far more scarred or receive warped views from accidentally stumbling onto porn or gore sites than from a nude doll, sculpture, piece of art, or even seeing a person nude on screen. All in all, I think American society has a somewhat warped view on what humans are, bare skin and all. We are what we are, I fail to see anything inherently sexual in that.

[Zapper]

I also have absolutely no problem with it. In fact, I like my dolls nude, and I am one of those customizers that adds drawn-on nipples.

Nipples aren't sexual anyways. They're just sexualized when on women (which is weird, since they are for feeding babies and what is sexual about that, I might ask?)
I remember kid-me being really puzzled about the fact Aladdin (the Disney version) didn't have nipples. I even remember asking my parents about it

It is funny to me in MH dolls, because the female butt (and often the male one) can also be the subject of sexualization and yet the MH dolls very obviously have butt cheeks under their underwear molds.
A really weird double standard, if you ask me. Heck, even the male MH dolls lack nipples, and male nipples are nothing but decoration as we all know
(Allthough Gil not having them is cool by me. After all he is a fish )

That being said, I don't think people who feel weird looking at a nude MH doll are prudish. Everyone has their own comfort zone.
The only thing I don't like is when those people start complaining to other people about not censoring the dolls.
Like many of you have already pointed out, censoring something that isn't there in the first place sexualizes the doll even more, because it creates the illusion of "naughty bits".

I also have to say that I don't oppose baby dolls being anatomically correct. The mere existence of genitals doesn't sexualize a doll, it's the context wherein the anatomical correctness is presented. A baby having genitalia is not some outlandish concept. Babies need to relieve themselves, after all.
And, being completely honest, if you develop naughty thoughts while looking at a naked baby you should probably seek the help of a therapist

I think that by censoring nipples or fat depositories (butt cheeks, breasts) in characters or toys for children we're not stopping them from "growing up too fast", we're encouraging them in "growing up too fast".
When you tell a little kid to cover their doll's "shame" you are teaching them that certain areas of the doll's body are "shameful", be there nipples/bumps or not. That's not a good message, if you ask me.

When I was a little kid I saw both my parents (one biological male, one biological female) running around naked. At the beach, in the sauna, or while changing clothes. My parents never made a big deal out of it and that's how I learned not to be threatened or feel shame of my own body changing when I entered puberty many years later *shrug*
While many girls got teased for getting breasts, I welcomed mine and started to call out the children who started to call these girls names (yes, unfortunately getting breasts will result in immediatly getting shamed for having them. What a great culture we live in...)

[mistic_imp]

I'm a total liberal, and I have zero problem with nudity! We're all born naked! Personally, the think American culture as a whole is still extremely repressed when it comes to nudity, even when it comes to dolls. I commend other countries that are much more open with it!

DITTO!!
 i find it pretty funny that people sensor there doll photos.. idk just seems odd to me..  as a child, it never bothered me to leave my dolls nude either so.. i guess i am just liberal too!

[Heliodor]

I also have absolutely no problem with it. In fact, I like my dolls nude, and I am one of those customizers that adds drawn-on nipples.

Nipples aren't sexual anyways. They're just sexualized when on women (which is weird, since they are for feeding babies and what is sexual about that, I might ask?)
I remember kid-me being really puzzled about the fact Aladdin (the Disney version) didn't have nipples. I even remember asking my parents about it

It is funny to me in MH dolls, because the female butt (and often the male one) can also be the subject of sexualization and yet the MH dolls very obviously have butt cheeks under their underwear molds.
A really weird double standard, if you ask me. Heck, even the male MH dolls lack nipples, and male nipples are nothing but decoration as we all know
(Allthough Gil not having them is cool by me. After all he is a fish )

That being said, I don't think people who feel weird looking at a nude MH doll are prudish. Everyone has their own comfort zone.
The only thing I don't like is when those people start complaining to other people about not censoring the dolls.
Like many of you have already pointed out, censoring something that isn't there in the first place sexualizes the doll even more, because it creates the illusion of "naughty bits".

I also have to say that I don't oppose baby dolls being anatomically correct. The mere existence of genitals doesn't sexualize a doll, it's the context wherein the anatomical correctness is presented. A baby having genitalia is not some outlandish concept. Babies need to relieve themselves, after all.
And, being completely honest, if you develop naughty thoughts while looking at a naked baby you should probably seek the help of a therapist

I think that by censoring nipples or fat depositories (butt cheeks, breasts) in characters or toys for children we're not stopping them from "growing up too fast", we're encouraging them in "growing up too fast".
When you tell a little kid to cover their doll's "shame" you are teaching them that certain areas of the doll's body are "shameful", be there nipples/bumps or not. That's not a good message, if you ask me.

When I was a little kid I saw both my parents (one biological male, one biological female) running around naked. At the beach, in the sauna, or while changing clothes. My parents never made a big deal out of it and that's how I learned not to be threatened or feel shame of my own body changing when I entered puberty many years later *shrug*
While many girls got teased for getting breasts, I welcomed mine and started to call out the children who started to call these girls names (yes, unfortunately getting breasts will result in immediatly getting shamed for having them. What a great culture we live in...)

Running off to bed, but this post is basically flawless. IA wholeheartedly! Actually the whole nipple thing is something I really hate and detest. Because you know, men at a gym can work out with their shirts off, but a woman can't do that. Why? They'll see her fatty chest lumps that have...nipples!! just like...omgs! MEN! Since you know, as long as you blot out the nipple on the the female nude, she's more "acceptable."

Seriously does society even think of these stupid rules they make up? I'm pretty sure they don't.

Your post made me think of this recent article on the BBC: The shock of the (male) nude: An exhibition in Vienna probes our attitude towards nudity - people in the West have become accustomed to the naked female form, but male nudes can still shock. Before the show opened, the museum even covered up parts of its own posters, saying they had caused public outrage.

Interesting discussion about how the female nude has become socially accepted, probably imo because of the long-standing tradition of a woman's body = everybody else's property, etc. It raises interesting questions, no?

Post Merge: November 20, 2012, 10:38:45 PM

well i agree, that it is not "bad".  i had to smile while reading this, i really reminds me of the controvery about this:

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does anyone know this picture?

I saw this in-person in Paris! It's still striking even now!! I've always loved now nonchalant all the characters are, lmao.