The MLP Arena
Pony Talk => Pony Corral => Topic started by: Mana Minori on July 05, 2018, 10:53:51 PM
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Characters that appear in the g4 tv show don't get toys/ collectables. Moondancer, Double Diamond, Night Glider, Party Favor, Sugar Belle, Bright Mac, Pear Butter, Starswirl the Bearded, Somnambula, Stygian, Flash Magnus, Rockhoof, Mage Meadowbrook, Limestone Pie, Marble Pie, Zephyr Breeze, Mr and Mrs Shy, Windy Whistles, Inky Rose, Screwball, Bulk Biceps, Button Mash, Featherweight and more have NEVER had a single toy made of them, to date. And yet, really obscure background fodder ponies like Pretzel, Pursey Pink, Flower Wishes, Lemony Gem, and Buttonbelle continue to get toys made of them.
Surely, there could be a LOT more diversity with these added characters, than the officially licensed toys/ collectables that we're given- featuring the same gimmicky mane 6 and Princesses. It's so disappointing that the pattern has changed so drastically from the g1 super diverse cast releases; when collecting of many different characters was actually required.
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There's something to be said about hasbros ability to producec a new pony using old molds. Those easy cookie cutter characters are more likely to get a toy release than more unique looking characters like Bulk Biceps of Pipsqueak who would need a new mold casted to produce them.
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really obscure background fodder ponies like Pretzel, Pursey Pink, Flower Wishes, Lemony Gem, and Buttonbelle continue to get toys made of them.
Even those above mentioned only got one release, except Flower Wishes who I think has 2. Others like Trixie have had a couple of releases, I think...Starlight Glimmer now has a few as well. The reboot has also seen more releases for DJ Pon3 and Photo Finish...and Cheerilee has also had several releases. And we have had Soarin and Spitfire as well, who I believe are more mainstream background characters because of the Wonderbolts. So there is a B-cast line of production as well.
I don't watch the show and don't know (or really care) who most of the unproduced characters you mention are, but I totally agree with the lack of diversity in the production. I am happy to have all the fodder ones you mentioned because they are not mane 6.
Speaking as a kid who grew up with pretty much zero relationship to the G1 animation and who still considers it a thing that happened, rather than something that defines any part of G1 canon, I think it's a shame G4 is so dependent on the animation. It means the rerelease of the same characters over and over because Hasbro can use the show as an excuse to resell their stars in barely different forms rather than diversifying. It also dictates to the audience which ponies are important and which are not, as opposed to letting the kid decide for themselves. I have a lot of non-mane 6 G4 toys, and I genuinely don't know where most of them fit in, if they even do - but I'm collecting with a G1 mentality. I think the G4 mentality is to prioritise the show characters in the way the show does, so there's less concern about what gets released among G4 only fans.
But they stopped being original a long time ago. It was beginning at the end of G1 with the 7 characters (who also tied into the animation, so the blueprint for what G4 became was there in proto form even then). They went to town on it with G2 rereleases of the same characters, but as that line had no animation, it was a kind of balance between rereleased old ones in new forms and new ponies. Of course, the lack of presence in the US meant that that line was pretty much dictated by Europe.
G3 didn't begin that way, although there were some that got different pose rereleases. But then it got into the core 7 rubbish and since then it's been a downhill slide.
I think we've all discussed that ad nauseum to be honest. I don't think it's a new subject to raise that Hasbro lack diversity. If only us complaining about it on a forum like this actually made them change their approach - but it seems likely any reboot of MLP in the future will stay hopelessly tied to these six designs in some basic way or other.
Kissthethunder is right about the mould thing, I guess - although they splashed out on a ton of new moulds for the reboot so it seems crazy that they can't do better with the characters. Mind you, the new moulds are hideous...
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Yes. We say this like every time the subject gets brought up. We've been saying it since G3's Core 7, really.
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It could, but the reality is we get tons of Pinkie Pies etc because they are the main characters and main characters sell.
I know this isn't what a lot of us want to hear, but it's true. Just like in BTAS they pumped out a ton of Batman toys compared to anyone else. Or how in TMNT most of the line consists of the four turtles, released again and again with different 'action gimmicks'. Or how Papa Smurf, Grumpy Smurf, and Smurfette end up on more merchandise than Finance Smurf.
The reason G1 had so much diversity was that it was not a show-driven toyline. Whereas G4's popularity very much derives from the show, and is dependent on the show.
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I always feel like it's unfair to compare how they are releasing G1 toys vs G4 toys.
Hasbro's strategy is different this generation. And let's face it, it worked. We are all free to like it or not-- but it's been around for many years now because it worked.
*I* personally wouldn't of wanted to see MORE characters from the show. *yuck* However, I wish we DID see just a few more random non-show ponies.
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I just want a g4 Moondancer toy, dangit!
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I just want a g4 Moondancer toy, dangit!
Well, there's a blind bag (https://data.mlpmerch.com/blind-bags/pony/moon-dancer/) of her (and a Playskool pony (https://data.mlpmerch.com/playskool/pony/moon-dancer/), but she uses G1 Moondancer's design.. well, she's closer to G1 than G4, anyway).
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*I* personally wouldn't of wanted to see MORE characters from the show. *yuck* However, I wish we DID see just a few more random non-show ponies.
I basically echo this.
I also think maybe it's in context with how a lot of other successful toy lines currently operate, with the show, merchandising, etc. I am not for sure if kids like the nauseating rereleases given the amount of shelfsitting mane 6 in my areas, but they aren't really given a choice in the matter. What I do know is that when other characters do appear in lines here where I shop, they get snapped up quickly. I have seen kids go through whole racks looking for a particular not mane 6 character.
So a few more diverse characters in amongst the core mane 6 lines would probably work too.
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They definitely could, but they probably won't. I mean they could easily just take random background pony designs wh wouldn't even need new molds and put them into toy form, or they could turn more blind bag ponies into regular toys, but despite that we still keep getting more Mane 6 constantly. I just hope they don't do the same thing again with the next generaion and actually give us more variety. I understand that the main ponies are going to get more releases, but the extent that they take it to with the Mane 6 is ridiculous. They could just do, like, two releases a year and give us new ponies with the rest...
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Most definitely. But they won't cause Hasbro sucks. Their brains have been hijacked by these 6 ponies. Why? I dunno. If the next group is like this, Hasbro can shove it.
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Most definitely. But they won't cause Hasbro sucks. Their brains have been hijacked by these 6 ponies. Why? I dunno. If the next group is like this, Hasbro can shove it.
Yes, Hasbros brains have been hijacked... I don't know why but I know how. Rarity made some secret agent suits and gear. Applejack brought supplies. Fluttershy brought her animals as a distraction. Rainbow got them to the Hasbro headquarters. Twilight planned how they would infiltrate the building. Pinkie rounded everyone up and took control. It all makes sense, you see!
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Most definitely. But they won't cause Hasbro sucks. Their brains have been hijacked by these 6 ponies. Why? I dunno. If the next group is like this, Hasbro can shove it.
Yes, Hasbros brains have been hijacked... I don't know why but I know how. Rarity made some secret agent suits and gear. Applejack brought supplies. Fluttershy brought her animals as a distraction. Rainbow got them to the Hasbro headquarters. Twilight planned how they would infiltrate the building. Pinkie rounded everyone up and took control. It all makes sense, you see!
Friendship is magic. And brainwashing. (it's in the smallprint).
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Gosh, the title of this thread was very clickbaity. I thought you had news about new brushables and I got really excited. Please hasbro give us more ponies! :drunk:
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Most definitely. But they won't cause Hasbro sucks. Their brains have been hijacked by these 6 ponies. Why? I dunno. If the next group is like this, Hasbro can shove it.
Yes, Hasbros brains have been hijacked... I don't know why but I know how. Rarity made some secret agent suits and gear. Applejack brought supplies. Fluttershy brought her animals as a distraction. Rainbow got them to the Hasbro headquarters. Twilight planned how they would infiltrate the building. Pinkie rounded everyone up and took control. It all makes sense, you see!
Friendship is magic. And brainwashing. (it's in the smallprint).
It all makes sense. :shakefist:
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Even my four year old niece seems to be tired of the Mane 6. She literally sighs whenever she gets gifted another Rarity or Pinkie Pie, and normally she's excited to get a new pony. And I don't blame her. What little girl is going to get excited about the millionth Pinkie Pie Hasbro has come out with, especially when they all look the same? When I was little I had two G3 Pinkie Pies and I thought that two was enough!
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My daughter has grown tired of them as well. It annoyed her to no end to have to get yet another Rarity just to own Capper.
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My daughter has grown tired of them as well. It annoyed her to no end to have to get yet another Rarity just to own Capper.
I think almost every new movie character was bundled with a Mane 6 pony as well.
Ponyfan
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The reason G1 had so much diversity was that it was not a show-driven toyline. Whereas G4's popularity very much derives from the show, and is dependent on the show.
There you have it. G1 was about the toys, first and foremost. So the main selling point was diversity - constantly reinventing itself - to keep you coming back for more.
The same goes for G3.
The brand may have immensely grown in popularity with G4 because of the show, but it had a devastating effect on the toy line - creative wise.
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They definitely could, but they probably won't. I mean they could easily just take random background pony designs wh wouldn't even need new molds and put them into toy form, or they could turn more blind bag ponies into regular toys, but despite that we still keep getting more Mane 6 constantly. I just hope they don't do the same thing again with the next generaion and actually give us more variety. I understand that the main ponies are going to get more releases, but the extent that they take it to with the Mane 6 is ridiculous. They could just do, like, two releases a year and give us new ponies with the rest...
They been doing that finally tho. Ever since the pearlized ponies they have been including non-Mane 6 ponies along with some of the Mane 6.
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They definitely could, but they probably won't. I mean they could easily just take random background pony designs wh wouldn't even need new molds and put them into toy form, or they could turn more blind bag ponies into regular toys, but despite that we still keep getting more Mane 6 constantly. I just hope they don't do the same thing again with the next generaion and actually give us more variety. I understand that the main ponies are going to get more releases, but the extent that they take it to with the Mane 6 is ridiculous. They could just do, like, two releases a year and give us new ponies with the rest...
They been doing that finally tho. Ever since the pearlized ponies they have been including non-Mane 6 ponies along with some of the Mane 6.
Yeah, but they still push them too much.
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They definitely could, but they probably won't. I mean they could easily just take random background pony designs wh wouldn't even need new molds and put them into toy form, or they could turn more blind bag ponies into regular toys, but despite that we still keep getting more Mane 6 constantly. I just hope they don't do the same thing again with the next generaion and actually give us more variety. I understand that the main ponies are going to get more releases, but the extent that they take it to with the Mane 6 is ridiculous. They could just do, like, two releases a year and give us new ponies with the rest...
They been doing that finally tho. Ever since the pearlized ponies they have been including non-Mane 6 ponies along with some of the Mane 6.
Nowhere near as much as they should be. Still way too many Mane 6 releases each year. We still cannot go a single wave of single ponies without some Mane 6 included, and two packs containing new characters still come with one of the Mane 6 as well. I mean like, they should primarily release new characters with each wave and every so often including a Mane 6 pony in there.
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The first movie 2 packs force you to buy a new character with a Man 6.
Secret Hasbro meeting
"Well we've got these new movie character and we should make toys of them but were overstocked on Twilight Sparkles, Rarity's and Pinkie Pies so we'll make everyone have to buy a Mane 6 pony to get a new character"
The first Skystar sea pony came in a two pack with Twilight Sparkle
Tempest came in a 3 pack with Twiight Sparkle and Spike
Capper was paired with Rarity (although this pairing does make sense with the movie)
Hippogriff Skystar was paired with Pinkie Pie (again this makes sense with the movie)
Twilgiht Sparkle and Songbird Serenade
The All Abouts have a few Mane 6 mixed in the waves as well but my stores are overstocked on Big Mac, Starlight, Fluttershy, Pinkie, Vinyl Sratch and Twilight.
Ponyfan
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The first movie 2 packs force you to buy a new character with a Man 6.
Secret Hasbro meeting
"Well we've got these new movie character and we should make toys of them but were overstocked on Twilight Sparkles, Rarity's and Pinkie Pies so we'll make everyone have to buy a Mane 6 pony to get a new character"
The first Skystar sea pony came in a two pack with Twilight Sparkle
Tempest came in a 3 pack with Twiight Sparkle and Spike
Capper was paired with Rarity (although this pairing does make sense with the movie)
Hippogriff Skystar was paired with Pinkie Pie (again this makes sense with the movie)
Twilgiht Sparkle and Songbird Serenade
The All Abouts have a few Mane 6 mixed in the waves as well but my stores are overstocked on Big Mac, Starlight, Fluttershy, Pinkie, Vinyl Sratch and Twilight.
Ponyfan
There you have it Wardah. It wouldn't kill Hasbro to have released them by themselves, or with other new characters. They don't pull this crap by forcing us to buy Megatron, Optimus, Bumblebee and Starscream with a different character everytime they release a new line of TFs and they should have never started doing it in MLP. Especially to the obnoxious extent that they do.
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It's as if they think these items won't sell on their own and require a mane 6 pony to sell the deal.
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It's as if they think these items won't sell on their own and require a mane 6 pony to sell the deal.
Which is a self-fulfilling prophecy because kids will get it just to have a new character they want. Nevermind that new characters by themselves fly off the shelves. Who is in charge of this stuff? They need to go work somewhere else. Like the xerox machine.
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Who is in charge of this stuff? They need to go work somewhere else. Like the xerox machine.
:P Lol.
Do they think that kids buying the toys now just flat out don't have any of the mane 6? I could understand releasing some with waves to be consistent and allow kids who are just now old enough to say "yes" and "no" to certain toys to get their favorite characters from the show, but honestly releasing Rarity and Pinkie Pie with the new movie characters is the only thing keeping me from picking up Capper or Skystar. At least Songbird had a single release!
I'm upset with the large pack of fashion styles they're releasing this year. So what if Luna is blue? Again, Pillars? Daybreak? Anybody else except for the mane 6? They just released the "magic of everypony" set for 2017 Christmas, so I really have no need for the new set.
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Yeah they COULD.
However, TV toyline manufacturing in all genres has streamlined itself greatly to the "team of heroes" principle. Look up examples of sentai animation.
We've had this in MLP since G3 started their Mane 6 about 1/3 into the releases. OMG it was going so well with all the diversity until suddenly... there were only six ponies. *shudder*
It unfortunately costs them less to have less diversity, and they don't feel like they get the return they want (because revenue =/= upfront ZERO supply cost), so they choose NOT to. Clearly Hasbro has moved from an economy of "we own many many many of those plastic hair-making machines and a crazy amount of injector molds, so! we will make vinyl and brushable EVERYTHING and stuff it in stores" into more of a "we have very specific set of margins for what we can spend on contracting third-party companies who own the expensive manufacturing machines. plus we have to pay for the CEO's vacation."
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Skystar as a sea pony does have a version with a musical shell but that came out after the one that was paired with Twilight Sparkle. It’s almost like Hasbro wants to force people to buy extra Mane 6 ponies with new characters before releasing the new character separately. For a while the only way to get a Tempest was the the TRU set with Twilight Sparkle Tempest and Spike or the Khol’s set that included several ponies in it.
I don’t expect Capper or Hippogriff Skystar to get released separately although Hasbro could surprise me.
Just adding some of the movie lines featuring the Mane 6
Pearly sea ponies (all six released)
All Abouts (all six released)
Land and sea transforming tails (all six released)
Large sparking eyes(at least some of the Mane 6) sea ponies
Some sea pony Mane 6 were released with acessories. I know I saw Rarity, Pinkie Rainbow Dash and Twilight .
Spinning skirts (at least some of the Mane 6)
That’s a lot of Mane 6 ponies :dizzy:
Ponyfan
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For a while the only way to get a Tempest was the the TRU set with Twilight Sparkle Tempest and Spike or the Khol’s set that included several ponies in it.
And even now that she does have a single release, it's next to impossible to find because most places still have the first two waves!
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But then it got into the core 7 rubbish and since then it's been a downhill slide.
Oh I know the answer to that one, because I was there, in a Q&A session during the tour of Hasbro's headquarters at the 2008 MLP fair.
THAT was directly because the marketing people at Hasbro at the time were relying exclusively on market research. "Little girls play this way, they want the same characters over and over again". They actually were a handful of women in their 20s and 30s with absolutely no vested interest in ponies. They had no nostalgic ties whatsoever so did what their test market, which involved bringing children in to observe them play. They just did some testing and decided to completely overhaul.
What kind of children want to be involved in MLP marketing, and what kind of parents are likely to bring their children in for field marketing for a mid-2000s toy line that has been stereotypically girly, in New England? That's right, people who have children who do, or are being pushed into fairly traditional gender roles. Kids who are already fans of toy lines that that's baked into. Your SSC knockoffs, your Baby does whatevers.
Hasbro has always, ALWAYS done this crap with MLP. From its very inception where Bonnie Zacherle pitched the concept, to a handful of years into the first line, and it always ends up the same. With Hasbro thinking:
"Hmmmm little girls really want to be mothers to the same group of tiny pastel horses over and over again".
The My Little Pony Mommy commercials were what made me stop collecting ponies the first time around. 8 year old me went: "Where was my excitement and adventure and magic and why are we supposed to pretend this is a Cabbage Patch Kid".
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You know, going off the marketing thing, do the sales departments actually see which ponies of a set sell?
Sure, we say that we see all of the non-mane6 characters flying off the shelves, but the stores don't list each individual character within a given set as a separate product. They're all under one label.
All Hasbro sees is that so many Pearly Ponies sold, or so many Ribbon Haired sold. If they put out surveys or asked kids directly at events such as HasCon if they'd prefer Mane6 or other characters, I'm sure they'd see that there is a shocking lack of diversity.
Sure, kids love to play with some characters...but they also like others? Not every kid is going to prefer the same pony, and it's nice to have a variety of characters to pick from.
Kids also like to have blank or open-ended characters. If you ever take the time to watch the pony toy series kids put up on youtube, there's no end of Fluttershys with cut hair to be "Butterscotch", the romantic interest of the show. There are lots of Raritys with cutie marks painted over and hair marker-colored to be the snooty bully. It looks to me like kids are dying to get non-mane6 characters to help play out their scenarios!
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But then it got into the core 7 rubbish and since then it's been a downhill slide.
Oh I know the answer to that one, because I was there, in a Q&A session during the tour of Hasbro's headquarters at the 2008 MLP fair.
THAT was directly because the marketing people at Hasbro at the time were relying exclusively on market research. "Little girls play this way, they want the same characters over and over again". They actually were a handful of women in their 20s and 30s with absolutely no vested interest in ponies. They had no nostalgic ties whatsoever so did what their test market, which involved bringing children in to observe them play. They just did some testing and decided to completely overhaul.
What kind of children want to be involved in MLP marketing, and what kind of parents are likely to bring their children in for field marketing for a mid-2000s toy line that has been stereotypically girly, in New England? That's right, people who have children who do, or are being pushed into fairly traditional gender roles. Kids who are already fans of toy lines that that's baked into. Your SSC knockoffs, your Baby does whatevers.
Hasbro has always, ALWAYS done this crap with MLP. From its very inception where Bonnie Zacherle pitched the concept, to a handful of years into the first line, and it always ends up the same. With Hasbro thinking:
"Hmmmm little girls really want to be mothers to the same group of tiny pastel horses over and over again".
The My Little Pony Mommy commercials were what made me stop collecting ponies the first time around. 8 year old me went: "Where was my excitement and adventure and magic and why are we supposed to pretend this is a Cabbage Patch Kid".
Wow. Those women saying that don't have a clue. Sounds more like they were shoving words in kids mouths to excuse their sudden laziness.
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Wow. Those women saying that don't have a clue. Sounds more like they were shoving words in kids mouths to excuse their sudden laziness.
I did not see one convention goer present who was not pretty annoyed with that conversation.
The attitude was "tee-hee, we don't care as long as we get bonuses this year", and the consideration that since ponies weren't one of the top tier sellers at the time that they were doing their penance in ponies and were waiting to be bumped elsewhere. At the time they didn't have any plans whatsoever to market anything to adults either. Funny how the tables has turned. I sometimes wonder how those women survived the FIM early days. Maybe they moved on to Littlest Pet Shop.
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Wow. Those women saying that don't have a clue. Sounds more like they were shoving words in kids mouths to excuse their sudden laziness.
I did not see one convention goer present who was not pretty annoyed with that conversation.
The attitude was "tee-hee, we don't care as long as we get bonuses this year", and the consideration that since ponies weren't one of the top tier sellers at the time that they were doing their penance in ponies and were waiting to be bumped elsewhere. At the time they didn't have any plans whatsoever to market anything to adults either. Funny how the tables has turned. I sometimes wonder how those women survived the FIM early days. Maybe they moved on to Littlest Pet Shop.
Judging by how the Mane Six has overwhelmed what was once an amazing and diverse brand, it sounds like they got promoted. :pout:
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really obscure background fodder ponies like Pretzel, Pursey Pink, Flower Wishes, Lemony Gem, and Buttonbelle continue to get toys made of them.
Even those above mentioned only got one release, except Flower Wishes who I think has 2. Others like Trixie have had a couple of releases, I think...Starlight Glimmer now has a few as well. The reboot has also seen more releases for DJ Pon3 and Photo Finish...and Cheerilee has also had several releases. And we have had Soarin and Spitfire as well, who I believe are more mainstream background characters because of the Wonderbolts. So there is a B-cast line of production as well.
I don't watch the show and don't know (or really care) who most of the unproduced characters you mention are, but I totally agree with the lack of diversity in the production. I am happy to have all the fodder ones you mentioned because they are not mane 6.
Speaking as a kid who grew up with pretty much zero relationship to the G1 animation and who still considers it a thing that happened, rather than something that defines any part of G1 canon, I think it's a shame G4 is so dependent on the animation. It means the rerelease of the same characters over and over because Hasbro can use the show as an excuse to resell their stars in barely different forms rather than diversifying. It also dictates to the audience which ponies are important and which are not, as opposed to letting the kid decide for themselves. I have a lot of non-mane 6 G4 toys, and I genuinely don't know where most of them fit in, if they even do - but I'm collecting with a G1 mentality. I think the G4 mentality is to prioritise the show characters in the way the show does, so there's less concern about what gets released among G4 only fans.
But they stopped being original a long time ago. It was beginning at the end of G1 with the 7 characters (who also tied into the animation, so the blueprint for what G4 became was there in proto form even then). They went to town on it with G2 rereleases of the same characters, but as that line had no animation, it was a kind of balance between rereleased old ones in new forms and new ponies. Of course, the lack of presence in the US meant that that line was pretty much dictated by Europe.
G3 didn't begin that way, although there were some that got different pose rereleases. But then it got into the core 7 rubbish and since then it's been a downhill slide.
I think we've all discussed that ad nauseum to be honest. I don't think it's a new subject to raise that Hasbro lack diversity. If only us complaining about it on a forum like this actually made them change their approach - but it seems likely any reboot of MLP in the future will stay hopelessly tied to these six designs in some basic way or other.
Kissthethunder is right about the mould thing, I guess - although they splashed out on a ton of new moulds for the reboot so it seems crazy that they can't do better with the characters. Mind you, the new moulds are hideous...
This is my entire, exact opinion to a T!
I do hope that G5 moves on from the boring, overwhelming Mane 6 and adds diversity back into it. (along with some better designs than the really ugly, noodly new molds they're pumping out now with the 8D!!! faces...) Otherwise, as other have said, I think I will be done collecting modern MLP. I already am with G4, have been since the molds were changed and they stopped producing rando extra ponies. I picked up Skystar and that was it. Which is sad for me, kind of an "end of an era" thing, but I guess all good things have to come to an end eventually, I just hoped it wouldn't be so soon. At least I can still always collect the older gens, and I will.
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That sounds like highly likely market research, with a complete disconnect from actual kids.
I don't remember if I ever saw a MLP Mummy commercial as a kid. I don't remember ANY G1 commercials on TV, although I have a handful of them in one form or another and I expect most of the French ones on Youtube are similar to what we had only dubbed in a different language. I have this feeling that I have seen a UK ad with that annoying jingle since, but if they happened, I paid no attention whatsoever to their attempts to gender stereotype me. My ponies got kidnapped by zombie overlords and frequently were used to deter boys from throwing our toys on the roof (Fizzy is best pony lance).
I don't ever think of MLP as a girly toy. I read all the comics, I still don't think of it that way. But there's been a conscious attempt to girlify it since G1 in more than just the adverts IMO.
I mean, how many cake shops and parties and fashion boutiques and dress ups do ponies really need?
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I think the current line-up is a result of the popular "band of heroes" concept, not MLP Mommy. Nowadays kids are supposed to relate to the ponies and go "this is me!" instead of herding a bunch of children.
This had been already attempted in the 90s with MLP Tales. Imagine they would have made 30 Clovers :lol:
But the market is shifting again thanks to blind bags and Moose Toys who very aggressively brought back the "gotta collect them all" with Zelfs and now Shoppies, who are really popular despite being expensive.
So even tho MLP is Hasbro's red-headed stepchild sometimes, they need to pay attention to trends. And when kids have the option to get different collectibles or the same character over and over with little to no change, they will sooner or later gravitade towards diversity.
Because relating to a pony has a much shorter shelf life than relating to a humanoid character. I mean, unless you are a tragic adult like me who still relates to Minty after all those years :lol:
Now of course Hasbro never stops surprising me with their cheapness and laziness. So I'm not vouching for them to change anything. But just saying... the Descendants are on their last movie. Forces of Destiny flopped. They need to have something to keep their girl line strong and currently that's partially MLP (the other part is baby dolls). So they better groom those ponies a bit.
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And we still don’t have brushables of Apple Bloom, Sweetie Belle and Scootaloo with their cutie marks.
Ponyfan
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That sounds like highly likely market research, with a complete disconnect from actual kids.
I don't remember if I ever saw a MLP Mummy commercial as a kid.
Yes, absolutely. 100% just pulling in a field testing group and calling it a day. Bringing in kids who play that way.
This is the exact commercial where I was like WTF. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xBpbTa2LCI But I still kinda wanted Milky Way (who I thought was TAF Twilight). I wanted adventure and magic. Not that.
A lot of it was tied to the fact that my family over and over again tried to force me into baby dolls and I just had absolutely no interest. The endless coercion, the endless being told that was what I was supposed to like. I was not the type of little girl they wanted me to be.
I think the current line-up is a result of the popular "band of heroes" concept, not MLP Mommy.
I was talking about the g3 Core 7 thing. That's when MLP fair did the Hasbro Headquarters tour the first time, where I experienced that product testing drivel from their marketing team. But it seems like they keep going back to the whole "we basically need to make this SSC" with some babies thrown in. Over and over.
I was thrilled when they released FiM and it was action based. Because that's how I played with my ponies. Those babies lived at Snake Mountain, which was parked right next to Dream Castle.
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And we still don’t have brushables of Apple Bloom, Sweetie Belle and Scootaloo with their cutie marks.
Ponyfan
we're getting them soon, with School of Friendship Uniforms included.
I want to see more Star Dreams Brushables. She's ridiculously adorable.
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From a marketing standpoint with the end of the series coming soon, they probably want to hedge their bets about adding more "new" characters, especially if the show was not going to have the time to explore them.
For instance, Pursey Pink was released in the Explore Equestria line back in 2015, but was first shown in 2014. She had multiple background roles, and then finally got a speaking role in 2018 which makes her a lot more relevant to the show itself than Princess Gold Lily or Princess Sterling who never appeared. They were even so unsure of those that they were released in a 2-pack with either Fluttershy or Pinkie, respectively, because they would not be recognized. Adults can see a glorious alicorn princess that is unique and off the beaten path. Many kids would snub the alicorns because they wouldn't know who they were relative to the show. At that point, Luna, Celestia AND Candace were up-front and center as THE princesses of Equestria.
They are doing the same thing they did with G3 that they decided that the current gen was toward the end of its life and then started splitting creative resources between the current run and the upcoming roll. It's not that much different from Disney coming to the end of production of a feature film while another part of the team has already started into the production of another.
The toys are also not being marked to us, so from an adolescent teen to adult's perspective it seems samey-same-same, especially with the amount of PINKIE PIE cuz she's pink and that means she SELLS BETTER TO LITTLE GIRLS.
*ahem*
From some young kids' perspective, that may not be the case, especially if they do not have the chance to collect the kit and caboodle. It's more likely that the parents have to pick-and-choose since it's the parents buying the toys and may not afford to be able to get a whole lot of them at once. That is a big factor in toy marketing toward the end of a franchise's dynasty. Holy run-on sentence, Batman. Edited for clarity.
...though if they kept adults in mind when it comes to toys they would make a lot more money...
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Not so Sweet Daes, kids enjoy diversity. But Hasbro no longer cares, because they've been pulling this crap early on and never stopped.
My daughter and my cousin were into MH dolls and asked for specific ones, Abby Bominable, Venus McFlytrap, Ghoulia Yelps. Not Draculara, Draculara and Clawdeen for example. Transformers and DC/Marvel has a butt ton of characters that kids go looking for.
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Not so Sweet Daes, kids enjoy diversity. But Hasbro bo longer cares, because they've been pulling this crap early on and never stopped.
My daughter and my cousin were into MH dolls and asked for specific ones, Abby Bominable, Venus McFlytrap, Ghoulia Yelps. Not Draculara, Draculara and Clawdeen for example. Transformers and DC/Marvel has a butt ton of characters that kids go looking for. So yes, it is too samey. MLP isn't Barbie. Nor should Hasbro treat it as such.
I say that because of my experience in the field.
***And the fact that the show is specifically made to sell the toys of the main characters, partially for the secondary characters, but not all for the background characters.
And, to be more fair, not every franchise has a death and rebirth as often as MLP.
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Not so Sweet Daes, kids enjoy diversity. But Hasbro bo longer cares, because they've been pulling this crap early on and never stopped.
My daughter and my cousin were into MH dolls and asked for specific ones, Abby Bominable, Venus McFlytrap, Ghoulia Yelps. Not Draculara, Draculara and Clawdeen for example. Transformers and DC/Marvel has a butt ton of characters that kids go looking for. So yes, it is too samey. MLP isn't Barbie. Nor should Hasbro treat it as such.
I say that because of my experience in the field.
And, to be more fair, not every franchise has a death and rebirth as often as MLP.
Well here's experience for you. You seem to believe that kids are only interested in characters that they recognize and that unrecognizable ones don't sell well. Yet it is KIDS, not adults, that have had 3 decades of diversity with MLP before all this bore core/mane sux nonsense.
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Not so Sweet Daes, kids enjoy diversity. But Hasbro bo longer cares, because they've been pulling this crap early on and never stopped.
My daughter and my cousin were into MH dolls and asked for specific ones, Abby Bominable, Venus McFlytrap, Ghoulia Yelps. Not Draculara, Draculara and Clawdeen for example. Transformers and DC/Marvel has a butt ton of characters that kids go looking for. So yes, it is too samey. MLP isn't Barbie. Nor should Hasbro treat it as such.
I say that because of my experience in the field.
And, to be more fair, not every franchise has a death and rebirth as often as MLP.
Well here's experience for you. You seem to believe that kids are only interested in characters that they recognize and that unrecognizable ones don't sell well. Yet it is KIDS, not adults, that have had 30 decades of diversity with MLP before all this bore core/mane sux nonsense.
All other gens before this had tons of random ponies and kids liked/disliked this, that and the other without issue.
I also edited this into my other post:
***And the fact that the show is specifically made to sell the toys of the main characters, partially for the secondary characters, but not all for the background characters.
Just because a few dislike it doesn't mean that they won't sell well. The remolds of the characters, I think, are dumbly doofy as all get-out and I dislike how they've taken a larger departure from how I see the characters in the show. Because of how they look I've only collected the baby seaponies, the mane 6 and some other characters from the show. That's where I stop with G4.5. However, just because I don't like them doesn't mean that there are not droves of others who do and are willing to shell out the money.
The marketing for MLP is not for the picky part of the fan population, I'm afraid.
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Not so Sweet Daes, kids enjoy diversity. But Hasbro bo longer cares, because they've been pulling this crap early on and never stopped.
My daughter and my cousin were into MH dolls and asked for specific ones, Abby Bominable, Venus McFlytrap, Ghoulia Yelps. Not Draculara, Draculara and Clawdeen for example. Transformers and DC/Marvel has a butt ton of characters that kids go looking for. So yes, it is too samey. MLP isn't Barbie. Nor should Hasbro treat it as such.
I say that because of my experience in the field.
And, to be more fair, not every franchise has a death and rebirth as often as MLP.
Well here's experience for you. You seem to believe that kids are only interested in characters that they recognize and that unrecognizable ones don't sell well. Yet it is KIDS, not adults, that have had 30 decades of diversity with MLP before all this bore core/mane sux nonsense.
All other gens before this had tons of random ponies and kids liked/disliked this, that and the other without issue.
I also edited this into my other post:
***And the fact that the show is specifically made to sell the toys of the main characters, partially for the secondary characters, but not all for the background characters.
Just because a few dislike it doesn't mean that they won't sell well. The remolds of the characters, I think, are dumbly doofy as all get-out and I dislike how they've taken a larger departure from how I see the characters in the show. Because of how they look I've only collected the baby seaponies, the mane 6 and some other characters from the show. That's where I stop with G4.5. However, just because I don't like them doesn't mean that there are not droves of others who do and are willing to shell out the money.
The marketing for MLP is not for the picky part of the fan population, I'm afraid.
Yet you still disregard 30 years of kids who grew up with it, the documented history of a diverse toyline, people's personal experiences with the kids in their family and parrot Hasbro's sorry excuse to be lazy.
Nm that there were plenty of non show characters that KIDS owned in whatever respective mlp period they were in. Hasbro sells them so they're going to sell, but that doesn't mean kids don't get tired of it too. Sorry, but in this case your wrong in saying that kids only like and want recognizable characters.
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Not so Sweet Daes, kids enjoy diversity. But Hasbro bo longer cares, because they've been pulling this crap early on and never stopped.
My daughter and my cousin were into MH dolls and asked for specific ones, Abby Bominable, Venus McFlytrap, Ghoulia Yelps. Not Draculara, Draculara and Clawdeen for example. Transformers and DC/Marvel has a butt ton of characters that kids go looking for. So yes, it is too samey. MLP isn't Barbie. Nor should Hasbro treat it as such.
I say that because of my experience in the field.
And, to be more fair, not every franchise has a death and rebirth as often as MLP.
Well here's experience for you. You seem to believe that kids are only interested in characters that they recognize and that unrecognizable ones don't sell well. Yet it is KIDS, not adults, that have had 30 decades of diversity with MLP before all this bore core/mane sux nonsense.
All other gens before this had tons of random ponies and kids liked/disliked this, that and the other without issue.
I also edited this into my other post:
***And the fact that the show is specifically made to sell the toys of the main characters, partially for the secondary characters, but not all for the background characters.
Just because a few dislike it doesn't mean that they won't sell well. The remolds of the characters, I think, are dumbly doofy as all get-out and I dislike how they've taken a larger departure from how I see the characters in the show. Because of how they look I've only collected the baby seaponies, the mane 6 and some other characters from the show. That's where I stop with G4.5. However, just because I don't like them doesn't mean that there are not droves of others who do and are willing to shell out the money.
The marketing for MLP is not for the picky part of the fan population, I'm afraid.
Yet you still disregard 30 years of kids who grew up with it, the documented history of a diverse toyline, people's personal experiences with the kids in their family and parrot Hasbro's sorry excuse to be lazy? Nm that there were plenty of non show characters that KIDS owned in whatever respective mlp period they were in. Hasbro sells them so they're going to sell, but that doesn't mean kids don't get tired of it too. Sorry, but in this case your wrong in saying that kids only like and want recognizable characters.
If Hasbro is raking in the money off of the marketing plan then they will keep doing it. That's the basics of marketing and why the cycle repeats itself with a thriving company.
If the formula works then there is little to no reason to mess with it as much as what some outsiders looking in think it should be.
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Not so Sweet Daes, kids enjoy diversity. But Hasbro bo longer cares, because they've been pulling this crap early on and never stopped.
My daughter and my cousin were into MH dolls and asked for specific ones, Abby Bominable, Venus McFlytrap, Ghoulia Yelps. Not Draculara, Draculara and Clawdeen for example. Transformers and DC/Marvel has a butt ton of characters that kids go looking for. So yes, it is too samey. MLP isn't Barbie. Nor should Hasbro treat it as such.
I say that because of my experience in the field.
And, to be more fair, not every franchise has a death and rebirth as often as MLP.
Well here's experience for you. You seem to believe that kids are only interested in characters that they recognize and that unrecognizable ones don't sell well. Yet it is KIDS, not adults, that have had 30 decades of diversity with MLP before all this bore core/mane sux nonsense.
All other gens before this had tons of random ponies and kids liked/disliked this, that and the other without issue.
I also edited this into my other post:
***And the fact that the show is specifically made to sell the toys of the main characters, partially for the secondary characters, but not all for the background characters.
Just because a few dislike it doesn't mean that they won't sell well. The remolds of the characters, I think, are dumbly doofy as all get-out and I dislike how they've taken a larger departure from how I see the characters in the show. Because of how they look I've only collected the baby seaponies, the mane 6 and some other characters from the show. That's where I stop with G4.5. However, just because I don't like them doesn't mean that there are not droves of others who do and are willing to shell out the money.
The marketing for MLP is not for the picky part of the fan population, I'm afraid.
Yet you still disregard 30 years of kids who grew up with it, the documented history of a diverse toyline, people's personal experiences with the kids in their family and parrot Hasbro's sorry excuse to be lazy? Nm that there were plenty of non show characters that KIDS owned in whatever respective mlp period they were in. Hasbro sells them so they're going to sell, but that doesn't mean kids don't get tired of it too. Sorry, but in this case your wrong in saying that kids only like and want recognizable characters.
If Hasbro is raking in the money off of the marketing plan then they will keep doing it. That's the basics of marketing and why the cycle repeats itself with a thriving company.
If the formula works then there is little to no reason to mess with it as much as what some outsiders looking in think it should be.
Ah so we're all outsiders now.
Just like those two ladies who said that little girls only want the same thing and only play the same way? Sounds like they aren't the only ones disconnected from the actual customer base which is...wait for it....kids.
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Ah so we're all outsiders now? Just like those two ladies who said that little girls only want the same thing and only play the same way? Sounds like they aren't the only ones disconnected from their actual audience.
I'm sorry that you feel that way.
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I'm going to go back to the suggestion that it's not about the formula changing or kids being fundamentally different in what they want - but that it's what they have. WE have seen (as LAW said) lots of diverse attempts at MLP over 3 decades (LAW, 30 decades of MLP sounds awesome though ;););)). But I remember that little girl at Wondermint's exhibition in Dudley, explaining to her parents how G3 were the old ponies and then G4 the new. She had zero connect to G1 and G2, although the G1 were probably the larger part of the exhibition - I think in some places G3 and G1 were intermingled and she didn't seem to register a difference between them.
My point is that because we know there's another way, we compare. But if you are a kid, you grow up at the mercy of the marketing trends popular at the time. Things have changed in a business sense from gotta catch 'em all to core cast and supporting cast. This all relates as well I think to accessibility of media. When we were kids, I dunno about you guys over in the US, but in the UK we had about four tv channels. There were no kids tv channels, cable hadn't really taken off until the middle nineties and even then a lot of people didn't have it. Kids' TV for school age kids here was thus in a slot on the afternoon after school (3-5) and then in the morning on the weekends.
That means that TV cartoons were competing for these rare slots. I don't remember MLP ever being aired on TV before it was on cable (I think Sky 1?) in the middle 1990s, and we didn't have cable, so I only know that it was because my sister's (rich) friend had cable and her mother recorded the episodes. Naynie borrowed the videos so most of the episodes I saw for the first time via that method.
If your ability to put the TV show into the hearts and minds of the children is more limited, then you aren't going to centre your marketing around a core group of characters. It's harder to make that group stand out. I think for that reason, the comic highlighted many characters, and kept up with new releases (new sets tended to move to Ponyland, or arrive in Ponyland, or occasionally get rescued, such as the MGR ponies in the Whispering Whirligig.). The comic was dictated by the toyline and the illustrations were often based on prototype toys.
Now we live in a multimedia world. It's a lot easier to make and promote a successful TV show (and animating it takes less time because of our technology now), so this approach is more logical. There's the net, some lines have webisodes as well and digital media fandom is also more possible and encouraged.
It doesn't mean kids are different, but the means through which a concept is promoted to them has changed. The kids can't really choose about this because they have what they have and don't know another way.
I think all of this has also made toy companies less directly hands on with their toy. There's more franchising, licencing of other media etc because we now live in that kind of world. So they're not as connected to the imaginations of children as they maybe were. They don't have to work as hard to be creative because they can leave that to the show people. They just have to churn out some plastic figures that look vaguely like the show and their work is done.
The only other thing I will say is that I fundamentally disagree that FIM is based on adventure and offers something that G1 didn't. I mean, G1 opened its animation with RaMC, so nuff said.
Aside the disgusting advertising campaign, I think actually G1 is the least gender-bound of all generations in a lot of ways. I'm not saying there's nothing stereotyped in it, of course there is. But I feel like the G4 characters are bound into their gender stereotypes in a different kind of way. It's hard to explain, but for example, Rarity is a businesswoman and an artist. So far, so good. BUT that's qualified by making her not only a designer but obsessed with fashion to a superficial degree, as well as jewellery. That's not the same as Sparkler's magpie habit (at least the Sparkler in the comics I remember). Rarity is much more gender-bound as girly than Sparkler ever was.
I feel as though the mixture of canons for G1 allows them to be more fluid with the characters and their actions. I grew up more with the comics, but I don't feel as though most of the stories really harped on the fact ponies were girls or guys. I don't remember the guy ponies having to run to the rescue of damsels in distress. I remember Majesty (female) being both decisive and sympathetic, without any need to focus on her as a "girl" or a "boy" in the story. The early stories here mixed the genders of AJ and Bubbles in the stories and then changed them back from guy to girl, but didn't change the ponies' characters or behaviours at the same time. There are pink boy ponies. In the comic, I remember Chief babysitting the baby ponies and getting involved in the slitherwig incident with...Caramel Crunch perhaps? So even though the 1980s were more gender stereotyped than now, the ponies were less so until very late in the line. Even the packaging isn't obsessively pink for most of the line, unlike now and unlike G3.
So I think it's much more about what's about now and what the kids know or expect compared to what we know with longer experience. But I also strongly feel I chose MLP as a kid because it allowed me to use my imagination and wasn't forcing gender roles on me in terms of how I should behave or think as a girl. I hated dolls, I hated pink boxed blond haired barbie, and I hated the colour pink with a passion because it was "girl". I loved watching transformers, turtles, I had ghostbuster toys, an electric railway...and I had My Little Pony. Because it didn't tell me what to be, unlike all the nauseating toys trying to make girls pretend they're a mother with a baby to look after from the age of five.
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Yeah. I meant to say 3 decades. :facepalm: Thanks for catching that. There are also many good points in your post.
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Now of course Hasbro never stops surprising me with their cheapness and laziness. So I'm not vouching for them to change anything. But just saying... the Descendants are on their last movie. Forces of Destiny flopped. They need to have something to keep their girl line strong and currently that's partially MLP (the other part is baby dolls). So they better groom those ponies a bit.
That would explain why Forces of Destiny is on markdown at Target. I'm sad that it flopped because when I was a kid I would have LOVED them.
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Now of course Hasbro never stops surprising me with their cheapness and laziness. So I'm not vouching for them to change anything. But just saying... the Descendants are on their last movie. Forces of Destiny flopped. They need to have something to keep their girl line strong and currently that's partially MLP (the other part is baby dolls). So they better groom those ponies a bit.
That would explain why Forces of Destiny is on markdown at Target. I'm sad that it flopped because when I was a kid I would have LOVED them.
Calling it a flop is my personal opinion, I don't know if they will continue. Problem is the dolls were badly executed. Their features didn't work and because SW doesn't have many female lead characters the line-up had to include women that could have never met each other and three of them look samey. It had a great premise but it was done poorly. Maybe because Hasbro is so out of touch, who knows. They see a blossoming market and go "aha! These girls want adventure and female heroes... mmhhhh... let's make big dolls that can't change fashions but let them be same-body anyways because we are cheap. Also make them nonfunctional and distribute them badly! Oh and we should have a Kylo Ren doll before we do Queen Amidala. Because little girls love violent murderers instead of a fashionable female royal."
I hope they can reboot it soon. I would like to see original SW doll characters instead of the limited range they have going on right now. SW is full of different alien species, they could have done something like Monster High with it. Just instead of going to a High School they would be padawans or whatever. It's like they are all allergic to diversifying their line-ups.
Btw I forgot Hasbro is doing Disney Princess because their dolls are already getting redesigned (turns out giving them all huge heads wasn't that popular, go figure).
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As said before, yes, it sucks that G4 depends a lot on the animation and because of that they're going to produce the same ponies over and over and over again, the ''Hasbrocs'' where super pretty ponies and it would be great to see them again.
I kinda suppose a solution could be not focusing on the same idk, 6 or 7 characters for a whole generation, it could be nice to have different ponies on every animation release, like an specific core for every season of the series. I mean, it's a win-win-win situation, kids could buy toys of different characters that they will like, collectors aren't going to be tired of seeing the same 6 ponies over and over and over and Hasbro probablly could make a whole lot of money.
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@Zapper Leia has an extra outfit or two, so I thought they could change outfits? Oh well. I'll probably pick up Leia or whoever comes with R2 next time I see them on clearance.
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@Zapper Leia has an extra outfit or two, so I thought they could change outfits? Oh well. I'll probably pick up Leia or whoever comes with R2 next time I see them on clearance.
Only that particular Leia can wear the outfits because the others have moulded on clothes for the most part. If you want to pick one up definitely go for that Fashion Leia because she is the only one with removable clothes (she has a moulded on bustier but it's subtle enough).
I really like the look of these dolls and I still try to get that elusive Ahsoka that should be out by now. But they are like action figures with rooted hair. Except the action feature is hardly doing anything and the soft goods are awkward (for instance, you can take off Sabine's and Ahsoka's pants but there is no reason why you would swap those when the rest of the outfit is moulded on. It's like... you can reveal their butts but they permanently have to wear a shirt oO).
Why even do pants as soft goods when other characters have moulded on pants. The more I think about it the more I believe they just didn't give that much of a damn about how these dolls were gonna work.
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I hope they can reboot it soon. I would like to see original SW doll characters instead of the limited range they have going on right now. SW is full of different alien species, they could have done something like Monster High with it. Just instead of going to a High School they would be padawans or whatever. It's like they are all allergic to diversifying their line-ups.
Ohhh no lmao why did you have to say that, now my heart hurts because that will never happen! I'm so obsessed with the alien races in Star Wars but have only ever found one doll of one, ever- my Cantina Man from '98. I get so many compliments on him, too! I wish they would make more aliens. :'( I've been forever searching for a Twi'Lek, specifically, but will never find one.
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I like how it went from ponies to Star Wars. If there isn't a Star Wars/Trek toy topic in the appropriate section, I may have to make one.