The MLP Arena
Pony Talk => Pony Corral => Topic started by: LadyMoondancer on July 05, 2015, 03:40:44 PM
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I was listing a big-head and a small-head Lily on eBay, so I took the opportunity to snap some comparison shots.
I wouldn't put too much stock in the color differences because Lily's body is prone to fading.
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This is probably the quickest way to tell if you have the big-head or small-head version of this pose. Big-head Lily's feet form almost a perfect square. Small-head Lily's front hoof is stuck out and her "Hasbro Bradley" and "Pat Pending" text is at an angle.
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The eyes also differ. Small-head Lily's black pupils come down farther into her eye. This is also true for the other small-head poses. Because of this difference the big-head ponies appear to be looking upward. The small-head ponies appear to look either at you or forward.
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Her head may be bigger, but big-head Lily is shorter than small-head Lily!
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I will need to take all my flutter ponies and inspect each of their heads.
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I've always wondered why they redid the flutter pony moulds - maybe the originals were damaged or lost? It's clearly not just a casting thing, they're separate designs. The walking flutter pose has the same small/big head variations.
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It's a real mystery, especially considering the second set of flutters (Cloud Puff, Tropical Breeze, etc) ALSO have big-head / small-head variations!
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I'm guessing different Factories....
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But why would they remake two entire mould sets (not a fast, easy or cheap process) just for another factory? It would make more sense to cast up additional bronzes from the original masters - unless those masters were lost/destroyed, or the creation method bars such duplication (lost wax for example). It's a very long, expensive process creating a new master / pose, which is why Hasbro reused poses for the majority of sets and still does to this day. Even retooling master moulds was generally favoured over a complete replacement.
The only other 'remakes' I can think of are the Princess Ponies and Sundae Best, both of which needed modifications for their special features.
The fact that both 'big' and 'small' face variants seem to occur with equal regularity also doesn't fit with the hypothesis of additional factories being supplied with masters unless there was a /huge/ influx of new factories, and again if so, why only Flutters but none of the other sets?
:what:
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I even didn't know that there was this differance in heads!!!!
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Thanks for the handy comparison! For some reason I don't think I've ever seen a big-head Lily, though I've seen big-head versions of most of the first set.
I've always wondered why they redid the flutter pony moulds - maybe the originals were damaged or lost? It's clearly not just a casting thing, they're separate designs. The walking flutter pose has the same small/big head variations.
It's a real mystery, especially considering the second set of flutters (Cloud Puff, Tropical Breeze, etc) ALSO have big-head / small-head variations!
My guess is that they changed the mold because the big-head versions are too unbalanced and fall forward on their heads sometimes (kind of like flat foot ponies, who were modified into concave-foot ponies). Hasbro probably wouldn't go to the trouble of making a new mold unless there was some practical reason (like Baby Sugarberry said). If my guess is right, though, I do wonder why some of the second set of flutters also had big heads when you'd think that by that time they'd have fixed the problem. Maybe they didn't properly tell their factories to use the new small-head mold? . . . "Oh, you wanted us to use this mold? Too late . . . " I don't know. :)
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I was just going through my duplicates and wondering why my Lilies had two different poses.
I'm always amazed at the depth of knowledge here at the Arena :) Thanks for the info!
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But why would they remake two entire mould sets (not a fast, easy or cheap process) just for another factory? It would make more sense to cast up additional bronzes from the original masters - unless those masters were lost/destroyed, or the creation method bars such duplication (lost wax for example). It's a very long, expensive process creating a new master / pose, which is why Hasbro reused poses for the majority of sets and still does to this day. Even retooling master moulds was generally favoured over a complete replacement.
The only other 'remakes' I can think of are the Princess Ponies and Sundae Best, both of which needed modifications for their special features.
The fact that both 'big' and 'small' face variants seem to occur with equal regularity also doesn't fit with the hypothesis of additional factories being supplied with masters unless there was a /huge/ influx of new factories, and again if so, why only Flutters but none of the other sets?
:what:
I'd never noticed this about Flutters! The differences make me think of the Collector Pose change between FF and CC. Clearly Hasbro fiddled with that pose A LOT and it makes sense as the FFs are top-heavy and oddly hunched over. Hasbro seems to have been interested in producing a pretty high-quality product back in the 80s.
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Hmm... But aren't there other sets too with these kind of slight mold differences? I'm thinking Big Brothers here mainly.
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Really, princess ponies have those different sizes as well?
I only knew this about flutters and, since a very short time, Sundae Best ponies, so far.
In any case thanks for the comparision, the differently painted eyes were totally new to me. :)
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The second set of Princesses (Princess Dawn, Princess Moondust, etc) are in molds that are remakes of previous molds.
For example, Princess Moondust looks like she's in Posey's mold, but if you put her side by side with Posey you'll see that her face is different.
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It's more obvious in real life, but you can kind of see it if you look at the size of Posey's eye compared to Moondust's.
The first set of Princess ponies (Princess Tiffany, Princess Primrose, etc) do not appear to be remolds, so I don't know why the 2nd set are . . .
The weird thing with the flutters is if Hasbro had made a mold change halfway through Year 4 then Tropical Breeze and her friends shouldn't have two versions. If they had made the change halfway through Year 5, then Peach Blossom shouldn't have two versions. But they all have two versions.
The different styles of eyes are also odd. Maybe that does point to them coming from different factories? I don't even know.
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Another oddity is the big and smaller symbols on ponies like the BBE's That's why I was guessing different factories since they were put out around the same time as the Flutters.
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Adding to Ivy's last comment, the Year 2 regular unicorns and pegasi also come in larger and smaller symbol versions. I find this less surprising than the different molds though.
This may have already been said, but in addition to the 2nd Year Princesses and the Sundae Best ponies, the Merry-Go-Round ponies are also in molds that resemble but do not perfectly match previous molds. I assume in this case it's because the mold itself was so different due to the carousel design. Thus they just made new molds but based them on old poses.
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Now I need to inspect my flutters as well lol :lol:
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Minor symbol variations in size / placement aren't surprising at all really - pad printers wear out a lot faster than bronze casting masters, and we are talking about the 1980's where stuff like art / stencils were often made by hand, traced from a master proof sheet most likely. Pad printers also can warp the more they're used, so that can account for some variation, though not drastic size changes.
The whole 'two completely different toolings' for flutters just ... baffles me. There had to have been a reason because it would have been quite expensive, but we may never know what that reason was. The big head versions don't even stand that badly, or at least the small head versions aren't substantially better.