How did baby Ember get her cutie mark?

[otocolobus_manul]

I agree with pretty much everything MJNSEIFER, Lilja and LadyAmalthea have said (well said by the way! I can't articulate as well). I also don't take everything FiM says as gospel, and I cherrypick what I want to include in my own fantasy pony world. I also agree with lovesbanysquirmy saying it's a generational thing - not in what we like, but in how kids' shows are structured. G1 is a product of its time. G4 is a product of its time. One is a high-fantasy, mysterious, open and largely unexplored/unexplained world. One is a modern state with magical elements and a system of government that seems to be a mixture of anarchy, democracy (they have a mayor, after all) and monarchy. Both are cool in their own ways.

Also yeah this thread hasn't just derailed, it's spilled hazardous materials and is now on fire. Sorry kingluke. Also, any interest in a thread where people share their own imaginary pony worlds?

[Taffeta]

One is a high-fantasy, mysterious, open and largely unexplored/unexplained world. One is a modern state with magical elements and a system of government that seems to be a mixture of anarchy, democracy (they have a mayor, after all) and monarchy. Both are cool in their own ways.

Is that only based on the G1 cartoon? I ask because the comic world is essentially an unofficial monarchy of sorts. And several of the neighbouring kingdoms/lands are also monarchies or principalities.

[LadyAmalthea]

I sincerely apologize if I have said anything to upset anyone. I'm confused about how it was interpreted that I said anything about the show being centered around a community of characters...in fact, if anything, I found the cast of protagonist characters to be rather inconsistent (not that that's a bad thing; I would rather have that than Mane 6 over and over!). All I said was that it seemed disjointed, maybe 'lack of continuity' as others have said is a better way to put it. It felt, even as a kid, that I was watching episodes out of order, but I chalked that up to the fact that I was likely watching reruns and the episodes I was watching were being played randomly. Then I bought the DVDs last year thinking, oh good, I can watch them in order now. But it still seemed like every episode was a separate show from the others; no reference back to anything that had happened in previous episodes. Such may have been the nature of 80's cartoons...I was not a big enough TV watcher as a kid (as I am still not now) to know; only that modern shows usually seem to have an ongoing storyline from what I can see. I hardly think I was 'bashing' it...I did state that I enjoyed it well enough as a kid. It just didn't have an in-depth enough ongoing storyline to keep me interested as an adult. I did like seeing the art style of it, and it was a nice trip down memory lane. I certainly didn't mean to hurt anyone's feelings, if I did. I'm glad that the show still brings joy to people, as it did to me as a child.

Sorry kingluke for going so far off your original thread.

[Zapper]

On another note, I don't know what your other thread idea is, but we really don't need any more threads about how G4 is relevant to G1, because, quite honestly, it isn't.

I think these kinds of threads are fine as long as the poster doesn't claim his/her opinions are fact-based. It happens to so many theory threads, too. Posting headcanons is totally fine with me, I like to read them. But they gotta admit it's all in their heads. I am tired of seeing youtube-style essays about hidden truths and agendas and stuff

[KarentheUnicorn]

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[Taffeta]

On another note, I don't know what your other thread idea is, but we really don't need any more threads about how G4 is relevant to G1, because, quite honestly, it isn't.

I think these kinds of threads are fine as long as the poster doesn't claim his/her opinions are fact-based. It happens to so many theory threads, too. Posting headcanons is totally fine with me, I like to read them. But they gotta admit it's all in their heads. I am tired of seeing youtube-style essays about hidden truths and agendas and stuff

I think my problem is that we get a lot of these kinds of discussion threads and they are fundamentally all the same. We never get threads wondering about how G1 might feed into G2, or G3 might be connected to G1. We don't even really get threads about G3 into G4 or connections between G2 and G4. What we get are:
Threads comparing G1 and G4
Threads comparing the cartoons from G1 and G4.
Threads trying to explain how G1 ponies/concepts fit into G4.
Threads trying to validate why it's ok to reinvent G1 into a G4 concept
Threads that assume a G4 concept goes back to previous generations (like this one).

Pretty much all of these threads are underscored with scant knowledge of G1 (at best, just "the cartoon!"), and thus reinforced by a surfeit of G4 knowledge. This usually results (like this one) in comparing two TV series that are not really comparable. FIM is 90% of G4, MLP & Friends/Tales is maybe 20% of G1 in terms of storytelling, so it's easy to see how those conversations then get dominated by FIM examples.

Lately there's also a trend of a handful of G4 fans (not those who have posted in this thread, I hasten to add!) who complain that people are 'picking on' G4 and 'being hurtful' by having opinions that differ from the main point of the thread. TBH I find it really stifling that apparently it's fine to trample all over other pony generations in an attempt to make them FIM friendly, but it's not fine to say, hang on a minute, maybe it's ok just left as it is.

I would genuinely be more engaged in a thread that compared G1 to another generation than G4, since they don't happen. But the G4 ones always go the same way, and usually cover the exact same topics. Take this one for example. Ember's symbol has been discussed on here so many times I'm considering saving a copy-paste response.

It's just not necessary to regurgigate the same thing over and over again. Especially since most of the sweeping judgements about G1 or how G1 works seem to come from people who only have a general overview of G1 anyway. I see random comments about the 'might of majesty' or whatever else, which is usually a sign of someone who read an online wiki/watched a yt video but doesn't actually know about Majesty. (This is usually resolved by comparing her to Celestia.).

@Unicorn - yep, that's about the size of it
The thread is not on fire. The thread is engaged in a debate where people share differing opinions. Big difference.

[Pokeyonekenobie]

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@Unicorn - yep, that's about the size of it
The thread is not on fire. The thread is engaged in a debate where people share differing opinions. Big difference.

Okay, I totally misinterpreted the picture.  I thought it was being suggested that maybe Ember got her mark as the result of a burn-perhaps from a family member who had fire magic. (You know, since her name is Ember.) 

[KarentheUnicorn]

The cassette story really had nothing to do with Baby Ember getting a symbol/cutiemark.

It was a story about ember dealing with her feelings of envy but also of her having a prophetic dream about the RB ponies being in danger and having their rainbow hair stolen and being turned into wigs, which would be sold in a place called....NewYorkCity...

LOL's, oh the memories.

And I want pink angel pony...hasbro never made her (sad)

Baby Ponies are sometimes very wise and grown up ponies are sometimes very foolish...(best words of wisdom angel pony)


So the story really had nothing to do with Baby Ember getting a symbol, it was all about prophetic dreams and some dude stealing rainbow pony hair to sell it in newyorkcity.

Wait, my biggest question is, why does Majesty know someone from new york city who she'd invite to the castle LOLs!!!

And at the end of the story the narrator says, You'll have fun creating your own stories an adventures with Ember and all of her friends in the world of My Little Pony.


If we go back to original Baby Ember, the mail order version. There are 3 versions of this toy. A all blue, a lavender with pink hair, and one is pink with lavender hair - This was kinda the first thing I remember we could get through the mail so If memory serves me right this was the start of the mail order system. Pretty sure it would have been in the 84'ish time frame so it was probably to see how well the mail order system would work, see if baby ponies would be something to make in future and also  to promote the first special. She had no symbol in the first special and thus that's why she didn't have one on the toy.

As to why she has a symbol in the cassette/pony package. Well, she's also a different color from all the original embers. She was a dull lavender body with lavender hair and a white star on her flank. I feel like the more important question is which baby Ember is the REAL baby Ember?


Edit: And Fire Repunzel is my go to when a thread is on fire. Cause I'm silly.

[Taffeta]

I think star Ember is the real Ember.

The others were not always marketed as Ember, so they're questionable

[KarentheUnicorn]

I think star Ember is the real Ember.

The others were not always marketed as Ember, so they're questionable

Well, as I said in an earlier post, the one I ordered through the mail was the all blue one. Which I deemed a boy. But going back to then, thinking, there were no actual photographs on the pamphlet, only a black and white drawing/artwork. So we that ordered her/him through the mail had no way of knowing what the baby pony was really going to look like. I don't know for sure when the cassette and baby pony combo was sold in stores but I don't remember seeing it till much later, I already had my blue ember, but this is me going back in memory to 84-85, so as a kid, a lot time could have only been a few months. But I do remember already having blue baby ember. (shrugs)

But originally if you ordered the mail order version you really didn't know what you were going to get other than going by the drawing. So it was sort of a surprise when you got the baby in the mail. I had no way of knowing what 'kind' of shade of blue the pony would be till I got it.

And this was obviously pre-internet so nobody had a way of sharing their toys online, showing them off. So, it was kind of 'fun' to expect an unseen item in the mail, etc.

[Safflower]

As to why she has a symbol in the cassette/pony package. Well, she's also a different color from all the original embers. She was a dull lavender body with lavender hair and a white star on her flank. I feel like the more important question is which baby Ember is the REAL baby Ember.

Same here - I've mostly wondered which is the 'true' Ember or if they're all the same pony in the first place. Headcannoning that one (or all?) of them turned into Ember's Dream and therefore got a symbol implies that they are? But it raises more questions as to the color changes and the other Embers. It's very unclear if Ember's Dream has any relation to the MO ones, so for all anyone knows, she could've been born with a symbol like most of the rest of the G1 ponies.

(If we're still sharing, I personally headcannon that they are the same pony; Ember's Dream is her 'true form' while she can shapeshift into the other three.)

[Taffeta]

If Ive got it right, the MO babies were original sold as a beautiful baby pony, and then may have added the name Ember. I do have a US leaflet for this somewhere but I've never opened it as it's sealed up with the sticker of another pony. It might make sense that Ember came about as a name around the time of Ember's dream.

I know here in the UK there was a push for kids to name the symbolless ones themselves. I feel like this came up recently, but the leaflet I have for the UK actually encourages the new owner to give the pony a name themselves.

Whereas Ember's Dream seems to have been named Ember purposefully from the off.

I was only about 2 when these ponies came out though. And there is remarkably little about Ember other than her mail order leaflet stuff, the cassette release and that appearance in RaMC.

It could easily be argued that lavender Ember and ember with star are both formally Ember, but the other versions are undecided

I also feel like Ember's Dream is a rare appearance for Majesty...

And that there's a second G1 story canon in the US which is more grounded in real life concepts (like the nyc reference) which rarely gets talked about because people know the G1 animation much better.

[KarentheUnicorn]

Don't quote me on this because I don't have any pamphlets in front of me. I think originally the baby ponies may have been advertised as, as taff says, baby ponies or beautiful baby pony but then sometime after the pamphlets changed to read 'baby ember' for the mail order ponies.

Because I knew the pony as baby ember before I ever saw a special and before I ever saw the cassette tape version in the store. And for some reason, I do believe this was discussed on the forums before among collectors, that there are multiple versions of the original mail order forms/pamphlet thingie.

Again, I'm working off memory right now so don't shoot me if I'm mixing something up.

But just like with the mail order birthflower and other mail order forms, there was multiple versions of some forms.

I'm thinking maybe over the years when they did the printing, it's possible they ran out and then printed more, but sometimes they'd change it or they'd add new mail orders, so thus they'd update the pamphlets to reflect that. The mail order programs usually had an end date but it was usually months to a year beyond when they originally started putting them in the packages. And sometimes even though the end date hadn't passed yet you'd sometimes be unlucky as they would run out of whatever pony you were ordering. As I had that happen to me with baby Gametime and Sugarcake as I got one of them but the other they sent me a post card to tell me they were no longer available.

So I have a feeling that originally Ember may have been baby pony but then changed at some point to Ember because they were having the TV special and had decided to give the baby a name.

I don't remember ever watching the special on tv originally, I saw it on video that I rented at the video store, etc. Then at some point I did see it again when I was able to watch the episode tv show they eventually re-showed the specials on tv. But this was back in the day when you could only watch things like Wizard of Oz on TV once a year. So I have no clue what year/dates I actually was first exposed to all the specials, I know it was later than when they originally aired.

I think maybe it's very possible that originally the mail order program was an attempt to see how 'popular' the ponies were. Back in the day there was no internet to tell you. But if you could see results from people actually WANTING to mail in to get a pony, you knew that hay...people do actually want this item. It's not just mom or grandma buying a kid a toy off the shelf. Kids actually do wanna save the points and order these 'special edition' ponies you can only get through the mail.

It's one reason you can go back and see the Original 6 were already being described as 'collector' ponies, even back in the 80's. Hasbro knew apparently that both kids and adults were already seeing it as a collection, not just some random average toy.

[Lilja]

Same here - I've mostly wondered which is the 'true' Ember or if they're all the same pony in the first place. Headcannoning that one (or all?) of them turned into Ember's Dream and therefore got a symbol implies that they are? But it raises more questions as to the color changes and the other Embers. It's very unclear if Ember's Dream has any relation to the MO ones, so for all anyone knows, she could've been born with a symbol like most of the rest of the G1 ponies.

It's a bit difficult to say for certain. On one mail offer they're just referred to as nameless baby ponies, so likely not meant to be the same character. But on another the name Ember is given which implies they all represent one character. Personally I'd rather think of them as separate ponies, because that gives Ember (whichever of them you want to give that name) two friends rather than being the one lonely baby pony in Year 2. But since Ember is the only official name for all of them, that's what collectors will always call them. There are lots of ponies that share names in G1, but they're usually not released in the same year and the same set! 

If Ive got it right, the MO babies were original sold as a beautiful baby pony, and then may have added the name Ember. I do have a US leaflet for this somewhere but I've never opened it as it's sealed up with the sticker of another pony. It might make sense that Ember came about as a name around the time of Ember's dream.

The first special aired in 1984, and the Listen 'n Fun set has the year 1985 on the card, so the name likely came from the special (but possibly it had been chosen by Hasbro beforehand).

[Ponyfan]

There are MO pamphlets that  call the 3 Embers  "My Beautiful Baby Pony" and also "Ember."

http://www.mylittlewiki.org/wiki/Ember

Both have a copyright date of 1983.

Also the original VHS tape of Rescue at Midnight Castle has a copyright date of 1984 for the program and I think 1985 for the boxart and description.


Ponyfan