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Author Topic: Daring Doubt  (Read 3691 times)

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Offline Al-1701

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Daring Doubt
« on: September 21, 2019, 01:49:22 PM »
Spoiler
Well, it's official.  They never made a good Daring Do episode.  By the time we got to the end of this trainwreck of a subplot, the story had to twist itself into so much of a knot to solve itself pretzels are saying "That looks like it hurts" seeing it.

All right, you probably know this, but I hate the "Daring Do is real" subplot.  And sure enough this series have proven me right time and again this was a mistake.  She and her world doesn't gel with the world of Equestria.  And the justifications to try to slam this square peg through a round hole only cause more trouble.

Well, it all came to its traumatic conclusion today, and once again the writers broke out the contrivances to just bring this all to a conclusion.  Since we're behind the spoiler tag here, I'm going to put this simply.  Daring Do's rival writes a book from his perspective, tricks Fluttershy to become one of his grunts, is reformed by being her presence, and we find out Nostril Eyes has been after both of them because they're stealing the artifacts he's supposed to be guarding.  Everyone is now good and the Daring Do subplot is done.

You know, they had an interesting idea here with the fact Daring Do is not an unbiased source of her adventures.  No one is stopping her from embellishing, omitting, and outright lying.  Of course, that would mean Rainbow Dash would have to wrong and we can't have that now can we.

I need to find something genuinely good to say about this episode.  Uh, um, it's over.  Yeah.  There you go.
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Offline Sparkle Pony

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #1 on: September 21, 2019, 01:54:47 PM »
Why are the Daring Do episodes always so freaking weird?  -_-
I feel like the writers have dug themselves into a hole with the strange stuff they think would make for a funny episode one time, but then have to keep obeying seasons later.
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Offline Zapper

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #2 on: September 21, 2019, 03:46:15 PM »
Spoiler
What took the cake in this episode was the cheap reference humor I have come to loathe in MLP FiM. Why on Earth was that Caballeron alter ego a pony version of the Game of Thrones author, Geaorge R. Martin? Yeah, I know, for jokes. Because Daring Do also uses an alter ego that reminds us of Joanne K. Rowling. But just... why is that funny. Why is that fun?  :P
It would be different if she was the author of Cherry Trotter, but Daring Do herself is an Indiana Jones knockoff, so... sigh. Just a bunch of refs thrown together and bam! World building! I guess...

Anyways, that's my nitpick.

I think it's good they closed the Daring Do stuff with the theme of her being a thief and having to end it. FiM could be culturally insensitive but at least some writer was like "hey maybe a pony shouldn't steal artifacts from a different culture, she is supposed to be a hero"  :lol:

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2019, 05:20:43 PM »
Safe to say I'll skip this one. I never liked the Daring Do episodes much.
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Offline Al-1701

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2019, 05:25:31 PM »
Spoiler
What took the cake in this episode was the cheap reference humor I have come to loathe in MLP FiM. Why on Earth was that Caballeron alter ego a pony version of the Game of Thrones author, Geaorge R. Martin? Yeah, I know, for jokes. Because Daring Do also uses an alter ego that reminds us of Joanne K. Rowling. But just... why is that funny. Why is that fun?  :P
It would be different if she was the author of Cherry Trotter, but Daring Do herself is an Indiana Jones knockoff, so... sigh. Just a bunch of refs thrown together and bam! World building! I guess...

Anyways, that's my nitpick.

I think it's good they closed the Daring Do stuff with the theme of her being a thief and having to end it. FiM could be culturally insensitive but at least some writer was like "hey maybe a pony shouldn't steal artifacts from a different culture, she is supposed to be a hero"  :lol:
Spoiler
And not to mention often wrecking the ruins that she takes the artifacts from.  Actual archeologists would wretch at Daring Do and Caballeron's actions as well as attitudes that the rare artifacts are all that matter.

And the author references are also stupid.  I agree there.
Here's my thought on how they should have handled Daring Do way back with Daring Don't.

Daring Do's author is an actual archeologist named Compass Rose.  The reason her book was being delayed is because she was called out to a dig on short notice so she had to table her writing.  Rainbow Dash and the ponies learn of this because Twilight Velvet is her publisher (so the reference in the comic fits with the show), and Rainbow Dash thinks Compass Rose being an archeologist means she's actually Daring Do and her stories are real.  So, she drags the group to the dig.

Compass is irritated by the intruders.  Rainbow Dash fangirling doesn't help matters.  Compass Rose looks like Daring Do because she serves as a model for the artwork.  However, she is a real archeologist who carefully digs through sites looking for materials from ancient civilizations.  When she mentions how it helps them learn how they farmed, their relationship with nature, their festivals, and their fashion and jewelry; this interests Applejack, Flutter, Pinkie Pie, and Rarity respectively.  They offer to help with the dig, and get to work.

Rainbow Dash can't believe the writer of Daring Do can be so boring.  She believes this is all to keep her adventure secret.  Especially since Map Legend, someone who looks like her rival, is also on the dig.

Rainbow Dash treats him as suspicious.  However, her interference finally gets to Compass Rose and she blows up that Daring Do isn't real.  She created Daring Do as a romanticized version of her life as a means to relieve stress, help fund her studies, and get ponies interested in archeology.  Map Legend is the base for Daring's rival because the two were Friendly rivals in college and he does the first proofread of her manuscripts. 

Rainbow Dash shuts up as she explains this is her real work and it's very important.  By learning about the past, they gain a better understanding of themselves.  Like this dig is actually of an arena for a sport.  Her findings here would also help her finish her novel since Daring and her rival would captain teams in the sport with the winner getting the artifact and loser being put in mortal danger.  Realizing this, Rainbow Dash actually starts helping.  They uncover what Compass was looking for, a mural depicting the sport played.  Rainbow Dash recognizes it as her favorite sport and never knew how old it was.  Compass explains many of the modern games come ancient roots.

With a new understanding of archeology, Rainbow Dash and company leave.  I would also make this the start of a story arch for Rainbow Dash where she becomes disillusioned with the Wonderbolts due to the attitudes of the squadron and begins to take growing interest in archeology.  It would be a good lesson for little kids that sometimes your dreams change and you can find yourself in a place you never imagined.

But that would be me.
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Offline otocolobus_manul

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2019, 07:18:50 PM »
That was cute! Rushed and weird, but cute.

And yeah, I love that they straight-up said that stealing stuff from other cultures and slapping it in a museum is, you know, stealing. Though I do think that they should have given back all the stuff they stole. And I love that there are apparently other “guardians” like the cat dude whose name I can’t spell. Makes me wonder who created them, and how.

Also, Rainbow just rolling her eyes at Dr. Horse and his hired help catching the friendship bug from Fluttershy was hilarious. “Oh, right. It’s Fluttershy they just spent the afternoon with. What was I expecting.”

And WOW did they miss an opportunity to, after Dr. Horse goes, “Wait, you’re actually A.K. Yearling?” have Rainbow, Flutters and his henchman all say in unison, “Wait, you didn’t know that?”. Him raging at being the only one out of the loop would’ve been hilarious.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2019, 07:25:13 PM by otocolobus_manul »
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Offline Leave a Whisper

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2019, 07:58:26 PM »
What kinduva name is Nostril Eyes?  :brow:
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Offline Pinkie21

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #7 on: September 22, 2019, 06:05:28 AM »
I actually kinda liked the message of this one.

Spoiler
Listening to all the sides in anything can be really important.  Rainbow was so focused on her love for DD that she never considered what Fluttershy was saying about DD’s competitor.  I liked the fact that FS was open to listening to Cabaleron  and Aoizotl (sp?) explain themselves.  It was kind of a perfect message for this current time. 
That being said, really?  More reformed villains?  I can’t wait til this series ends and we can stop having love and friendship forced down our throats.  It’s not as bad as Steven Universe in that regard, but it’s close.

Offline Shaiyeh

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2019, 11:33:28 AM »
I haven't watched FiM in a loooong time, last daring do episode I watched was the one where they were at a convention or whatever.  I have to say though Al-1701 I really like the episode plot you came up with x)
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Offline TJgamer

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #9 on: September 22, 2019, 07:15:30 PM »
If you care the slightest bit about continuity, this episode will give you a headache.  >_<
I saw this episode early (along with the rest of the season), and I had to pause several times and facepalm with both laughter and disbelief.

Why is Daring Do being real still an issue? How is it still secret? Didn't Rainbow Dash already blow her cover when she told all those kids about her entries in the Friendship Journal back in "Fame and Misfortune"? And do ponies from down south in Sonambula just not relay any information or news to other parts of Equestria?

Okay, back in season 4 when A.K. Yearling was revealed to be Daring Do herself, I was somewhat open to the idea. But almost every subsequent D.D. episode since then has only further cemented that this probably wasn't a good idea.

So, Rainbow Dash just leaves Fluttershy behind with Caballeron to manipulate her. Okay? :huh:

When Caballeron's team are attacked by the guard cats, Fluttershy says "Have you ever tried just talking to them?" and "Everycreature likes to be listened to. You just need to take the time to understand them."
I think that's something only you can do, Fluttershy.  :pout:

While I want to praise Fluttershy for having grown so much from her timid past, I rolled my eyes when she just walked right out in front of Ahuizotl without caution, even though he could very well crush her instantly.

And as mentioned earlier, Ahuizotl's motivation is contradictory to what has been established. He has at least twice attempted to take over/burn up the world/valley. The only excuse I can possibly think of is maybe he was acting rogue when performing these evil deeds with these artifacts against the wishes of the other guardians. But the script doesn't suggest that in the slightest.

Okay, all that complaining aside, I do like the message. It's one that both kids and adults really need to take to heart, especially nowadays. That said, outside of Ahuizotl's confusing explanation, I can't see it being easy to misunderstand Daring Do and Caballeron's motives. Didn't we already address Daring Do's destructive antics in her previous episode? And we all already knew Caballeron was a thief.

I did like that we gave his henchmen a little bit of characterization, which was sorely missing from the past. Some of the new bits of mythology were kinda cool; mainly the gargoyles. Fluttershy continues to be a domineering force of nature, even if to a ridiculous level. And like I said, I did like the message this episode was trying to go for.

But in the end, this marks the conclusion to a very broken, sloppy story arc. Don't get me wrong, I want to like Daring Do and the adventures she embarks. I've read the three novels which were enjoyable. Unfortunately, making her real didn't do this show many favors in the long run.  -_-

I like Al-1701's concept, as it is very down to earth. Only problem is, why would Rainbow Dash think this fictional book series was real in the first place?
« Last Edit: September 22, 2019, 07:20:32 PM by TJgamer »
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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #10 on: September 23, 2019, 06:52:34 AM »
Spoiler
So many questions in this ep: What message are they trying to teach kids here? Stealing is okay as long as you then have a noble cause? Why would Fluttershy knowingly go along with an obvious nemesis of Daring Do? Why is AK Yearling concerned about being found out when the book has already been released? Why didn't Ahuizotl actually give chase when they were running away with the artifact? Why are we even reforming book villains? Isn't the whole point of them being bad to make the book interesting?

Offline Zapper

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #11 on: September 23, 2019, 07:47:38 AM »
Why is Daring Do being real still an issue? How is it still secret? Didn't Rainbow Dash already blow her cover when she told all those kids about her entries in the Friendship Journal back in "Fame and Misfortune"?

I firmly believe this was a continuity mistake by the writers. Either that or they retconned it because "secret Daring Do" was a more fun concept or whatever. This show has often been inconsistent.

Offline Al-1701

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #12 on: September 23, 2019, 01:26:06 PM »
Remember, this show has no bible since that wasn't something Faust did.  Unfortunately, a show this convoluted needs a bible because clearly these writers are way out of their in a boat with no rudder.
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Offline Zapper

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #13 on: September 23, 2019, 03:24:54 PM »
Remember, this show has no bible since that wasn't something Faust did.

Huh. Why? Did she talk about that at one point or is this one of those "Lauren said" rumors?

Offline Al-1701

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Re: Daring Doubt
« Reply #14 on: September 23, 2019, 05:44:36 PM »
I believe in an interview she said she and McCracken do not do show bibles.  I believe McCarthy has confirmed there is no running reference material as well.
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