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Author Topic: Princess Sundance  (Read 2974 times)

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Offline Mlp Sunsparkle

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Princess Sundance
« on: January 02, 2019, 04:36:09 PM »
Happy new year everyone!
On New Year’s Eve I went to pick up a lot of ponies, and I got the lot for this gem, Princess Sundance!

She is a princess variant with (no country) Sundance’s body, Pearl’s head and either Taffeta or Pearl’s tail. She has no tinsel in it, and there is no trace of any in the clip (her tail is so thin that the clip can be pulled right to the tail hole). She has no forelock either.
Here are some pictures of her:

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Offline Noasar

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2019, 04:54:06 PM »
Oh wow, what an oddity! She’s absolutely brilliant!
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Offline Tiara546

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2019, 04:57:07 PM »
Again? There has been one like this already http://mlparena.com/archive/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.ShowItem&g2_itemId=473005

Mentioned in these threads before:
http://mlparena.com/index.php/topic,388531.msg1674482.html
http://mlparena.com/index.php/topic,310080.0.html

From the tail which is significantly thinner on yours, I can tell it's not the same pony. Would be time to add her to the wiki I guess?

Oh, congratulations! She's a gem indeed. :)
« Last Edit: January 02, 2019, 05:02:41 PM by Tiara546 »

Offline Kikwifluff

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2019, 04:58:07 PM »
She’s lovely!! What an odd pony.

Offline Elva

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2019, 05:00:02 PM »
Interesting find! I've never heard of a pony that has a body of a certain pose and a head of another pose.
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Offline Taffeta

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2019, 05:02:10 PM »
My immediate thought was whether this was Winterblossom's (?) that she's had at ponycon a few times, but it doesn't look the same to me either...

@Elva - there are a whole bunch of those which were sold here in the UK at the end of MLP, literal puttogether jobs, often bits of Princess and Happytail, or frankenstein wingers mixing bits of windy and summer wings. Also some weird flutters with no hair or wings in Windy Wing boxes...and so on. But the Pearl/Sundance hybrid thing has inspired questions and discussion previously...and now another one. We really need more information on this, but this is super-interesting to me.

Winterblossom's met with scepticism because if you just glance at it it looks ridiculously like someone just shoved a head from one pony on a body of another. But I feel like the small details suggest that it would be really hard work to bother to do that, especially to just sell it in a lot of ebay items. I saw it at ponycon a few times and it still divides opinion - but things like the lack of forelock (Pearl should have this) and the Taffeta tail (Taffeta wasn't sold in the UK but her hair was - ONLY in the variant princess context) makes a put-together job more unlikely. For it to be a put together you would have to sacrifice three ponies. One of which was only sold in Europe (NC Sundance). One was not sold in the UK (Taffeta) and one was sold in the UK but with a forelock (Pearl). To make that work you'd have to rehair the forelock of the Pearl with tinsel to remove the missing forelock, steal part (Not all) of a Taffeta tail and then shove it on a body it clearly doesn't match with to make the project complete.

Now a second one has turned up, again without attention drawn to it, in a bunch of items collected by a reputable collector. And the features are similar, especially the lack of forelock. No tinsel in the tail makes it different, but Winterblossom still had hers as of ponycon last Oct, so I'm pretty sure these are different ponies.

It seems like a weird but legit variant to me. We need more information, but it seems more likely than not.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2019, 05:12:22 PM by Taffeta »
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Offline Noasar

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2019, 05:08:19 PM »
Interesting that everyone in 2012 says it’s not legit. How things change!
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Offline Tiara546

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2019, 05:11:23 PM »
By the way, there has been these variations of UK princess variants before. I am talking about her having no tinsel in her tail, but the other version from the links I posted above does have multi color tinsel in her tail. I may not sound like it, but I find this pretty awesome. :D

Offline Taffeta

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2019, 05:15:37 PM »
Interesting that everyone in 2012 says it’s not legit. How things change!

People in 2012 didn't see it in person, which makes the difference when looking at small details. Although a lot of the time people don't look at small details anyway. It's still not that we can prove anything about this pony, or disprove it either, but it seems more likely to exist than not exist.

Things really don't change, though. There's a long history of people decrying things that turn out to be real and advocating stuff that turn out to be fake. It's how our community learns about new stuff, through the trial and error of extensive discussion and personal knowledge.

There are definitely other princess variants which are mostly the same except for a lack of/inclusion of tinsel in the tail, so that variation between these two is actually also in keeping with princess variants. The confusing part is that it's Sundance's body that's being used here, as this is the only time we've seen Sundance involved in the princess variants. But I wonder if we should really be surprised. Sundance was still on sale in the UK as a NC pony in 1987, the same year as the first set princess ponies. The variants come from pieces that generally date from 1987-1988/9ish. But I admit I would be happier to know of other Sundances as hybrids...to know where she fits in overall. PEarl is also not a common inclusion in princess variants, though. Maybe because Happytails are none of them white, and there is generally an attempt to colour match bodies to heads where possible with the others. MAybe this is Pearl's equivalent.

I should add to this that I don't believe NC Sundance is made in Spain. But that's a whole other discussion point.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2019, 05:22:03 PM by Taffeta »
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Offline Mlp Sunsparkle

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2019, 05:22:39 PM »
She sure is odd!

She’s definitely not Winterblossom’s, as I bought her on Facebook in a lot of other ponies
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 (seller’s pic)

She said they have lots of play in them and that there were some old and some new, so to my knowledge she was just clearing out unused toys. She wanted £20 for the lot.

Her tail is significantly thinner than usual (wouldn’t say it’s as thick as a g4 even!)

If there is anything else I can do to help (pics etc.) just ask and I’ll do my best :)

Also, I think you’re definitely on to something with nc sundance not being Spanish, as if she was made in Spain, why would they pay to ship parts of ponies meant to be sold off cheaply? There are some German hair colours in princess variants but the German variants were also manufactured in Hong Kong (or china, sorry can’t remember which one)


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« Last Edit: January 02, 2019, 05:27:15 PM by Mlp Sunsparkle »
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Offline Pony.Backpack

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2019, 06:16:07 PM »
I love her!!! ♥♥♥♥ Sundance is my all time favorite pony  :happy:  Now I want to make a custom of Princess Sundance!

Offline RoseNoire

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2019, 09:04:52 PM »
What an oddity, that's interesting. :D

@MLPSunsparkle : I too don't think NC is Spanish. I have seen 3 of them in the wild, have two of them and I live in Belgium, there are more Italians than regular version and I've never seen any Spanish pony ever. Plus, with her striking blue Eyes, I always though NC Sundance would be Italian, but I have no idea why she has her country mark removed.

Offline Taffeta

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2019, 12:29:24 AM »
I personally think she's Chinese.

My logic for this is circumstantial but is as follows:

The US release Sundance was made in HK. If the European one was made in HK there would be no need to remove the location from the hoof, thus it clearly isn't HK.

The UK box states clearly, Made in China.

There are a lot of Spanish made NC ponies around at this time, but their cards do say "Made in Spain" or "Made in Valencia, Spain".

The UK did not get any of the above Spanish made NC ponies for which we can confirm provenance. The UK didn't get any ponies made in countries other than HK or CHina, with the only questionable ones being Sundance and some of the Loving Family ponies. It would not be weird for a Spanish Sundance to appear in other countries in Europe where Nirvana ponies were sold as normal, but the UK didn't do this, making it more unlikely.

I am also suspicious about whether all NC family ponies are Spanish as well, but that is a harder one to prove as so many differences exist. But they came much later and some of them do have made in Spain on their cards, too.

NC Sundance I feel probably is not Spanish. And if she is Chinese, there is every reason that her body parts may end up in the same place as those from the variant frankenstein ponies, who are also Chinese as far as I am aware...

There are still way more questions, but I am generally a fan of asking the questions and poking at what we think we know, rather than making assumptions. If you think about it, there are a lot of NC ponies that are not Spanish in origin. Thus far nobody has been able to prove conclusively that Sundance's origins are in Spain. It's just been an assumption because of the other NC ponies from around the same time.

« Last Edit: January 03, 2019, 12:31:50 AM by Taffeta »
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Offline hilamb

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2019, 09:24:37 AM »
Wow, she looks stunning. Congrats.
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Thank you SDS <3

Offline pinkkittywinks

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Re: Princess Sundance
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2019, 01:56:06 PM »
The first one turned up in 2008 :) so I think there are THREE of Princess Sundance now.

http://mlparena.com/archive/Forums/viewtopic/t=141732/postdays=0/postorder=asc/highlight=princess+sundance/start=0.html

Yes, we were awfully sceptical, but really?! have you seen what she looks like? :nuts: She certainly breaks a lot of the rules (and her neck) AND the NC hoof mark as well :P

I have seen WinterBlossom's pony twice or even three times now and I have no doubt she is real and so is this girl.

Taffeta let me guess :wonder: it is 1986-1987 again!  :lmao:

MLPSunSparkle the tail is thin because it is the thin part of a princess tail :biups: Princess tails are made in two parts, a regular thickness plain tail and a thinner tail which is part hair and part tinsel :)

Love pkw xxx