The My Little Pony "Stigma"

[Akemi-chan]

I guess I don't see the big deal? I've only seen this issue come up since g4/bronies came about.

I grew up in the 80s and had a bunch of ponies. My brother even had 2! (baby racer and Tabby if you're curious) I had some he-man figures and ninja turtle, too. While we were perfectly aware which aisles these toys were sold in they were pretty much all played with together.

I collect G1s now bc they are my favorite line (and one only has so much room). Now this whole grown men avidly watching FiM is different and is admittedly odd to even to me. I've watched the show. It's ok. It's not THAT great. I'm frankly surprised how popular it is. I guess I should be happy bc it keeps mlp alive (...but no so thrilled with g4 brushables anyways).

I don't want to start anything I just want to express my opinion from a 80s kid/collector s pov.

You hit the nail on the head madam.  Agree with this from beginning to end.

[Archer]

I'm going to agree a lot with the original post.  I do think that in the past MLP has had a bit of a stigma attached to it. A lot of the refs to MLP i've seen in TV (before G4) were very negative. MLP seemed to be the go to brand when something was overly girly/feminine. One quote that always stays with me, though for the life in me right now i can't remember where from, was a character, upon seeing a pink room said 'it looks like a My Little Pony threw up in here'. Barbie and Bratz get negative attention mostly from the press and that is mostly down to body image. MLP doesn't have that issue given that they are horses, but i do think that there has always been some negativity attached to them.

I was never an overly girly girl. I loved my MLP's but i also loved football and looking through my garden for bugs. Yet the latter counted for very little when as soon as i mentioned i liked MLP as a child i'd be asked 'were you a very girly girl then?' The same response never seemed to occur to people that said they played with barbie as a child.

[CadePony]

I honestly don't see why MLP is viewed in a negative light or have any stigma attached to it. =/

I'm sorry i don't agree. Transformers the movie was amazing!!! 

Ditto! I don't know how many times I have watched that movie while growing up, and I still enjoy watching it!

[Wardah]

There is also an element of society that pushes girls to grow up quickly. (Ya know so they can become sexually available for men) MLP has always been seen not just as a thing for girls but as a thing for very young girls. So it's not just because its "girly" but also because its "babyish".

[mopthebunny]

There is also an element of society that pushes girls to grow up quickly. (Ya know so they can become sexually available for men) MLP has always been seen not just as a thing for girls but as a thing for very young girls. So it's not just because its "girly" but also because its "babyish".

Very true, and I could rant all day about how messed up that is.

[Shimmer Mist]

There is also an element of society that pushes girls to grow up quickly. (Ya know so they can become sexually available for men) MLP has always been seen not just as a thing for girls but as a thing for very young girls. So it's not just because its "girly" but also because its "babyish".

I have to agree with this as well! Although I only think MLP has become synonymous with "little girls" because they aren't exactly toys that particularly have a more "mature" theme to them. I don't mean mature as in something bad or like PG13 or R-Rated or anything just more mature ideals or themes for the toys. Paying attention to fashion, doing your make-up/hair, Brain Surgeon Barbie, where as ponies are usually just simple little horses whose hair you brush. Sure you can style their hair or whatnot but they're still animal toys and I don't think as many people count grooming a unicorn in the same category as styling and dressing Barbie. Ponies are a bit more"innocent" than other girl's toys I suppose since they don't usually have some overarching theme for a doll that can teach traits that could mimic adulthood.

[Leave a Whisper]

From my personal experience, I would say that Barbie and Bratz get a lot more flack than MLP, but that's besides the point.

Without getting into a long-winded rant, I will say this: sexism.  For as long as society sees women in a negative light, people will see so-called 'girly' things like MLP as bad things.

If you ask any boy why they don't like MLP, most of them will say 'because it's for girls!'. Women are also guilty of seeing 'feminine' things as something to be ridiculed.

So, in conclusion, people aren't ridiculing MLP simply because they dislike plastic ponies -- they hate and ridicule the female archetype without understanding what that archetype is, or why they hate it so. 
  When you live in a world where 'girl' is an insult, girls' toys are going to be seen as a bad thing.

You hit the nail right on the head.

[brighteyes]

This is a really interesting discussion point. I found myself thinking back to when I was a child, and the way in which MLP was perceived then. I went to a very small village school where pretty much all the girls (and some of the boys, younger ones) had MLP. I remember the other boys singing the "my little pony skinny and bony" refrain, and I remember MLP being banned by my (evil) head teacher because the boys kept throwing them on the roof (still wondering how that was our fault  )

But, I was not a girly girl. I loathed pink till I became an adult and realised it was no longer a little girl stigma hanging over me. My friends and I, our pony games consisted of zombie worlds and rescuing princesses from monsters...and the boys who threw the ponies on the roof came to regret it because we regrouped, gathered our unicorn ponies and treated them to what we called "pony chase", which consisted of chasing them around the playground and then prodding them with the unicorn ponies. Fizzy was the best for this! We played combination games of My Little Pony/Ghostbusters and My Little Pony/TMNT, as well as countless other weird and wonderful things.

As a kid for me the stigma was Barbie. I hated her with a passion because all the dolls in the stores where I was here in the UK were in sickly pink boxes with pink clothing and all of them without exception were fair skinned, blond haired and vapid looking in terms of expression. As a kid all I wanted was some variety. I hated Megan as well, for the same reasons. What was with blond dolls and pink outfits, anyway? So I never had Megan and Sundance and the one Barbie I did have lost all her accessories to my pony collection.

I don't think of MLP = girly. On the contrary, as a kid, they allowed me to be NOT girly, because they were not the stereotypical dolls. My ponies didn't have teaparties though. They got kidnapped by monsters or abseiled out of the window on ribbons and shoelaces (true story).

This is pretty much my view and experience.  I much preferred MLPs to Barbie as a kid because they were, for me, outside the mold of what was historical and classic for girls to play with.  I didn't want baby dolls and I didn't want to practice being a housewife or bride with Barbie. Suddenly there was a toy and a show that was bold and adventurous.  Megan was my hero!  She did things, she went places and was bold and brave.  My ponies went on adventures, made villages in the tall grass in the empty lot next to our house and fought to protect their world from invaders like GI Joe.  I mixed them with TMNT and let them be mounts and allies of the Turtles as they rode swaths of destruction through their enemies. 

As to the question of why MLP gets flack as a girly thing.  I don't know why.  I think this is really two issues here.  The first is the inherent sexist value system of our society that values "manly" things over "girly" things as many have pointed out.  So many examples of this- "Man up, Grow a pair, you *insert ANYTHING here* like a girl, etc... the list goes on.  The second is the question of whether or not MLP is the brunt of anti-girl hate and if so, why.  I think it depends on the personal experience of whoever you talk to.  For me, MLP wasn't THE quintessential girl toy.  That was Barbie.  I mean, Barbie even has a song about her being a stereotypical girl trapped in a girl world.  But other people may have different experiences and perspectives than me.

[Jordan]

from looking at the toys and the commericials for G1 I think it's how the commericals and toy accessories were marketed. I mean if it were just the ponies by themselves  I can see boys and girls enjoying them, the I'M A MY LITTLE PONY MOMMY! commercials probably didn't help at all.
I mean when you put small horses with a ballet studio or a ballet slipper sweet shop people put 2 and 2 together :/

[Taffeta]

Needless to say, MLP has been the butt of many a cruel joke.  Even Lauren Faust, the supposed Matron Saint of Ponies(...)

And THIS is where all the problems come from, treating Lauren like some almighty deity that changed the word.

Agree with the bolded more than I know how to tactfully express. Unfortunately whenever one pony fan is given more "influence points" than other pony fans, for whatever reason, it warps the general perception of the fandom and the fans. It also creates some highly stupid behaviour. I'm not talking about people on the Arena, because I think the relationship between generation fans on here is pretty mutually respectful, but I'm talking about the mad internet meme pony "fans" whose sole purpose in life seems to be irritating other people. I was a moderator for a few years on an anime-related forum and one of my less pleasant jobs as a mod was removing sexually explicit G4 My Little Pony graphics from the open pages. When stuff like that happens, it's really not hard to understand why people are negative towards MLP as a whole.

Reading through other posts, I really do think this is a G4 problem for the most part. I didn't experience gender-based sexist discrimination as a kid with MLP but what seems to keep coming up is that many of us played with MLP because we weren't girly, which kinda trashes the stereotype for G1 a bit. It's true what Jordan says about the nauseating My Little Pony Mommy jingle, but that lyric doesn't seem to have been used in commercials in the UK, and it was only a section of commercials as far as I remember. MLP was aimed at girls and we can't get away from that fact. It being aimed at girls and it being played with by girls and boys are two different things for me. I really think that if people look on it with hindsight, even critically, it's because MLP was an icon of the 1980s and something people remember.

It also isn't always negatively represented in TV shows. My sister and I used to watch the OC, years ago, in which a Princess Pony has a starring role. If there is a stigma I think it's attached to success rather than anything else - but I do think it's a predominately G4 problem, because MLP has shifted from being a toy (as it was in G1's time) to a toy/collectable/cult icon, and that crosses boundaries.

I have to agree with this as well! Although I only think MLP has become synonymous with "little girls" because they aren't exactly toys that particularly have a more "mature" theme to them. I don't mean mature as in something bad or like PG13 or R-Rated or anything just more mature ideals or themes for the toys. Paying attention to fashion, doing your make-up/hair, Brain Surgeon Barbie, where as ponies are usually just simple little horses whose hair you brush.

I have to respectfully disagree with this in terms of Generation 1 at least. Aside from the horrifying backcard story about getting a date for the Sweet Kisses Ponies in the UK line, I think that MLP covered most every theme Barbie tried to cover, plus some, but with more variety in colour and the whole potential world of "magic" to boost their stories and make them broader characters. I think maybe this got lost a bit in later generations, but the original MLP was successful because it appealed to a kid's imagination.

[Al-1701]

The Faust worship is something that really gets me.  She actually wasn't that big of a fan of the brand when it was making its run.  Her childhood herd ends abruptly with Year 3 because she was 12 by the time Year 4 got going and moving on.  There's nothing wrong with that, and she did have a have soft spot for My Little Pony going forward, but she's not the goddess of pony bronies make her out to be.  She was a standard fan who happened to build a career in animation to be in a position to produce a show.

[Sunset]

MLP has always been seen not just as a thing for girls but as a thing for very young girls. So it's not just because its "girly" but also because its "babyish".

I agree with this.  MLP is lumped in with the stereotypical unicorn that is seen as something that only appeals to young girls.  It's probably even why MLP was marketed to girls to begin with.  On a slightly related note,  have you ever noticed that outside of children's literature, there is so few fantasy books that feature unicorns especially in relation to books featuring dragons?  There's got to be 1 unicorn book to every 20 dragon books at least.

[LadyMoondancer]

Wow, lots of kids had mainly Year 2 - 3 ponies and lost interest in them around 12.  That's no reason to say that she "wasn't that big of a fan". 

The reason people shouldn't take Faust's words as gospel is because there ISN'T a fan grading scale, not because she's somehow a sub-par fan because she didn't collect for 10 years straight.

[Wardah]

Also another point is G3 was much younger skewing than G1, especially the cartoon. Combine that with the idea that cartoons for small kids shouldn't be too scary and not set a bad example makes for MLP to be suddenly lumped in the same category as Disney Princesses. Yeah maybe their biggest dilemma was how to have enough cake for everyone but when you are little it's not like you are concerned about being a future Nobel prize winning President of the United States. But even the parents who don't want their daughters to be sexualized are often pushing them to achieve something like being smart or good at sports.

[Al-1701]

Wow, lots of kids had mainly Year 2 - 3 ponies and lost interest in them around 12.  That's no reason to say that she "wasn't that big of a fan". 

That makes my point she was an average fan, not sub-par but also not the superfan who's word on pony is gospel like bronies make her and her opinions out to be.  Though, even a superfan's word shouldn't be taken as gospel as they're as opinionated (if not more) than anyone.  Actually, don't take anyone's word for gospel.  Go figure out things for yourself.