So, about the whole Hasbro getting rid of ":muffin: Pony" thing...

[Lon-san]

Because someone CHOSE to use Rainbow Dash in that scene and CHOSE to make her that abrasive and CHOSE to give her those lines.  These are not real, flesh-and-blood people who are actually fixing town hall or fighting space bears, they are artificial constructs that Studio B uses as they will for whatever stories they choose to tell.   They made pretty much the worst possible choice in that scene.  Why not use mild-mannered, kindly Fluttershy to interact with Pony?   (Or pretty much any other character besides Dash.)


As I said, major flubs on Studio B's part.

I'm not saying Rainbow Dash is real. :/ What I'm saying is that I'm not hearing a lot of "Dash was so MEAN to her!" The studio made the character do what she did but it sounds like some folks have more of an issue with Pony being made clumsy and "disabled" then Rainbow Dash being cranky to a clumsy and "disabled" character. I agree Fluttershy would have been a much gentler choice but it didn't get made that way.

[josiekat]

"TBH though, the reactions on eqd sort of make me hope she is taken out just to spite them. I hate how so many people still don't get that this is a show for children, not adults and Hasbro/studio B don't owe them anything! I'm finding it all a bit tiresome now, it may be time to step away from the FiM fandom. :/"

LOL! This made me laugh out loud at work.

Anyway....my opinion is much like Hathorcat's: I'm about the toys first. I don't really care about the show. I don't care about crazy people who think the show is for them....rather than for kids. I will say that the clip in question made me really like RD's personality. I have an opinion about Pony, but I'll keep it to myself.

[RAMChYLD]

8. It's a cartoon show...if you want your kids to learn morality, patience, acceptance then I'm sorry that is the job of the parents and not anyone else (yes I have kids one toddler and one teenager) We cannot hold the show accountable for these things.

I'm sorry, but I cannot agree to this fully. While I do agree that parents should teach their kids the values, you must also understand that kids tend to emulate what they see on TV if left unchecked, and apparently a lot of them don't understand the "don't try this at home" part. How many of you actually sit and watch a show with your children and tell them what the character is doing is wrong?

I've seen epic failures happen too many times back in my school days- some bully thinks he's above all and tries to pull off a pro-wrestling maneuver he saw on TV on an unsuspecting victim, only to get both him and the victim hurt badly.

As for Hasbro getting rid of Pony- any word that this is official? Hasbro seems to be nuts lately- Ditzy can retain her name, RD could've just been dissing her with Pony as a taunt. There's no need to pull the episode, unless Pony happens to be a strong negative taunt and parents have complained. Idk, I've never heard anyone being called Pony before over here.

[Cool.Breeze]

As far as how Pony was treated, the big reason for that is that she was with Dash. Rainbow Dash isn't The Element of Patience. If somebody is clumsy, she's going to get cranky with them. But I don't see a whole lot of blaming Dash for her behavoir.

I was saying something along these lines to Streaks last night. I had no issues with Pony what-so-ever, but I do see how RD's crass treatment could cause some concern for parents. I think people are getting riled up over the wrong thing, having a klutzy character in a cartoon is not the problem here :B

[Dragonflitter]

The orgin of the word doesn't matter, it's how people have used it since. For example, 'gay' used to mean 'happy' or 'joyful'. It doesn't anymore.

100% agreement. Words change all the time. The original way it was being used doesn't mean as much as how it's being used in the context of this situation.

I've seen a few people in this thread say the word 'derp' is fine, it's just like using the word 'duh.' Well when I was growing up 'duh' was a serious insult, it was used to make fun of and imitate mentally handicapped people. (The sound imitates the way they may struggle to talk.) If I said 'duh' in my house I got a serious talking to.

My point is, regardless of how the original bronies meant it to mean when they gave her the name ':muffin: Pony Hooves', the scene portraying Rainbow Dash and that pony could have been done a lot better, I think.

[Sora]

Everyone needs to put their big girl/boy undies on here..  I am sorry but i do NOT find a thing about Pony or her name offensive.  its bratty fans and over protective parents that are going to ruin the show.      i hate all this PC nonsense.   if your offended , then go be offended somewhere else because myself and many others enjoy the show. if parents are so worried about the offensiveness of the cartoon then how about you turn the tv off?  it only takes the click of a button and a little supervision      

 It's GREAT the way it is and i love that the animators listen to the fans, not just the "target demographic"   because as an animation student and a fan of animation, i hate the stereotype of cartoons having to be for kids, and yes this one was intended to be but something happened and a fanbase was created.. deal with it people. lol they arent going anywhere everyone needs to stop fighting over a cartoon, i mean really?     
for a show like this to gather such a cult following of adults well... thats  a beautiful thing and doesnt happen often, let alone have shoutouts to the fans all the time.   

This, really.

Even when I do find programs on TV that offend me, I never file a complaint. Why?
Because there's always going to be more one person who finds something offensive. Who am I to spoil the enjoyment of so many? I just switch the channel to something else.

I personally found nothing wrong with Pony, and I am disabled. When I first saw her, she made me smile. Dash is hurtful in that way to most - Even Fluttershy, so I don't know what the problem is?

Anyhow, that's just my opinion on the matter. I love the toys more, but I do still think that, if this is true, it's gone just a tad too far.

[Lancer]

I don't think anyone's asking for FiM to be all about sunshine and roses.  But, however some people might like to look at the Pony scene through rose-tinted glasses, I can definitely see why people were offended by it.  My jaw dropped when I saw it, just to think that Hasbro would actually allow that into a MLP show.  And no, it's nothing to do with poor little Pony and "let's write out the disabled and pretend they don't exist".  My problem was with RD's treatment of her and the way she was portrayed as, "Ha ha!  Look!  Clumsy, stupid pony!  Let's laugh at her!"  Honestly, her sole purpose in the show was for comic relief...and that's just wrong.  I'd be happy to see her appear in future episodes, but it would be nice to see her with more positive personality traits alongside her clumsiness.

As for the word Pony, it may not have originated as a slur against the mentally disabled but, as I believe someone else already mentioned in this thread, "gay" didn't have the same meaning a few decades ago.  Does that mean Hasbro should name a happy little pony, "Gay Sunshine", and throw in a few stereotypical homosexual slurs for laughs.  I think not.

Imagine yourself as a MLP-loving child for a minute - a MLP-loving child with strabismus.  At school, you are bullied and called a "derp".  You come home to relax and watch MLP and hey presto, there's your favourite character, Rainbow Dash, shouting at a pony with eyes like yours, and calling her by the same term that you hear as a slur against you on a daily basis.  Not only that, but the pony is portrayed as being ridiculously clumsy and unable to even notice what she's doing wrong.  Now can you see why that child or her parents would be offended?  Put it the other way, the child who bullies this poor little kid sees the cartoon and has it reinforced that it is okay to call someone who looks that way, " Pony".  No, it shouldn't happen.  Yes, the parents should be supervising these kids.  But unfortunately, that's not always the case.

My own sister was born with a lazy eye and was bullied at school for it.  Thankfully, with the use of eye patches, hers was sorted out by the time she was nine or ten and the bullying stopped before high school.  She still has some visual problems with that eye, but it's not physically noticeable anymore.  This was all long before the word "derp" was invented, but I know Mum would have gone wild if a character with her problem was depicted in a kids' show and named by one of the offensive terms used towards my sister.

To be honest, I am sick of Hasbro pandering to the bronies just because they're loud and boistrous.  The more they do for them, the more they whine it's not good enough.  And the loud, annoying "include this offensive character OR ELSE" bronies are exactly the type of people who AREN'T supporting Hasbro in any way and are merely watching the show illegally on Youtube.  So I'm not sure what they gain from it.  As for, "Yes, it started off as a kids' show, but now there are these adults making ridiculous demands - how nice that Hasbro are listening!", no.  Just no.  If they want to make it an adult show, start airing it in the evenings.  While it continues to air on a saturday morning, it is and will always be primarily a kids' show.  Let the adults enjoy it for what it is, they don't need constant nods towards their fanon characters.

People are writing hateful comments to Hasbro regarding Pony and how she should be kept as she is a wonderful character with lots of positive traits.  But I think they're mixing up canon with their own fanfiction. I have yet to see any of those positive traits in FiM.  Give us loving mother Pony Hooves who has a normal life and doesn't only appear to be criticised by the other ponies and give the viewers a laugh.  Isn't THAT what most of the fanfiction writers wanted?

And finally, yes, it is quite possible that Tabitha St.Germain didn't see a picture of Pony before she voiced her.  Pony is, after all, just an additional character and, in Vancouver at least, additional characters are usually cast on the spot - whichever actor who is already in the studio can do the best voice will get the part, often not knowing any more about the character than a brief one line description or the lines they have to say.  This isn't Disney.  It's just a regular cartoon recorded in an afternoon's work.

That being said, I do wonder if Tabitha knew the character was female - I never picked up that the voice was "a boy's voice", just a typical slightly slow deep female voice.  It's pretty similar to another voice I've heard Tabitha do in a different cartoon.  She might have just used the "I thought it was a boy" excuse to get all the mindless bronies sending her hate mail because (*GASP*) she didn't sound like the amateur voice actress on Youtube who'd made a video of herself as Pony Hooves.

I'm also sure Tabitha didn't mean to brush anyone off or offend them.  I've seen the reply she sent to someone who was offended by the character which was posted on LJ, but I really don't think she meant for it to come across the way those people made out she did.  I used to write to her and she is one of the sweetest people I've ever known, patiently answering my questions and encouraging me to work towards my goal.  She does write in that long-winded way, but I think she was trying to be kind to that woman (man?) - the way I read it, her "even you" comment was not aimed as a slur against the "intellectually disabled person" but at this person (and many others) sending her unpleasant emails.

Not to defend someone I haven't even spoken to for a while, but I thought that should be out there.  As someone who has endured the sharp end of the more immature bronies' tongues via hate mail for months on end, I know how easy it is to get to the end of your tether and snap back.  Should she have written snappy e-mails?  No.  But she's human, just trying to make a living and get on with her job, and suddenly she gets a bunch of nasty e-mails about something she knows very little about.  She's never been one to do the anime conventions and mix with the fans, I can imagine this is driving her out of her mind.

A long post, but that's all my thoughts on this matter.  I realise some of my opinions are unpopular ones.  Hate me if you like.  I'm more than happy to agree to disagree.

[SuniMoon]

After wandering into the arena in the morning, still half asleep, I gotta say...... Woah man, what was I thinking last night even making this thread? Should have let the s***storm die with The Last Roundup thread.

Cause boy, this looks just like that thread.
Hating on the bronies, even though we're all adults who collect childrens playthings? No, no, let me rephrase that.... All adults who collect childrens playthings, play with their hair, rearrange them in our house, take them out with us some days... 

I do FULLY agree that some bronies are self entitled little morons, but every fanbase has a portion that tarnishes it. And if we act like the problem is the show not focusing on little girls... ... ... No. Just no. The show was good because it wasn't tea parties, and clothing, and other brainrot. The show was good because it didn't insult the intelligence of the children watching, or the parents watching it with them.

Now, the Pony issue? Perhaps they did take it too far, by giving the fun background pony a cameo... But honestly? It's not that big of an issue. Derp is NOT a jab at the mentally disabled. I don't know where you people got that... You guys on Livejournal or something? Cause LJ's the only place where I ever see that much weird PC stuff.

Okay, so, I will agree that they took her voice a bit too far.... But fun fact... Tabitha Germain thought she was voicing a boy pony when she recorded for Pony.

So, I suppose there are people who didn't correct this, and thought it sounded just fine... But that doesn't mean they were aiming to make Pony a special needs pony.

And I don't see the issue with the clumsiness. At all. At aaaaalll.


Anyway, this whole thing's just turned into a parental storm, and I sometimes wonder if parents forget what they watched when they were kids... Cause.... Uhh.... Most people here grew up in the 80's and 90's.... We had a lot of content in our childhood media that wouldn't fly today.

You can't raise a child in a bubble. It's My Little Pony, guys. My Little Pony. The only legitimate reason you could have for banning it from your house is if you use it as a babysitter, and never talk to your kids about it. Television should never be a babysitter or a role model. And you can't blame legitimately blame it for anything. You only have yourself to blame.

But ehh..... I'm kind of wondering if someone could just lock this thread, and let it sink off the front page... The arguments over this are absurd.



Cause you know? I didn't start this over the Pony controversy... I started this because it could mean WORSE things in the future. If it is true about the welovefine thing, and not just them trying to sell more shirts.... Then Hasbro is cracking down.

If Hasbro is cracking down, what could they want to crack down on in the future? Guys? There's a lot of fan created pony related things floating around that Hasbro would never want to be associated with.

I just think it could possibly lead to worse things... Cause Pony getting a name change, and a voice change in future episodes? I have NO problem with it.

It's the possible downhill slide that is worrisome.

Anyway, like I said... maybe someone can lock this? 


(2 posts since I started typing this.... Hmm, lets see.... meaning of the word changing... yeup... yeeeeeup.... No, really, guys, when did the meaning of derp change to "retarded"? Because I hadn't noticed, and I spend a lot of time online. .__. And I've only ever seen people say that HERE.)
 

Post Merge: February 03, 2012, 12:24:31 PM

On another note, my best friend has strabismus... and loves that Pony even exists.....

:/

[Bellevi]

I think the biggest mistake was naming her after a meme. It's such an un-ponylike name.

Companies should always maintain a safe distance from the fan community while still acknowledging them. It never should have crossed over into the show because I feel like it made some fans feel more entitled: and they're not entitled to anything when it comes to FiM. Acknowledging smaller fangroups, like Hasbro's decision to start making official MLP Fair ponies, is a very special treat, but they didn't have to do that.

But, like a few others have said, the toys are my priority and it won't affect me much if they change the character's name.

[saply]

Man, Pony was so much more fun when she was just a cuter version of Where's Waldo. Giving her a speaking role is jumping the shark.

[juliepinetree]

I will go with your original thoughts:  I hope that this dose not cause problems with Hasbro and the adults who like the show.  I mean, there is a lot of stuff out there not done by Hasbro, and if they really wanted to, they could put a stop to it.  We could have no adult shirts, bags, ect....  I would like to think that as we all know that Hasbro looks in on what we say here and I am sure in other places that we would all act with dignity. Remember the Golden Rule that we were taught.  We should be careful of what we say even if it is on the internet where no one will see our faces.  We should complain in a sensible manner, not be bent out of shape.  That's a good way to keep everything from blowing up.  And  to really make people think:  We are arguing and fighting over a child's cartoon, while somewhere in the world a child dies of hunger.  All seems kinda pointless....

[Snapdragon]

Tarring all bronies with the same brush and feeling superior are things people should watch out for.  When you're into CHILDREN'S CARTOONS and collecting piles of of CHILDREN'S TOYS, there isn't a lot of room to be snotty. People outside the fandom think YOU are ridiculous as well.

I know this wasn't intended to be so, but I'm actually taking this as a point against Bronies. Mind, I am involved in Brony communities, and they have generally seen 'us' (the older fandom) as 'weird old ladies collecting hundreds of toys in their house filled with cats.' As far as I know, there wasn't a significant Brony-backlash in any of the older communities until the Brony community started to go south. I know that I, personally, try to be welcoming to Bronies whenever they come here, because they belong just as much as we do - but I'm not as Brony-positive as I used to be, either. (Meaning, I'm welcoming to Bronies in a one-on-one basis, but I have some doubts about the community as a whole/some of the more vocal members.) In their minds, they are 'cool' and 'not like us' because they are fans of the cartoon only - so I'd say that this whole Pony issue is only showing more of their poor attitudes towards people who are not exactly like them.

I did notice trolls capitalizing on this and saying Pony is a anti metal health issue name
...... thwy equated it to calling someone an rtard.. i thibk thats where the faracas came from....... sadly in this instance i think the trolls won ;_;

I don't know how people on other forums reacted, but a lot of people here have said that too, myself included, and we're not trolls. Her name IS derived from and insult towards people with disabilities, and even if that wasn't intentionally meant as in insult in naming her that, that doesn't make the history of the term " Pony" go away. So people have a right to be offended by it and by others' insistence that they need to get over it. Frankly, I think Hasbro could/should have avoided this all by not using a fan-name officially to begin with like every other fan-named character, but I suspect it was done by the studio without the larger company realizing it.

no im sorry. You're wrong... as someone who knows the origin of the memebecause i was aroundthe site it came from you are wrong... you arent a troll but you sure have been duped by them.

Actually, I've spoken with a lot of the first people who wrote the complaint letters, and even the fan who wrote the petition, and none of them are trolls. They are all big fans of the show, and they're upset by Pony's portrayal not because they hate her, but because they love her. Similarly, I signed the petition, and I'm not a troll... unless I'm an extremely convincing one who joined the fandom in its earliest days PRECISELY to troll it! So I'm either a normal person... OR THE BIGGEST, MOST INTELLIGENT TROLL WHO EVER LIVED? >:}a

[pop-girl]

And on that note... let's end this.